McCarthy admits he does not have backing of Cork hurlers

[Reillers]

I've no doubt that the CB will probably ignore this issure, ignore the meeting, ignore everything and say that the issue is closed and not open for discussion because then if it was then something, God forbid, something might happen to show the CB in bad light.

[Reillers]

10 minutes.
The Cork County Board spent a total of 10 minutes discussing the Sunday meeting. The answer was, the issue is closed. And that basically (the hours flicking though the rule book which FM wrote to find a way out of what happened. By saying that the meeting wasn't official.
Ignoring 12000 people on the street was bad enough. Ya you could claim that they weren't representing clubs, they mightn't all been GAA members. But to ignore the meeting, the 400 plus club chairmen and clubmen, ignoring the grassroots who they are supposed to be representing.
It has shown clearly what FM thinks of the clubs and the little power the clubs have.

And basically saying, we don't give a dalm what ye all think. We're doing our way, we're letting one man dictate it all despite the overwhelming majority opinion of the clubs, the grassroots, the fans, the club members.


Democracy at it's finest.

Please, please let a pro CB poster try to justify this. Surely this shows ye what the players are up against, what we all are up against.

[slow corner back]

If the players, sean og etc hadnt spent the last 10 yrs relying on frank murphys enclylopidic knowledge of the rulebook to get them off bans I could have a lot of sympathy for your view point reillers, however as the old saying goes if you sup with the devil use a long spoon. You reap what you sow, if you sign a no strike pledge then break it excpect no sympathy.

[Reillers]

If the players, sean og etc hadnt spent the last 10 yrs relying on frank murphys enclylopidic knowledge of the rulebook to get them off bans I could have a lot of sympathy for your view point reillers, however as the old saying goes if you sup with the devil use a long spoon. You reap what you sow, if you sign a no strike pledge then break it excpect no sympathy.

Are you kidding me.
How can you read that and justify it. FM doing the part of his job he does well in. The rest he's an absolute disgrace. And I can't see how a true GAA fan can even try to justify that.
The GAA is about the grassroots. The CB are supposed to represnt the grassroots, the CCB represent themselves and themselves only. Anyone who thinks otherwise is no GAA fan.
The GAA is all about the grassroots, this is the CB's attitude towards that, towards the clubs, and you are saying it's ok that the CB did what they did because FM did a bit of his job from time to time over the years?

[RedandGreenSniper]

Reillers what can the county board do yet (even if they want to do something)?

The club reps met the players on Sunday, the players suggest a few motions and the clubs are going back to discuss these internally, meeting the players and then, if the mood is strong enough, possibly bring these motions to the county board. Say what you want about the county board but until such a time as the clubs return to them suggesting this motion, they can't be accused of negligence. If a majority of the clubs come asking for change in a couple of weeks and they then refuse, well that's another matter

[Reillers]

Reillers what can the county board do yet (even if they want to do something)?

The club reps met the players on Sunday, the players suggest a few motions and the clubs are going back to discuss these internally, meeting the players and then, if the mood is strong enough, possibly bring these motions to the county board. Say what you want about the county board but until such a time as the clubs return to them suggesting this motion, they can't be accused of negligence. If a majority of the clubs come asking for change in a couple of weeks and they then refuse, well that's another matter

Their job.

THey discused it, even if you can call it that, for all of 10 minutes. And all that came from it was JOS saying that the topic was closed and that they wouldn't be taking any more motions on it.
That's basically the CCB teling the clubs they are supposed to be representing, to f**k off, we're doing it our way, no matter what the overwhelming decision is.
It showed, it really did show, what FM and co really think of the clubs and how little impact and power they have in something they are supposed to be controlling.
It is perfectly clear from tonight that they do not and have no intention of even trying to represent the grassroots, the clubs, which is what the GAA is all about.

What the hell gives them the right.
And on Prime Time Gerald Lane said that basically if that did happen, if they wanted to vote, it wouldn't matter because the issue is closed.

[INDIANA]

Reillers what can the county board do yet (even if they want to do something)?

The club reps met the players on Sunday, the players suggest a few motions and the clubs are going back to discuss these internally, meeting the players and then, if the mood is strong enough, possibly bring these motions to the county board. Say what you want about the county board but until such a time as the clubs return to them suggesting this motion, they can't be accused of negligence. If a majority of the clubs come asking for change in a couple of weeks and they then refuse, well that's another matter

Their job.

THey discused it, even if you can call it that, for all of 10 minutes. And all that came from it was JOS saying that the topic was closed and that they wouldn't be taking any more motions on it.
That's basically the CCB teling the clubs they are supposed to be representing, to f**k off, we're doing it our way, no matter what the overwhelming decision is.
It showed, it really did show, what FM and co really think of the clubs and how little impact and power they have in something they are supposed to be controlling.
It is perfectly clear from tonight that they do not and have no intention of even trying to represent the grassroots, the clubs, which is what the GAA is all about.

What the hell gives them the right.
And on Prime Time Gerald Lane said that basically if that did happen, if they wanted to vote, it wouldn't matter because the issue is closed.

But if you hadn't just gone with the flow down there for the last 10 years it wouldn't be such a problem. Why have people taken so long to take the situation in hand. A couple of weeks ago you told us a meeting of the club chairman would be a waste of time, yet its achieved more than any strike or motion in the last 5 years.

[Reillers]

Reillers what can the county board do yet (even if they want to do something)?

The club reps met the players on Sunday, the players suggest a few motions and the clubs are going back to discuss these internally, meeting the players and then, if the mood is strong enough, possibly bring these motions to the county board. Say what you want about the county board but until such a time as the clubs return to them suggesting this motion, they can't be accused of negligence. If a majority of the clubs come asking for change in a couple of weeks and they then refuse, well that's another matter

Their job.

THey discused it, even if you can call it that, for all of 10 minutes. And all that came from it was JOS saying that the topic was closed and that they wouldn't be taking any more motions on it.
That's basically the CCB teling the clubs they are supposed to be representing, to f**k off, we're doing it our way, no matter what the overwhelming decision is.
It showed, it really did show, what FM and co really think of the clubs and how little impact and power they have in something they are supposed to be controlling.
It is perfectly clear from tonight that they do not and have no intention of even trying to represent the grassroots, the clubs, which is what the GAA is all about.

What the hell gives them the right.
And on Prime Time Gerald Lane said that basically if that did happen, if they wanted to vote, it wouldn't matter because the issue is closed.

But if you hadn't just gone with the flow down there for the last 10 years it wouldn't be such a problem. Why have people taken so long to take the situation in hand. A couple of weeks ago you told us a meeting of the club chairman would be a waste of time, yet its achieved more than any strike or motion in the last 5 years.

No one was willing to stand up to them because that would be the result.
It took the IC players to do it.
And I did say it would be a waste a time and I was very, very, very wrong.
But as it seems the CB don't give two shits what the clubs think.

[slow corner back]

Frank Murphy was a great lad while he got Sean Og Nicolas Murphy etc and others off long suspensions. Did that not happen? frank is democratically elected you seem to have forgot that. If he is soo bad you stand for his post next year. Who elected Donal Og Or Tom Kenny to ant position in Cork GAA? It sure wasnt the clubs?

[Reillers]

Frank Murphy was a great lad while he got Sean Og Nicolas Murphy etc and others off long suspensions. Did that not happen? frank is democratically elected you seem to have forgot that. If he is soo bad you stand for his post next year. Who elected Donal Og Or Tom Kenny to ant position in Cork GAA? It sure wasnt the clubs?

Are you tryingh to tell me that all of this is ok and justified because he was doing his job for once. No one is better with the rule book then FM.
How does that justify giving two fingers to the very people they are supposed to represent, how does that justify telling the grass roots bascially to f**k off because it's his show, he's running it.
Anyway, that move what they've just done, never mind the players, that was a direct reflection on the way the clubs are viewed by the CB.
And FM is the only one on the entire CB that is not democratically elected. It is a full time job that he has had an abused for most of the 30 years as secetary and he cannot be fired. He is the only one who decides when he if finsihed. Every single club could vote a no confidence vote against him and he could still stay if he wanted and he dictates everything so he would make them pay like he has tried to make the players pay because they commited the cardinal sin.
The players are the only ones who have had the balls to stand up to the man who is untouchable.

"I am sickened to the core by the boards actions tonight. If this thing takes till next convention to sort out then so be it. But one way or another the clubs will have their say on this and the CCB will then regret their shamefull actions tonight and last week." (post from Rebelgaa and so, so true.)

FM is an absolute disgrace. He has no respect for the IC players, the clubs, Cork GAA, no one and he is interested in no one but himself. 

And on another note people should go watch the press meeting with the players again with all that's happened in mind and maybe now ye'll get a better grasp of what they and all of us involved in Cork GAA have had to put up with over the years.
And we're actually pathetic for not doing something about it, always the same excuse, afraid of the ramifications and such, it ended up being the players who were the ones who took that step onto the front line. And we, the members of Cork GAA, will be forever greatful if they can somehow pull off the impossible and get rid of FM for good.

[Eoghan Mag]

I know it has not been shouted too loudly here but part of this problem stems from the arbitration agreement the Cork Footballers agreed to last year. It should not have been agreed on back then. It was a 'if we smile and recognise your name then you will go away' type of arrangement. For this reason alone the Cork Footballers have a duty to row in behind the hurlers.

Huge blame also lies with the GAA in Croke Park in that they were not bright minded enough to see this dispute coming. For a start to even get anywhere last year's agreement needs to be buried deeper than the inside dealings of Anglo Irish bank. People need to see this. Start by throwing that worthless piece of bargaining into the bin and get out a fresh piece of paper, a couple of nice pens and start a-new.

This will mean getting rid of the idea of a 'veto motion'. The clubs should resolve to sort things out at County board level, even if this means going a year without winning an All Ireland or fielding a great Cork team. It should also be mooted that in future at least more than one serious candidate for the manager's post be proposed even if this means nominating a token candidate who is willing to give way if the other man is proving successful in that post. The token candidate should be well able to take on the job if asked; say if the other person got ill or had to step aside for personal reasons. The new agreement needs to have at its helm a steering group of ex-players with experience outside of County Cork. This 'outside' consultative grouping should in addition have a remit to be available to other counties if called upon if something arises during the playing term. I do not mean the GPA. The GAA should give official recognition to a players' forum in each county somewhere along the lines of the clubs giving the players of each grade a chance to air their views to all the heads of clubs prior to a vote on management. Once this has been done the players will have had their say. Players do not need to be part of any committee. When the manager is put in place after this there should be no strike action, nor a need for any there-after.      

[dowling]

Reillers I don't believe Gerald is a pawn, I think he has taken a principled stand in the same way he did during last year's dispute.

Frank Murphy is a ###### and the county pro Gerard Lane is now likewise; hold the front page, there's a retraction on that, but for a short period he was. Alan White was for a period the biggest so and so also and he's not even on the county board.
What I find strange is how Jerry OSullivan, county chairman and father of two of the 2008 panel hasn't been called any names when he was the first one to say this issue wouldn't be re-visited at board meetings. I suppose FM has his arm stuck up somewhere and Jerry isn't aware of the words coming out of his mouth.
Oh and don't forget the whole GAA apart from the 2008 panel is a load of shite!




"I think some of them have lost the principles of the GAA.

"And then the Chinese whispers start; one boy is not happy and then another is unhappy, and it develops around the changing room. But nobody can tell me all 30 fellas wouldn't hurl for Gerald McCarthy."    Sambo McNaughton Antrim Manager.

So Reillers you agree he has it spot on? Can you be objective about these parts which back up what I've been saying all along? Or because he's from 'just' Antrim do his comments amount to nothing. Am I right in thinking he's friends with Sean og?

Reillers you even get stuck into Miriam, is that the right name, on Prime Time who was also sympathetic to the 2008 panel and who didn't let Gerard Lane finish a sentence nor thanked him to leave the county meeting to talk. Blinded? Blinded, blinkered and your eyes gouged.


There seems to be a few people coming to Frank's defence recently. Gerald Lane tonight, Jerry OSullivan and now Nicky Brennan. Seems like the 2008 panel's attempts to single Frank out might backfire. I wouldn't be too sure about Frank moving on with Cooney.

Was it Gerard lane said tonight the county board are abiding by the rules. What's so wrong with that? It's good enough for the plebes at the bottom of the ladder - you know, like the ones who give of their time and expense freely to coach kids and keep the association ticking over - who, when they feel something should be changed check the rules, find out how to change them, go to their clubs to get a consensus and then go to county. No pressure group stuff there. But then maybe these people don't have the good of their county at heart.

Someone asked somewhere on this thread Reillers if you are a member of the 2008 panel and I would ask that again. Being a relative newcomer I genuinely don't know and it might be a silly question. But you say the same thing over and over again avoiding questions and insulting those of a differing opinion and if you're not I have to wonder do you have any connection with the 2008 panel.

Sean og said tonight if this takes two years then so be it. Two years of what? Maybe he should have listened to Sean Kelly, this is Cork GAA's version of The Wind That Shook The Barley.
People like you Reillers need to say enough is enough if you're genuinely interested in Cork GAA and the whole association and if you've issues find another path to pursue them by.

[dowling]

I know it has not been shouted too loudly here but part of this problem stems from the arbitration agreement the Cork Footballers agreed to last year. It should not have been agreed on back then. It was a 'if we smile and recognise your name then you will go away' type of arrangement. For this reason alone the Cork Footballers have a duty to row in behind the hurlers.

Huge blame also lies with the GAA in Croke Park in that they were not bright minded enough to see this dispute coming. For a start to even get anywhere last year's agreement needs to be buried deeper than the inside dealings of Anglo Irish bank. People need to see this. Start by throwing that worthless piece of bargaining into the bin and get out a fresh piece of paper, a couple of nice pens and start a-new.

This will mean getting rid of the idea of a 'veto motion'. The clubs should resolve to sort things out at County board level, even if this means going a year without winning an All Ireland or fielding a great Cork team. It should also be mooted that in future at least more than one serious candidate for the manager's post be proposed even if this means nominating a token candidate who is willing to give way if the other man is proving successful in that post. The token candidate should be well able to take on the job if asked; say if the other person got ill or had to step aside for personal reasons. The new agreement needs to have at its helm a steering group of ex-players with experience outside of County Cork. This 'outside' consultative grouping should in addition have a remit to be available to other counties if called upon if something arises during the playing term. I do not mean the GPA. The GAA should give official recognition to a players' forum in each county somewhere along the lines of the clubs giving the players of each grade a chance to air their views to all the heads of clubs prior to a vote on management. Once this has been done the players will have had their say. Players do not need to be part of any committee. When the manager is put in place after this there should be no strike action, nor a need for any there-after.      

Eoghan the thing is last year's agreement is already in the bin. When the 2008 panel broke the agreement to go on strike it became redundandant and to try to disguise the fact they had broken the agreement they refused to use the word strike but said they had withdrawn from the panel. It was only really when another panel took their place that the 2008 panel had to have their actions seen as a strike to have some effect.
The 2008 panel want their own rules, GPA style.

[sligeach]

Do you really see things that black and white. Clearly you're very young because when you're older you'll understand that maybe things just aren't that simple. Not just black and white, maybe then you'll understand the Veto issue..well hopefully anyway.

Reillers.

I am talking about a word in the English language which has a very simple meaning. That meaning does not change depending on who is using it or what the circumstances are. They have absolutely no bearing on the meaning of the word.

These are facts which I would hope everyone can agree on.

1. The players had input into the selection committee.
2. The players asked the selection committee not to choose Gerald.

Regardless of the rights, the wrongs, the "who said whats' and the current alignment of the planets. It makes absolutely no difference in the world that the word to describe what the players want is a veto.

Words meanings do not change because of circumstances.

They asked the committee NOT to choose Gerald, they said they refuse to play under Ger. That is a veto on Gerald McCarthy.

Denying this fact makes them look stupid or do they think the rest of the country are so thick they swallow Donal Og's tripe without question ?  

They don't (for the millionth time) want to call the shots.

They want to veto the manager as players and thats a million times more power then they should have. If they wanted to veto the manager through a democratic vote in the county then thats a completely different story. i.e > What they are finally doing after 5 months of blackmail.

They didn't want to do what they did, once never mind 3 times, they never wanted to be on the selection commitee either but it was part of the agreement of arbitrion.

- They went on strike and acted like spoilt children. FACT
- Now, 5 months later when they realised the county board weren't going to budge they FINALLY decided to go about things the proper democratic way. FACT

I have no problem with them gathering support from the clubs to vote Ger and FM and anyone else out. I have a huge problem with their strike and their behaviour before that.

The GAA is democratic, you change things democratically and if you don't believe its democratic then why are the players now trying to gather support through the proper channels ?

These players would do anything for ya, they will work for you and no one will try harder.

Will Donal Og f**k off and leave the hurling to real men with an ounce of decency, honesty and honour ? Because thats all I want him to do. People like Donal Og and Dessie represent a disease that is going to destroy the association as we know it.

No one wants to improve, they, especially Donal Og are the ultimate inch fighters according to Corcoran and will do anything to improve.

My apologies, if Brian Corcoran said it then it must be true  

They'd love nothing more then to not have to worry about anything but hurling instead of fighting these stupid battles that are all about FM's petty little games.

Then why is your precious Mr Cusack involved with an organisation who have the ultimate goal of making the GAA professional ?

Ask anyone, any manager, even Cody, who had the most professional set up for the last few years and they'll tell you without hesitation that Cork did..till Gerald came.

They had ONE of the most professional set-ups.

I'm not questioning the players (except for Donal Og's) committment to Cork hurling or their committment to win for Cork and train and play for Cork. I'm trying to make the point that striking when you don't get your own way is NOT acceptable.

IF they were selfish primma donnas they wouldn't put themselves through all of this, months of this, they would have pulled out long ago, would they not have done?

No they wouldn't, this is exactly what they would do as selfish primadonnas.

It's not player power, it's power to the players

Yes, thats exactly what they want.

to the clubs,

If its power to the clubs then the players would not have asked for membership of the selection committee.

They couldn't have done this 5 months ago, the clubs wouldn't have moved an inch and clearly you don't understand why.

Because the players had to scare the clubs into supporting them out of fear of getting relegated to div 2 and spending the next few years building a team. I'm quite well aware of why they wouldn't have moved 5 months ago which makes the players actions even worse.

And if the players manage to pull this one off then they should be given a parade because Cork GAA will be forever gratefull for that.

Should be banned from the organisation for life in my opinion but whatever you think yourself.

Kikenny players have a lot more respect..bullshit, I'm sorry now but you don't know what anyone else would do in this situation.

If the KK players went on strike they would be told to f-off and never set foot inside the dressing room again.

[dowling]

It's easy to be sucked into this misconception that the 2008 panel are now going the 'democratic' route. They are not. They are trying to put pressure on clubs to put pressure on the county board, acting as apressure group within an association that has very definite procedures. If the 2008 panel wanted to be truly democratic some of them would address this through their club/s. And you have to wonder, well why don't they? Maybe this so called 'grassroots' backing isn't what it's made out to be.