Galway v Kilkenny

[bottlethrower7]

Definition of cynical is fouling consistently especially when a player has the beating of you. Like giving away a free for a point instead of the forward getting away for a goal.

so its only when a player fouls one player? The player who has the beating of him? But not fouls all 'round him? So that means being cynical and being dirty are 2 different things? Would that not make them mutually exclusive? Like you can be one or the other but not both?

I just need to get my head around this definition of 'cynical'. Its important.

Thanks.

Walsh will be remembered as one of the all time greats. Despite how good this Kilkenny team are, how many will be remembered up there with the likes of Keher, Lory Meagher, etc? Only a couple. And Tommy Walsh is among that couple.

[Sylvie]

[/quote]
Good stuff Bud. People are way over the top when it comes to Kilkenny. Kilkenny are the furthest thing from a dirty team. They have one or 2 players who go out in every game who are not afraid to push the rules to their limit, and even occasionally cross the line, but maybe others should be taking a leaf out of this book instead of whingeing about it. The reaction to everything Tommy Walsh did on saturday from the Galway crowd around me was a joke. Walsh got what he deserved. Yellow. If he deserved more, he'd have gotten it. It wasn't a pull across Hayes. It was a slap. Yes, he made contact but what he did was very different from a lad who winds up and then hits a lad. Very different.
[/quote]

I agree that KK are not a dirty team but what Walsh did to Hayes on Sat evening was bad and he should have got a straight red for that...the worst thing any one can do to you in hurling is pull down on the hand deliberately ....the next foul deserved a yellow too, clumsy and late

[GalwayBayBoy]

I have nothing against Kilkenny or Tommy Walsh for that matter but he certainly deserved the line yesterday and he sails close to the wind so often he should be taking part in the Volvo ocean race. His talent as a player certainly isn't in question but his antics on the hurling field have soured a lot of non-Kilkenny people towards him and I don't think he'll be remembered very fondly once he retires from the game. Now this probably won't matter a jot to him as he'll have his All-Ireland's won and Kilkenny people will back him up no matter what but for a player as good as he is I don't think he has to resort to some of the things he does.

[GaillimhIarthair]

I didn't see the Murray incident clearly, but I was delighted. I was standing by a load of his clubmen, and the abuse they were doling out at Kilkenny was way over the top. Murray getting the line after 3 seconds fairly shut them up.

[/quote]
Murray got what he deserved.  An act as spineless as it was stupid.  He should know better at this stage of his career and to be honest I personally would think long and hard before handing him a maroon jersey again.

Tommy Walsh is an outstanding hurler and any county would love to have him in their side BUT he should have walked on Sat eve.  He knew exactly what he was at when he gave hayes (who had the ball in his hand) a slap of the hurl on the hand.  It was dirty and cynical.  The "tackle" a few mins later was also cynical and also deserved a yellow.

Saying all that, KK well deserved their victory and showed why they are such an outstanding team.  We seem to have improved but we need to bring the same intensity to Ennis in a few weeks time or else last Sat will be shown up to be nothing more than a "flash in the pan", and we have had too many of them over the past few years.

[awfulynice]

Definition of cynical is fouling consistently especially when a player has the beating of you. Like giving away a free for a point instead of the forward getting away for a goal.

so its only when a player fouls one player? The player who has the beating of him? But not fouls all 'round him? So that means being cynical and being dirty are 2 different things? Would that not make them mutually exclusive? Like you can be one or the other but not both?

I just need to get my head around this definition of 'cynical'. Its important.

Thanks.

Walsh will be remembered as one of the all time greats. Despite how good this Kilkenny team are, how many will be remembered up there with the likes of Keher, Lory Meagher, etc? Only a couple. And Tommy Walsh is among that couple.

As far as my interpetation goes.."cynical" fouling is fouling the player with no intent on getting the ball aka tommy walshs second foul

"persistant" fouling is fouling the same player that has the beating of you...and generally these two go hand in hand...or at least thats my interpetation of them anyway

[SLIGONIAN]

Definition of cynical is fouling consistently especially when a player has the beating of you. Like giving away a free for a point instead of the forward getting away for a goal.

so its only when a player fouls one player? The player who has the beating of him? But not fouls all 'round him? So that means being cynical and being dirty are 2 different things? Would that not make them mutually exclusive? Like you can be one or the other but not both?

I just need to get my head around this definition of 'cynical'. Its important.

Thanks.

Walsh will be remembered as one of the all time greats. Despite how good this Kilkenny team are, how many will be remembered up there with the likes of Keher, Lory Meagher, etc? Only a couple. And Tommy Walsh is among that couple.

Cynical to me is different to dirty, dangerous play is dirty to me (wild swing of hurley, not caring for opponents safety, wreckless etc...), cynical is fouling when knowing well what your at stopping a opponent when you have no chance of getting sliotar. Maybe hes more cynical than anything else when I think about, ya ignore the dirty comment, hes cynical IMO.

He is one of the greats of the game no doubt, i agree, i love watching him 90% of time but he pisses me off and I just wish he didnt have that part of his game.

[INDIANA]

Definition of cynical is fouling consistently especially when a player has the beating of you. Like giving away a free for a point instead of the forward getting away for a goal.

so its only when a player fouls one player? The player who has the beating of him? But not fouls all 'round him? So that means being cynical and being dirty are 2 different things? Would that not make them mutually exclusive? Like you can be one or the other but not both?

I just need to get my head around this definition of 'cynical'. Its important.

Thanks.

Walsh will be remembered as one of the all time greats. Despite how good this Kilkenny team are, how many will be remembered up there with the likes of Keher, Lory Meagher, etc? Only a couple. And Tommy Walsh is among that couple.

In your opinion he will be. But i'll be touting the likes of Joe Canning, Noel Mc grath and Henry in a different league to Tommy Walsh. Galway showed the template how to deal with Walsh in 2005 by putting Iarla Tannian on him. More is the pity Tannian wasn't available On Saturday because he'd have put manners on Walsh. One day soon Walsh will hit the wrong player. What goes around comes around.

[bottlethrower7]

In your opinion he will be. But i'll be touting the likes of Joe Canning, Noel Mc grath and Henry in a different league to Tommy Walsh.

Forwards?

[Stay goalside of your man]

Cynical is what the Kilkenny forwards where doing on Saturday evening, deliberately fouling the man in order to stop the back giving a long relieving clearance up the field.

Dirty is trying to injure a player.

[INDIANA]

I'd have JJ ahead of him personally. Peerless as a wing back. I admire Walsh's skills but not the rest of his game.

[INDIANA]

Cynical is what the Kilkenny forwards where doing on Saturday evening, deliberately fouling the man in order to stop the back giving a long relieving clearance up the field.

Dirty is trying to injure a player.

so chopping on someone's hand nowhere near the ball isn't dirty play?

[Stay goalside of your man]

Cynical is what the Kilkenny forwards where doing on Saturday evening, deliberately fouling the man in order to stop the back giving a long relieving clearance up the field.

Dirty is trying to injure a player.

so chopping on someone's hand nowhere near the ball isn't dirty play?

Of course it was dirty play. If you took the time to read my post I was on about the Kilkenny forwards stopping the Galway backs from been able to give long relieving clearances.

[An Fhairche Abu]

Plenty of lively debate here on Tommy Walsh! I thought that the contentious foul was worth a 2nd yellow, to me it looked as if Kelly was going for the book then saw that it was a man he was only after booking two minutes ago and gave him a finger wagging instead. Walsh took a chance that he wouldn't get the 2nd yellow and prevented a goal, I don't think that any of this detracts from what is a phenomenal hurler, if he can get away with it all the better for Kilkenny, being able to know when to tactically or cynical foul for the betterment of the team is a skill in itself now in both codes. I'd have only been delighted if a Galway back had "took one for the team" and done the same to Shefflin about 5 seconds before Kilkenny get their 1st goal.

When Healy got the point to put 5 in it I though we had another 2005 style ambush on our hands but the response from Kilkenny was typical of them, unerring accuracy for ten points in a row and total belief that they would come through.

The two Cannings, Joyce (for the first 20 minutes before Fogarty came well into it, after that less so) and Donnellan were the pick for Galway, I thought some of the other players didn't play as well as they can but they were probably limited by the quality of the opposition in fairness.

The sideline made a major mistake in putting on Tierney; Kilkenny got 3 points as a direct result of fumbles/mistakes by him. As for Tierney's replacement, Murray can have no complaints with his red card, lunacy to let down a panel of 30 players like that, although I don't think it had a major impact on the result as I feel it was gone from Galway at the time he came on anyway. The puckout strategy in the 2nd half should have changed as soon as Kilkenny got their second score from a Galway mistake with this, 2 more soft scores would come as result of persisting with this tactic.

The bare facts are that Kilkenny were missing 3 huge players in Hickey, Hogan and Fitzpatrick. A major effort from Galway but we were still a good bit off them when it really mattered, going 20 minutes without scoring in the 2nd half is going to leave an uphill battle to win any match much less against one of the finest hurling teams ever to play. If Galway can get the heads right for what will be a big test down in Ennis then there's plenty to work on, there was some bad wides and aimless ball played by Galway at times on Saturday. The intensity which they brought especially at the start of both halves needs to be replicated in every match from now until whenever we bow out, if the team hurls with that application in every game then no supporter can complain.

I thought the atmosphere in O'Connor Park was good on Saturday night, it makes a big difference when a ground is nearly full for a match and for all the bleating from some prior to the game about the location, the game didn't sell out and if it was on as a double header in a half empty Croke Park with Dublin/Offaly it would have been half the atmosphere.

Before any major hurling aficionados shoot me down on any of this that's just the opinion of a man from the football end of Galway county, maybe it shows.

[orangeman]

Would Noel Hickey have handled Joe any better on Saturday evening. In saying that I thought JJ did ok.

[milltown row]

on the Walsh incident. if he booked him for the slap in the hand then he should have been sent off for bringing down the attacker.

the first yellow card is for striking an opponent in the hand. if he was going for the ball then every hurler in the land would be striking people on the hand cause they have the ball. so yellow card, and not harsh IMO the other one is another yellow card. if you haul someone to the ground in football or hurling its a yellow card.

if Barry didn't send him off cause it was so soon after the first yellow card then he has made a mistake.

i referee and play the game. so I'm well versed in the rules. (as a player though i constantly break them) there was loads of early pulling in the game and while Murray's was bad I've seen others getting a yellow.

Difficulty in refereeing (from my view) is that you have to be consistent if your the type who blows early for over carrying then you must do it for both teams throughout the game, if you blow for soft challenge then you have to do it the whole game for both teams, same as for players slabbering, ya have to dish out the same warnings.

My point being, there was some tackles being aloud and others not