Pundits & reporters with terrible Irish

[Canalman]

Don't have a problem with Coman's Irish as imo it is a legitimate "canúint".......ie Dublin Irish....learnt and spoken as a 2nd language more than likely in a Gaelscoil and heavily influenced by English. Irish language snobbery exists most definitely with the Kerry and Connemara native speakers the biggest culprits imo.

Really have difficulties with Bernard Fllynn's command of the English language though. Sentence making seems to elude him.

[dodo]

Interesting point made from a few posters about the perceived snobbery from native speakers. This is a valid point at times no doubt but there are many issues to take on board when assessing the reason for this. Irish is a live language in gaeltacht areas and as such not every member of these areas is compelled to act as múinteoir or sponsor to individuals. Because of the relatively few gaeltacht areas there can at times be a high concentration of people about seeking to speak to locals, can wear thin at times (like the tourists looking in your front windows smiling, do you smile back at them ??).

A personal bug bear of mine is the 'I'd love to be able to speak Irish but it wasn't taught properly', or, 'I was put off by the gaeilgeoirí with their snobby attitude'. 14 years in school and it's all the teacher's fault that when asked 'cén chaoi a bhfuil tú?' students reply 'sea'.  

Irish for many generations was discouraged by parents so that when they took to leaving home and emigrating, as was the norm, at least they had a good grasp of English. Many the story I've heard about people getting slagged and worse about being gaeilgeoirí. It takes more than a few smiling trainee teachers to change the habit of generations.

[Gnevin]

2) Stevie Joyce, Aodán Ó Sé, Seán Óg de Paor, Seán Ó Domhnall, Kevin Cassidy, Paul Galvin, Eamonn Fitzmaurice, Dara, Tomás, Marc Ó Sé, Mick Mellett, Niall McLoughlin and many mny more County and former county footballers with decent Irish should be employed more often. They seem to have better hurling pundits yet there is no hurling stronghold in any Gaeltacht

Maybe their are all shit pundits . Decent Irish is not only requirement.

[IolarCoisCuain]

Bean Pháidín isn't talking about standards of punditry. (S)he is talking about about basic standards of communication. There's a difference.

There's been some discussion here about people making efforts and shouldn't be picked on because of that. But if you're getting paid to do a professional job the reason behind that is because you've already made the effort and succeeded. Bean P's contention is that these buckeens haven't succeeded, and their Irish remains poor.

One of the - many - problems I had as a learner of Irish was that I never knew what was correct and wasn't. Having someone on TV like Coman Goggins mangling the language doesn't help learners. It only confuses them further. Someone made the point earlier than Bean P's list of good speakers were all native speakers. Fair enough - in that case I would nominate Pat Fleury or Dónal O'Grady as fellas who are not native speakers but who make a better fist of it than poor Coman. Your man Duffy I haven't heard but there are a few lads there who would be on the light side alright as regards fluirseachas.

Listening to sports commentary is a great way to learn Irish because the vocabulary is so very limited - you hear the same phrases over and over and you can pick them up. Mícheál Ó Sé is superb for the learner, because he tones down his Irish when he's doing the minor games on TV. He uses a much richer vocabulary on the radio - to my ear anyway - because he knows he's broadcasting to an audience with better Irish.

If anyone is planning a stab at the Gaeilge - hello Myles  - you could do a lot worse than to invest in Seán Óg de Paor's autobiography, "Lá an Phaoraigh," and a dictionary and get stuck into them. You'd be surprised the progress you'd have made after an hundred pages. And besides - with the recession and the weather, it's a good way of not spending money you don't have anymore.

[Pangurban]

I am sure Bean Phadian means well, but he reflects the type of elitism which has held back the development of the language, and quite frankly turned people off learning. Instead of applauding people for using what little they have, he looks down his Nose and sneers. Its clear he is not an educator, or a person with any interest in promoting the language. He may know a little more than the people he assumes the right to critisize, but there are people who know a lot more than him. Would he like them to treat him in the same manner. I would suggest that he learns to carry his learning lightly, and with a little more humility.

[ardmhachaabu]

Unfortunately there are all too many people like BP involved in the language these days.  I have a fair degree of fluency which I am proud of.  Some people frown on me though for not being so "committed" as them, I just have better things to do with my life than to dedicate to a language...

[BeanPháidín]

With regards to my being a 'snob' I think you'll find I did admit that Iwas highly excited when he got the job 5 years ago. It's a paid job in a public service provider, as a tax payer I would like to see some improvement just as I would in a politician, road infrastructure, Education, health service etc.

5 years later am I really a snob for pointing this out?

[dodo]

I am sure Bean Phadian means well, but he reflects the type of elitism which has held back the development of the language, and quite frankly turned people off learning. Instead of applauding people for using what little they have, he looks down his Nose and sneers. Its clear he is not an educator, or a person with any interest in promoting the language. He may know a little more than the people he assumes the right to critisize, but there are people who know a lot more than him. Would he like them to treat him in the same manner. I would suggest that he learns to carry his learning lightly, and with a little more humility.

That's a fair jump from Bean Phaidin saying that some contributors to GAA programmes in Irish are talking nonsense. Is it elitist to expect a commentator/analyst to be able to express himself in the language that the programme is presented in ? Gaeilge liofa lofa is a phrase that is used to express the preference of non-perfect Irish to no Irish at all, this would be agreed I assume by the majority and rightly so. This gaeilge liofa lofa is in my opinion not acceptable on public broadcasting stations from main contributors. Interviews afterwards is another story altogether.

[PadraicHenryPearse]

Coilín would be fairly well got around here so tread carefully!

Ca Bhfuil Coilín?

[thebandit]

Is as ar gcontaé an banríon é

[Malone Aristocrat]

This is a complete nonsense. the real crime here is the fact that so much of the coverage of the quality aspects of our games are given over to be covered in a minority language, which the vast majority of the population and the GAA's target audience cannot understand nor engage with. i want to watch the club championships and national league with the modest comfort of understanding the commentary.

imagine the FA cup being given exclusively to a welsh speaking station in the uk?

[Denn Forever]

Are we talking about commentating on the game or analysis before, during and after the game?  

I was only aware of Coman Goggins talking doing the analysis not commentating.  If he providing the commentary then he should have very good Irish and be improving if he is not up to speed.

I'm confused.  BP was talking about Goggins bad Irish and Dodo is saying that it is acceptable for analysis e.g. Gaelige Liofa Liofa.  BP please clarify.  Liofa, what does it mean?  Is it talking the softly softly approach as in Moladh na oige or whatever the phrase is.

And MA, is the promotion of Irish not one of the Aims of the GAA?

[Fear ón Srath Bán]

imagine the FA cup being given exclusively to a welsh speaking station in the uk?

There goes a coach and horses through the logic of your argument: Welsh is restricted to a specific minority area of Britain, Irish is all-Ireland (however sparsely spoken in certain areas), and moreover, the FA Cup does not apply to Welsh teams!

TG4 is a channel for the accommodation and promotion of the native tongue, and there is absolutely no reason at all why it should suspend that ethos so that people like you will not be offended. Perhaps you should be thankful that they're showing it all.

[Malone Aristocrat]

Are we talking about commentating on the game or analysis before, during and after the game?  

I was only aware of Coman Goggins talking doing the analysis not commentating.  If he providing the commentary then he should have very good Irish and be improving if he is not up to speed.

I'm confused.  BP was talking about Goggins bad Irish and Dodo is saying that it is acceptable for analysis e.g. Gaelige Liofa Liofa.  BP please clarify.  Liofa, what does it mean?  Is it talking the softly softly approach as in Moladh na oige or whatever the phrase is.

And MA, is the promotion of Irish not one of the Aims of the GAA?

Should this aim take precedence over the promotion of our games and the capacity of people to access coverage of possibly the most imporant competitions we have?

[orangeman]

imagine the FA cup being given exclusively to a welsh speaking station in the uk?

There goes a coach and horses through the logic of your argument: Welsh is restricted to a specific minority area of Britain, Irish is all-Ireland (however sparsely spoken in certain areas), and moreover, the FA Cup does not apply to Welsh teams!

TG4 is a channel for the accommodation and promotion of the native tongue, and there is absolutely no reason at all why it should suspend that ethos so that people like you will not be offended. Perhaps you should be thankful that they're showing it all.

Exactly - you should be grateful that its on at all.