McCarthy admits he does not have backing of Cork hurlers

[RedandGreenSniper]

I'm curious about this line being spouted that Murphy can't be sacked. Reillers has said its gospel but I sincerely doubt it. Perhaps the players don't care if, as some of the pro players posters would say 'the county board don't look out for the best interests of Cork GAA' so long as it doesn't impinge on the senior hurlers. So selfish and not altruistic motives after all. That's my reading of it. Its a holy mess and I'm beginning to think that Cork GAA should be sanctioned for the harm they've brought the GAA through in recent months.

[Reillers]

I'm curious about this line being spouted that Murphy can't be sacked. Reillers has said its gospel but I sincerely doubt it. Perhaps the players don't care if, as some of the pro players posters would say 'the county board don't look out for the best interests of Cork GAA' so long as it doesn't impinge on the senior hurlers. So selfish and not altruistic motives after all. That's my reading of it. Its a holy mess and I'm beginning to think that Cork GAA should be sanctioned for the harm they've brought the GAA through in recent months.

He can't. It's in his contract, which he wrote himself 30 years ago.

[bingobus]

reinforces my opinion that there needs to be a clear out down there, at County Board level, at least.

Can only agree with that but with the nature of GAA politics especially in Cork makes this seem seriously unlikely.

Can I ask the supporters and opponents of the Cork players a couple of questions, and help me tease this out. Im trying to look at this impartially and see where a possible solution could be found.

Do they believe the Cork hurlers are acting in what they believe to be in the best interests of Cork hurling? Yes, 100% so.
Do they believe Gerald McCarthy is acting in what he believes are in the best interests of Cork hurling? In his oppinion yes, but he's not a good manager, I think in some way he knows that but stays on because his pride is wounded.l

If the answer is yes to both then its fair to say the county board is the problem. There is very little prospect of serious change there I would imagine, lets says there wont be change for arguments sake. Unfortunately the Cork County Board seems to be the only constant permanent fixture in this debacle and will continue to be for some while? Sadly I agree. Permanent fixture, Murphy is the longest serving CB chariman in the country. An immovable force.

So, how do Gerald McCarthy and the Cork hurlers sort it out? Which is the lesser of two possible evils?

a) Does McCarthy resign?  Is that in the best interests of Cork hurling and what will be the consequences? (short and long term)
The players do what the one thing they can do that has any affect..refuse to play, but it's not working this time because this is exactly what the board wants, they know that they are binded by arbitrition and that they wont break it, meaning they know full well that they can't and wont strike and instead they'll walk away, which I firmly believe was the CCB's plan in the first place. Does Gerald resign, ya, but that's cause I think he's a bad manager. He wont resign and sadly he can't see that he's been dangled by a string by Murphy.
b) Do the players continue their stance? Is that in the best interests of Cork hurling and what will be the consequences? (long term)
They will continue till a solution is found. Is it in the best interest, they are willing to sacrifice their playing careers, they are willing to end their careers not in a blaze of glory that they ALL deserve but in controversy and hate..etc. In both long and short term, yes it's best.

Lets say McCarthy steps down, Cork players get the man they want and in next 3 years they fail to win an All-Ireland title....will anything change regarding manager selection process?
McCarthy stepping down alone will be like putting a plaster on a gun shot wound. The only way things can progress is when sorry if we ever get rid of the board. Getting rid of McCarthy is a very, very short term solution and we'll be down this track a year or so latter again. McCarthy isn't the big problem here, he's just a pawn who can't see what he's got himself mixed up in.
McCarthy stays on....same result, Cork win nothing in two years....same question...will this change anything regarding the manager selection process?
Same as the answer above.
Sorry if this is confusing but it would help clear up a few things for me anyway!

Ok then so Reillers, Sean Og appears happy enough and will hurl away and iron out his differences with the dictator, no problem.

You posted above way back that McCarthy leaving would only be a short term solution, a plaster as such. Well it would appear that the plaster is in place. What happens next?

Should we therefore expect a strike again next year?

[RedandGreenSniper]

I'm curious about this line being spouted that Murphy can't be sacked. Reillers has said its gospel but I sincerely doubt it. Perhaps the players don't care if, as some of the pro players posters would say 'the county board don't look out for the best interests of Cork GAA' so long as it doesn't impinge on the senior hurlers. So selfish and not altruistic motives after all. That's my reading of it. Its a holy mess and I'm beginning to think that Cork GAA should be sanctioned for the harm they've brought the GAA through in recent months.

He can't. It's in his contract, which he wrote himself 30 years ago.

Sorry, still don't believe that. I know he's meant to be some man for the rulebook but I doubt there's such a thing as an unsackable person in the GAA. Have you seen this contract? Or, if not, on who's say so are you saying he's unsackable?

[INDIANA]

The whole point of the club meetings was to put pressure on Frank. And it was working. Now they appear to be rollling back from it. I can't see how they can have any credibility whatsoever if they resume playing with Frank involved having on a limb for the last 5 months. It'll just be another strike 12 months down the road. I thought the players were doing this for the betterment of Cork Gaa in general. Surely in order to do that they have to get rid of Frank with the clubs help. Or has that all been forgotten? Its all very strange .

[Reillers]

The whole point of the club meetings was to put pressure on Frank. And it was working. Now they appear to be rollling back from it. I can't see how they can have any credibility whatsoever if they resume playing with Frank involved having on a limb for the last 5 months. It'll just be another strike 12 months down the road. I thought the players were doing this for the betterment of Cork Gaa in general. Surely in order to do that they have to get rid of Frank with the clubs help. Or has that all been forgotten? Its all very strange .

What do ye want the players to do exactly.
They've set the wheels rolling for the clubs. But they can't hold their hands all the way.

The players can't do the clubs business. It's up to the clubs now.

One minute ye are criticizing them for trying to run the whole thing. The next minute when they let the clubs do their own business they're criticized.
And ye say I am flip flopping.

Make up yere mind ffs.

[INDIANA]

Grand then so Reillers you've cleared that up. We'll have another one of these threads in 12months time. What a waste of time the whole thing has been.

[Reillers]

Well no, seeing as before the clubs would do nothing. I honestly believe that the clubs will no longer sit idoly by which is a massive improvement. I always hoped that this would push FM out, but ye are deluded to think that they'll stay out of the game till Frank Murphy steps down. He wont give a damn. He is the only one who decides when he steps down. 

If we go right down to it, we're all at the mercy of the CCB, none of us have the power to remove them, especially Frank. Until they are gone they will continue to make decisions.

But the players and clubs are in a stronger position. The players because they now have a chance of getting a management team that will do right by the county, that can pick the right team and hopefully get the most out of the players and get them achieving their potential.
As for the clubs, well the CB have really and truely screwed up in this case. They have re-awoken the sleeping giant, the clubs have discovered their voice which was taken from them some time ago. But now, they've found some fight and sense of belonging and ownership in Cork. For too long they've done nothing, too long they've sat idoly by. We are in a much better position then we were before this, despite what ye may think.
To whther either party takes advantage of this, well only time will tell.

Just saw the whole Sean Og thing, hopefully there'll be a mechanism for us to work closely..that's what all the fuss has been about.

True the man is terrible speaker and shouldn't be allowed near a microphone and I've said that before a good few times.

But for everything that's been said here, what a big blow out of nothing. Over the top reaction yet again.

[RedandGreenSniper]

Reillers its the constant moving of the goalposts by the players that really annoys people. Its easy for people to conclude that they are being selfish.

[passedit]

Go ask Om, he'll know, so will Skull actually I think they were the two main lads for it, go look at the first 100 pages of this forum.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/hurling/rebels-must-realise-that--no-compromise-means--no-future-for-cork-hurling-1516077.html

I will post more in the morning when I get a chance, couldn't be bothered looking now. But I think you'll find that there were a hell of a lot of negative opinion pieces and negative anti player articles around till before the press conference.

Reillers is of course right. I did make defamatory comments about certain ringleaders referring to the fact that I believed that they had one eye on themselves winning for Cork and the other on what could be gained from themselves being involved whilst winning for Cork. I said it because I believe it. This just isn't a "pastime anymore for some". It's business and a pretty dirty one at that. I believe that their greed (yes I chose that word specifically) for success/to be involved with Cork has driven them to do what they have done when walking away was a very real option for those who were not happy with "democracy". They and they alone will have to live with the bad karma they have created in Cork and beyond. I'm totally sick with disgust.

You're entitled to your opinion Skull, mine is that it is just as likely if not more that Mc Carthy's (x2) motives were financial and Ger stepped down now not because of threats from anyone but because the heat was turned on his paymaster. How come this man of principle chose now to step down now when he stuck out the 'death threats' for month's?

I'll be sick to my stomach if the real villain here scuttles off into the long grass to continued his plotting. This can't stop now.

It's good to see that so many CCB backers have seen the light and are cheering the 08 players on to go after the godfather. Fair play to ye boys I didn't think ye had it in ye.

[Reillers]

Reillers its the constant moving of the goalposts by the players that really annoys people. Its easy for people to conclude that they are being selfish.

It's the constant presumption that they are moving goal posts, but it's like when you are playing a game and you have to beat the small bad guys before you get to the evil boss. That is the simplest way I could explain it.
That's what this is.
Gerald was part and parcell of the problem. He was used by the CB, like I said 100 times, they used him as a shield to deflect attention away from them. The cb were always the lads who were in charge and I've never said otherwise, but apparently no, I've changed from it being Gerald, to the CB little do they understand that they were all the target, they were all the problem.
Gerald was always going to be the sacrificial lamb from the CB.

Everyone here presumes it's over now because the players will come back, so ye've no faith in the clubs? They, like it was said by Denis Walsh on Newstalk, smell blood. They have been burned so many times by the CB execs and they are out for the jugular. If they stop they stop, but that's down to the clubs. It's got feck all to do with the IC players, it's not their place. It's the clubs who need to stand up.

Ye really have a such a small, minute, opinion of the clubs.

It's up to them now, the players can't hold their hand and fight their fight, they have no business in doing so. It's down to the clubs to stand up like they've been doing so, to keep the pressure on and such.
There is no reason why the clubs should stop.
The IC players don't have the power to get FM out, the clubs all together, might be able to put enough pressure on him to make him consider otherwise.

[passedit]

Reillers its the constant moving of the goalposts by the players that really annoys people. Its easy for people to conclude that they are being selfish.

Trawl through this thead and pick out the varying 'advice' offered to the 08 squad by the pro CCB crowd if you want to see goalposts shifting.

When this started they said they couldn't work with Mc Carthy, now he's gone.

Personally, I hope Murphy goes too (and not upwards to be a plague on all of us but out on his hole) but I still very much doubt if either the players or the clubs can remove him. I'd love to be in a position in a week or so to say I was wrong though.

[theskull1]

It's good to see that so many CCB backers have seen the light and are cheering the 08 players on to go after the godfather. Fair play to ye boys I didn't think ye had it in ye.

Just want to see the strikers standing for what is is they believe right for cork hurling which from what they have stated meant that the CCB had to be got rid of especially FM and that these messages were not merely well engineered soundbites used to stir the mob into reacting in their favour to get what they only wanted (i.e Ger McC out). It looks like this was just part of the media campaign at this stage to acheive their ultimate selfish aims.

[RedandGreenSniper]

Reillers its the constant moving of the goalposts by the players that really annoys people. Its easy for people to conclude that they are being selfish.

It's the constant presumption that they are moving goal posts, but it's like when you are playing a game and you have to beat the small bad guys before you get to the evil boss. That is the simplest way I could explain it.
That's what this is.
Gerald was part and parcell of the problem. He was used by the CB, like I said 100 times, they used him as a shield to deflect attention away from them. The cb were always the lads who were in charge and I've never said otherwise, but apparently no, I've changed from it being Gerald, to the CB little do they understand that they were all the target, they were all the problem.
Gerald was always going to be the sacrificial lamb from the CB.

Everyone here presumes it's over now because the players will come back, so ye've no faith in the clubs? They, like it was said by Denis Walsh on Newstalk, smell blood. They have been burned so many times by the CB execs and they are out for the jugular. If they stop they stop, but that's down to the clubs. It's got feck all to do with the IC players, it's not their place. It's the clubs who need to stand up.

Ye really have a such a small, minute, opinion of the clubs.

It's up to them now, the players can't hold their hand and fight their fight, they have no business in doing so. It's down to the clubs to stand up like they've been doing so, to keep the pressure on and such.
There is no reason why the clubs should stop.
The IC players don't have the power to get FM out, the clubs all together, might be able to put enough pressure on him to make him consider otherwise.

And why shouldn't we? The clubs have allowed this problem, that you say is obvious to anyone in Cork, to fester for so long. They've left the county board at it and put their heads in the sands. They've rarely mandated their delegates by the look of things and when they do mandate and see the delegate doesn't follow their wishes, they don't seem to care. Its been said that the clubs will be the heroes of this if they affect change at board level. Bullshit. The clubs are to blame for allowing this problem to exist for so long.

Reillers its the constant moving of the goalposts by the players that really annoys people. Its easy for people to conclude that they are being selfish.

Trawl through this thead and pick out the varying 'advice' offered to the 08 squad by the pro CCB crowd if you want to see goalposts shifting.
When this started they said they couldn't work with Mc Carthy, now he's gone.

Personally, I hope Murphy goes too (and not upwards to be a plague on all of us but out on his hole) but I still very much doubt if either the players or the clubs can remove him. I'd love to be in a position in a week or so to say I was wrong though.

Perhaps but posters on this board are not centrally involved in the saga or can influence its outcome. The players can. Their moving of the goalposts had led to a lot of the distrust that exists. I've said it before, there is no one with a monopoly on rightousness in this sorry saga, and I would most certainly include the players in that.

[Reillers]

Reillers its the constant moving of the goalposts by the players that really annoys people. Its easy for people to conclude that they are being selfish.

Trawl through this thead and pick out the varying 'advice' offered to the 08 squad by the pro CCB crowd if you want to see goalposts shifting.

When this started they said they couldn't work with Mc Carthy, now he's gone.

Personally, I hope Murphy goes too (and not upwards to be a plague on all of us but out on his hole) but I still very much doubt if either the players or the clubs can remove him. I'd love to be in a position in a week or so to say I was wrong though.

Croke Park might take him. I pray to God Clooney takes him with him when he goes upstairs and hides him away. He wont leave of his own accord and Croke Park wont get rid of him either, he's much to valueable. No one knows the rules books inside out as he does.

And you want goal post shifting.
Well take a look at the pro Cb posters.
First it was the journos, only said what they said because they were looking for biographies to write.
Then it was the fans, well they're only out in force because they're shoppers in Patricks Street who happened to follow the lads with the signs and banners. Oh and then they went from being, the ones who have spoken after only a few thousand showed up, to soccer like fans and seasonal fans.
Then oh the clubs, they were the ones who had the say way back ages ago. Oh then they were being led along by 3 or 4 players, all the several hundred of people involved being lad by 3 or 4. And then they were nothing but people following a mob rule.  
Oh and my personal favorite, FM is suddenly turned into a poor ole 65 year old OAP. Innocent as the day is long.

First it's abuse and criticizm for apparently wanting to take the whole thing over, then when they leave the clubs do their own business, take care of their own problems and not get involved, they're critized again.
Critized for downing tools and critized for keeping their word and picking them up.