McCarthy admits he does not have backing of Cork hurlers

[heffo]

Not meant to be a personal attack at all - just stating that he isn't at all consistent with what he's been saying on stage in support of the lads, that's all. No big deal really. A new irony by the way.

Of course its a personal attack - you've implied he's a liar.

Maybe he's not being consistent in what he's saying about Frank,saying as you've quoted nothing to indicate he doesn't fully support the players?

Compared to one paragraph 5 years ago.

Brian Corcoran's book was released in December 2006 - where is the five years?

[orangeman]

Not meant to be a personal attack at all - just stating that he isn't at all consistent with what he's been saying on stage in support of the lads, that's all. No big deal really. A new irony by the way.

Of course its a personal attack - you've implied he's a liar.

Maybe he's not being consistent in what he's saying about Frank,saying as you've quoted nothing to indicate he doesn't fully support the players?

I'm not going to call him a liar - he's entitled to change his miond - people do as Reillers says, no problem with what  - but he had plenty to say in his book, both good and bad., both controversial and non controversial. It is possible to have a sea change in attitude. As I said, timing is everything. But seeing as Brian's first utterings were confined to print, I'd attach more importance to them than I would to what he had to say to the crowd a few weeks back.

I've have not tried to imply anything. If that's how it comes across to you, that's your interpretation. Nothing I can do about that.

But seeing as his book was published in Dec 06, just after he quit playing, it's not exactly in the history section of the library.

[Reillers]

In general or on something specific?

Allow me the liberty of paraphrasing:

"Frank called me up to his office to give me a lecture for lining out for my club when it was against IC player policy at the time. He was all set to lift me out of it but I stood up to him and we never had a problem since that day. I think he's great and great for Cork. I can't tell you the amount of time he's gotten Cork players out of trouble with his knowledge of the rule book and quick thinking. He once gave us an unscripted ten minute speech which raised the hairs on the back of our neck. If I were ever in trouble in court, Frank would be the first man I'd call. There is a great picture of me, Frank (and someone else) arm in arm after (I think 2004 AI final). Maybe we'll have more days like that some time in the future.'

There you go - legend. End of the criticism of Frank please. It was only ever a distraction.

Clearly Heffo's missing a few pages in his book, and he doesn't have Blood Brothers either I presume by the sounds of him.

Nothing arised from 03-the end of 06. Till he started playing his old games again.

Who's 'him'? The cats father? After all we've been through...are you claiming the paragraph above is inaccuratly portrayed? If so, please fill in the blanks...

I thought Corcoran played minor, U21 & senior in both codes over a period of about 16 years so surely he'd be the best man to give an accurate portrayal of Frank?

Was it not Frank Murphy who used to give Brian a lift home after training when Brian was a minor?

I'm not claiming anything, I'm just saying that one paragraph in the book, an opinion at a certain time doesn't portray the whole story. There are parts of the book where's not happy with him. Very unhappy with the CB.
Opinions change over time. What he thought then is very different to what he thought in 02 and extremley different to what he thinks now.

We all have our faults Reillers but that's a glowing report by anyone's standards.
Why don't you put the 'other bits' you're talking about up and we'll compare them.

If I can find the book I will.
But it's not the point. And the way ye are going so over the top with this isn't even funny. That was years ago. Things change, a lot of things change, and I can guarantee you Corcoran is not giving a glowing report of him now.
But because ye are so hell bent on trying to nit pick yere way through this fight ye don't seem to be able to see that things change, peoples opinions and views change with the times.

The reality is ye are looking for anything that will support yere arguement for a CB who know longer represents the clubs, which is it's sole purpose.
They no longer represent the grassroots and what use is the CB then. They don't represent the large majority in Cork, which is a disgrace, when the clubs opinions differ completley from the CB then something is seriously wrong.

But ye are, somehow, God only knows how, ok with that.

But answer me this question, yes or no..
Is it the Cb's job to represent and serve the clubs?

The answer is an emphatic yes. And because all the clubs in Cork have their full involvement in all competitions open to them and compete within the rules made by the membership then I would have to say that's fairly good evidence that the board is representing them. The fact that there are numerous county teams would be further evidence when you consider the board secure rigs, sponsorship, facilities and whatever else is needed. What is it they're not doing that makes you feel they're not representing the county?
You have no evidence they don't represent the majority. I can understand your excitement at the 2008 panel getting a reasonable turnout at their meeting but it remains to be seen if anything comes of it. And again don't forget not all at the meeting support the panels actions and a reasonable amout of clubs weren't there.
You have to deal with realities.
Heffo put up a quote and you scream in capital letters and hyphens and say that's not the way it is now and there's other things in the book. Get the substance up so we can deal with realities instead of screaming.

In spite of what you believe about clubs if I was a member of the 2008 panel, and one of its leaders in particular I'd be very worried about the clubs role in all this and whether or not the panel will get significant support.

Just because they manage to (pathetically) organise fixtures and clubs playing in those games, is nothing.
That's doing a basic job of theirs.

They don't represent the majority.
It's known by now the feeling up and down Cork is that they want a change.
Clubs up and down the county are calling SGMs, all of which are planning on backing the players, I could even probably tell you who and when.
The club chairmen in large went to the meeting with their clubs views, that was the point of the meeting, because the views weren't being represented at the CB meetings. And there was overwhelming support for the players.
The majority are now fully backing the players.
I live in Cork, I am very involved in my club, news and views travel fast.
The tide has completley turned on the CB, because they have lost the grassroots. It is common knowledge by now. Just because I can't show you any evidence means nothing.
Since when is over 400 people just a reasonable turnout.
The majority of clubs were there and the majority support the players. And that's what I've been told. Everyone I've spoken to who was at the meeting says the same thing, that the majority backed the players and if a vote was taken there and then on whether to keep Gerald in the job or not, it would have been almost 100% in favour of the players.

The CB have really fucked up, Gerald is now an advantage to the clubs and the players.
While the players mightn't have had half the backing on just the topic of Gerald a while ago, they now have a hell of a lot more backing because the view is changed to the CB, the clubs are furious, most feel they are not being represented by their delegates, that their voice isn't being heard and Gerald is what they want to get rid of first, they want their voice back, they want their county back. They want to be the ones running it, not FM and his minions.

JOS and Lane comming out and saying it doesn't matter one bit what the clubs think, because the rule book is on their side. Basically the clubs opinion doesn't matter a damn.

And that to a hell lot of clubs is more then just a slap in the face.

[orangeman]

The clubs still have a dilemna - the slap in the face you refer to hasnot been delivered by Gerald and he remains largely unaffected personally by the perceived change in attitude towards the CB  - if the clubs are going to deliver a slap in the face to the CB, how are they going to do it ? A vote of no confidence in Gerald won't do it.

[The GAA]

I'm not going to call him a liar -

I've have not tried to imply anything. If that's how it comes across to you, that's your interpretation. Nothing I can do about that.

You've said he was speaking with a forked tongue! what else should we conclude you're saying?

he's entitled to change his mind - people do as Reillers says, no problem with what  - but he had plenty to say in his book, both good and bad., both controversial and non controversial. It is possible to have a sea change in attitude. As I said, timing is everything. But seeing as Brian's first utterings were confined to print, I'd attach more importance to them than I would to what he had to say to the crowd a few weeks back.

That's laughable logic (i know). people change their mind you say but he has changed his mind now since he addressed the crowd a few weeks back rather than since he wrote his book?

[Reillers]

The clubs still have a dilemna - the slap in the face you refer to hasnot been delivered by Gerald and he remains largely unaffected personally by the perceived change in attitude towards the CB  - if the clubs are going to deliver a slap in the face to the CB, how are they going to do it ? A vote of no confidence in Gerald won't do it.

That's it, the no confidence vote is what they are hell bent on getting. It's a sign of their control. They now want it. Gerald as I said he'd always be, is being used a battering ram.
He is a pawn, on both sides to get at eachother.
The clubs want their voice back and this will be shown by getting the no convidence vote. While the CB are using Gerald as a shield between the clubs and the players and FM's power.

[Onlooker]

How many of the 10 or 12 thousand that marched the last day will be in the march next week to the Fermanagh match.  I expect the fact that they will have to pay to get in to the Pairc will lead to a big drop in numbers or will a lot of them just go home instead of paying to get in the Uncovered Stand.

[bingobus]

The clubs still have a dilemna - the slap in the face you refer to hasnot been delivered by Gerald and he remains largely unaffected personally by the perceived change in attitude towards the CB  - if the clubs are going to deliver a slap in the face to the CB, how are they going to do it ? A vote of no confidence in Gerald won't do it.

Thats pretty much it. All these rallies, meetings, standing ovations, further rallies, meetings, etc may end up with Ger McCarthy out on his arse and pride of cork back in the jersey but what happens then? Back to the same CB, FM will get the lads off in summer, KK will win the All-Ireland and then three years down the line Sean Og will lead the troops to the gates of Mordor agains to face down another shite manager and FM will get the blame.

Ye would want to sort out who the target is and whats going to happen next.

Just had a clip sent to me of the Cork players latest meeting and their plans are made clear, see link for a look

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YawagQ6lLrA

[Reillers]

How many of the 10 or 12 thousand that marched the last day will be in the march next week to the Fermanagh match.  I expect the fact that they will have to pay to get in to the Pairc will lead to a big drop in numbers or will a lot of them just go home instead of paying to get in the Uncovered Stand.

That's the part I don't know about, it's not very clear and they'd want to make it clear.
People don't know whether they're supposed to go into the match afterwards or not.
Whether they're supposed to be something like a sit down protest inside the match or something,
Whether it ends there and people can go in or not.
Or whether we're supposed to stay out.

It's not 100% clear at the minute.

[orangeman]

The clubs still have a dilemna - the slap in the face you refer to hasnot been delivered by Gerald and he remains largely unaffected personally by the perceived change in attitude towards the CB  - if the clubs are going to deliver a slap in the face to the CB, how are they going to do it ? A vote of no confidence in Gerald won't do it.

That's it, the no confidence vote is what they are hell bent on getting. It's a sign of their control. They now want it. Gerald as I said he'd always be, is being used a battering ram.
He is a pawn, on both sides to get at eachother.
The clubs want their voice back and this will be shown by getting the no convidence vote. While the CB are using Gerald as a shield between the clubs and the players and FM's power.

Completely misguided and ill advised. There's no guarantee that the clubs will bring this motion of no confidence in Gerald -

If administration / maladministration is what is in question here, then I'd suggest that the clubs will propose a  vote of no confidence in the CB if anything, but not in Gerald. Gerald is not seen at the enemy here - call him a prawn, call him a by product or whatever else you want to, but the clubs don't want to see him shafted whilst the entire CB remains in situ.

[orangeman]

I'm not going to call him a liar -

I've have not tried to imply anything. If that's how it comes across to you, that's your interpretation. Nothing I can do about that.

You've said he was speaking with a forked tongue! what else should we conclude you're saying?

he's entitled to change his mind - people do as Reillers says, no problem with what  - but he had plenty to say in his book, both good and bad., both controversial and non controversial. It is possible to have a sea change in attitude. As I said, timing is everything. But seeing as Brian's first utterings were confined to print, I'd attach more importance to them than I would to what he had to say to the crowd a few weeks back.

That's laughable logic (i know). people change their mind you say but he has changed his mind now since he addressed the crowd a few weeks back rather than since he wrote his book?

I suppose only Brian can answer that question.

[dowling]

In general or on something specific?

Allow me the liberty of paraphrasing:

"Frank called me up to his office to give me a lecture for lining out for my club when it was against IC player policy at the time. He was all set to lift me out of it but I stood up to him and we never had a problem since that day. I think he's great and great for Cork. I can't tell you the amount of time he's gotten Cork players out of trouble with his knowledge of the rule book and quick thinking. He once gave us an unscripted ten minute speech which raised the hairs on the back of our neck. If I were ever in trouble in court, Frank would be the first man I'd call. There is a great picture of me, Frank (and someone else) arm in arm after (I think 2004 AI final). Maybe we'll have more days like that some time in the future.'

There you go - legend. End of the criticism of Frank please. It was only ever a distraction.

Clearly Heffo's missing a few pages in his book, and he doesn't have Blood Brothers either I presume by the sounds of him.

Nothing arised from 03-the end of 06. Till he started playing his old games again.

Who's 'him'? The cats father? After all we've been through...are you claiming the paragraph above is inaccuratly portrayed? If so, please fill in the blanks...

I thought Corcoran played minor, U21 & senior in both codes over a period of about 16 years so surely he'd be the best man to give an accurate portrayal of Frank?

Was it not Frank Murphy who used to give Brian a lift home after training when Brian was a minor?

I'm not claiming anything, I'm just saying that one paragraph in the book, an opinion at a certain time doesn't portray the whole story. There are parts of the book where's not happy with him. Very unhappy with the CB.
Opinions change over time. What he thought then is very different to what he thought in 02 and extremley different to what he thinks now.

We all have our faults Reillers but that's a glowing report by anyone's standards.
Why don't you put the 'other bits' you're talking about up and we'll compare them.

If I can find the book I will.
But it's not the point. And the way ye are going so over the top with this isn't even funny. That was years ago. Things change, a lot of things change, and I can guarantee you Corcoran is not giving a glowing report of him now.
But because ye are so hell bent on trying to nit pick yere way through this fight ye don't seem to be able to see that things change, peoples opinions and views change with the times.

The reality is ye are looking for anything that will support yere arguement for a CB who know longer represents the clubs, which is it's sole purpose.
They no longer represent the grassroots and what use is the CB then. They don't represent the large majority in Cork, which is a disgrace, when the clubs opinions differ completley from the CB then something is seriously wrong.

But ye are, somehow, God only knows how, ok with that.

But answer me this question, yes or no..
Is it the Cb's job to represent and serve the clubs?

The answer is an emphatic yes. And because all the clubs in Cork have their full involvement in all competitions open to them and compete within the rules made by the membership then I would have to say that's fairly good evidence that the board is representing them. The fact that there are numerous county teams would be further evidence when you consider the board secure rigs, sponsorship, facilities and whatever else is needed. What is it they're not doing that makes you feel they're not representing the county?
You have no evidence they don't represent the majority. I can understand your excitement at the 2008 panel getting a reasonable turnout at their meeting but it remains to be seen if anything comes of it. And again don't forget not all at the meeting support the panels actions and a reasonable amout of clubs weren't there.
You have to deal with realities.
Heffo put up a quote and you scream in capital letters and hyphens and say that's not the way it is now and there's other things in the book. Get the substance up so we can deal with realities instead of screaming.

In spite of what you believe about clubs if I was a member of the 2008 panel, and one of its leaders in particular I'd be very worried about the clubs role in all this and whether or not the panel will get significant support.

Just because they manage to (pathetically) organise fixtures and clubs playing in those games, is nothing.
That's doing a basic job of theirs.

They don't represent the majority.
It's known by now the feeling up and down Cork is that they want a change.
Clubs up and down the county are calling SGMs, all of which are planning on backing the players, I could even probably tell you who and when.
The club chairmen in large went to the meeting with their clubs views, that was the point of the meeting, because the views weren't being represented at the CB meetings. And there was overwhelming support for the players.
The majority are now fully backing the players.
I live in Cork, I am very involved in my club, news and views travel fast.
The tide has completley turned on the CB, because they have lost the grassroots. It is common knowledge by now. Just because I can't show you any evidence means nothing.
Since when is over 400 people just a reasonable turnout.
The majority of clubs were there and the majority support the players. And that's what I've been told. Everyone I've spoken to who was at the meeting says the same thing, that the majority backed the players and if a vote was taken there and then on whether to keep Gerald in the job or not, it would have been almost 100% in favour of the players.

The CB have really fucked up, Gerald is now an advantage to the clubs and the players.
While the players mightn't have had half the backing on just the topic of Gerald a while ago, they now have a hell of a lot more backing because the view is changed to the CB, the clubs are furious, most feel they are not being represented by their delegates, that their voice isn't being heard and Gerald is what they want to get rid of first, they want their voice back, they want their county back. They want to be the ones running it, not FM and his minions.

JOS and Lane comming out and saying it doesn't matter one bit what the clubs think, because the rule book is on their side. Basically the clubs opinion doesn't matter a damn.

And that to a hell lot of clubs is more then just a slap in the face.

Reillers are you making things up as you go along.
When JOS refers to a rule he's refering to a rule passed by the clubs at county convention so that's further evidence of the board representing the clubs. Or would you rather the board ignored the rules the members of the association in Cork make? If the members now think the rule is not a good one they can change it. but they have to go to county convention again as that's another rule. And then it needs proposed and seconded as that's another rule. And don't forget about it having to be submitted in time. You guessed it, that's another rule. To be honest I'm unsure of the rule for voting to pass a motion but there's at least one there. Bit tedius all that I know but this is where the real nitpicking is. You elect a board to do a lot of things on behalf of the clubs, implementing the rules as agreed by the clubs being one aspect, and then criticise them for doing what they're elected to do.
Stop the mantra reillers. There's no way to be sure what support the panel have or how many clubs at the meeting supported them. All we can be sure of is that a percentage of those at the meeting didn't support them and a large percentage, indeed around 45% of clubs weren't represented.
The thing is reillers I would give you more credit than to be mindlessly repeating stuff which can't be substaniated so what's your reason for continually repeating yourself without being able to produce any evidence?
If you were to say "my feeling, taking into account what I've heard and seen is......." that's different.
My feeling is this has a way to go and the 2008 panel probably wont make progree through the clubs because the support they need isn't there.

[The GAA]

He answered it on the march a few weeks ago.

No call for you calling him a liar though

[orangeman]

He answered it on the march a few weeks ago.

No call for you calling him a liar though

What "exactly" did he say on the podium ?

[Onlooker]

How many of the 10 or 12 thousand that marched the last day will be in the march next week to the Fermanagh match.  I expect the fact that they will have to pay to get in to the Pairc will lead to a big drop in numbers or will a lot of them just go home instead of paying to get in the Uncovered Stand.

That's the part I don't know about, it's not very clear and they'd want to make it clear.
People don't know whether they're supposed to go into the match afterwards or not.
Whether they're supposed to be something like a sit down protest inside the match or something,
Whether it ends there and people can go in or not.
Or whether we're supposed to stay out.

It's not 100% clear at the minute.

According to Michael Moynihan in the Examiner, the marchers are to meet at Kennedy Park (I do not know where that is) and march to Pairc Ui Chaoimh to enter the uncovered stand.  I would expect that someone as close to the players as Moynihan would know what is being planned.  If the same crowd turns up as the last day, there will be some crowd there for a Div. 2 NFL match against Fermanagh.  I can't see 10 or 12 thousand marchers paying 15 euro to see a League match, however.  It will be like the "good old Duke of York" marching his troops up to the top of the hill and marching them back down again.  Any progress on the Club EGM's.  Heard a rumour that the Cloyne one has either been cancelled or postponed.