McCarthy admits he does not have backing of Cork hurlers

[cicfada]

The co board is seriously in need of surgery  with lots of clubs not having a say and others not being properly represente then by their  delegates. While the playerrs are correct  in a lot of what they say I wish they would stop citiing Mc Carthy's bad memory as eevidence of his shortcomings . Talk about coming acoss like sopilt bastards and petty......he forgot my name, he mixed me up with someone else! Mc carthy will be gone  soon though that is clear!

[Reillers]

Sligeach, how many more times and ways do different people have to say.
This was never about picking the manager.
It was never about the players wanting to do their own thing.

If you read what I just posted or if you bothered actually looking into what's been said over the last few weeks you'd know that there's no democracy in Cork GAA. The Cb don't allow anything but the iron fist rule of FM. No such thing as democracy in the CCB. And I think the 400 plus people who should up last nigh confirmed that. Or how  about the clubs who have come out and said that their views weren't represeneted at the CB meeting. 
The CB don't do their job and they haven't for a long time. If you'd bothered for a single second to actually stop and look around. To read what's been going on you'd know that.
Why don't you actually read the facts instead of coming on here to bitch and whinge.

It's nothing to do with the manager as such, it was the way in which he was reappointed. They don't want to pick their own manager, they just want to play, but the CCB wont let them just play because to do that that would mean they'd be doing their jobs and it would mean that the players were forgiven for 02 which we all know they aren't.
The players are nothing but professional and everyone but McCarthy and his current selectors have only had good things to say about the players. That's managers likes Donal O Grady, John Allen, not to mention the selectors and co who have been and gone.
There's a reason for that.

This isn't player power, this is just the players fighting back  because purely till now, no one has.
The CCB are the biggest disgrace to GAA in the country and really, what you've just done.
So players standing up for their rights and for IC hurling is worse then the disgraceful corruption that has had a stranglehold on Cork GAA for years.

Ya says a lot about you if you think that. 

[orangeman]

Sligeach, how many more times and ways do different people have to say.
This was never about picking the manager.
It was never about the players wanting to do their own thing.

If you read what I just posted or if you bothered actually looking into what's been said over the last few weeks you'd know that there's no democracy in Cork GAA. The Cb don't allow anything but the iron fist rule of FM. No such thing as democracy in the CCB. And I think the 400 plus people who should up last nigh confirmed that. Or how  about the clubs who have come out and said that their views weren't represeneted at the CB meeting. 
The CB don't do their job and they haven't for a long time. If you'd bothered for a single second to actually stop and look around. To read what's been going on you'd know that.
Why don't you actually read the facts instead of coming on here to bitch and whinge.

It's nothing to do with the manager as such, it was the way in which he was reappointed. They don't want to pick their own manager, they just want to play, but the CCB wont let them just play because to do that that would mean they'd be doing their jobs and it would mean that the players were forgiven for 02 which we all know they aren't.
The players are nothing but professional and everyone but McCarthy and his current selectors have only had good things to say about the players. That's managers likes Donal O Grady, John Allen, not to mention the selectors and co who have been and gone.
There's a reason for that.

This isn't player power, this is just the players fighting back  because purely till now, no one has.
The CCB are the biggest disgrace to GAA in the country and really, what you've just done.
So players standing up for their rights and for IC hurling is worse then the disgraceful corruption that has had a stranglehold on Cork GAA for years.

Ya says a lot about you if you think that. 

[/b]


Sligeach suffers the same fate as the rest of us.


Sligeach - you haven't a clue what you're talking about. 


If you don't agree with it, just call them stupid, insult them etc etc.

[Rossfan]

Intersting to see Cork Gaeldom taking its first infant steps towards democracy last night.
Ye were denied the opportunity to decide on Rule 42 but this time go for it lads.

[The GAA]

Its quite telling OM that in the face of overwhelming evidence against everything you've been spouting here for months you can only grasp to this tiniest of straws.

[orangeman]

There's no mention of criticism of Mc Carthy at last night's meeting. The CB was getting the flack. No word of Mc Carthy - but still the 2008 panel felt it appropriate to put forward 2 motions, one of which was a vote of no confiidence in Mc Carthy.

The 2008 panel wiill say and do anything to get Mc Carthy out of the job and get themselves back onto the pitch and all that goes with that. 


Where's the motion of no confidence in Frank Murphy, IF that's all this dispute was ever about. Get FM out.

But the truth is starting to come out amidst all the lies / double speak etc. - this was all about getting Mc Carthy out and the 2008 panel back in.

I've previously alluded to the clubs holding EGMs and I'm glad to see that the penny has finally dropped and the clubs are going to hold them. It's  pity they didn't cop this on sooner.

[orangeman]

I see the number has risen from 300 to 450 - good turnout. I've no doubt that the clubs want the 2008 panel back playing - there's no surprise there. Everybody has asipred to this from the beginning. If the club's beef is with the CB and FM, let them address this - but it looks like Mc Carthy is going to be made the scapegoat for the actions of the board and in particular FM who will still be in place after all this mess is cleaned up.




CORK'S GAA clubs have been asked by their 2008 hurling panel to back a motion of 'no confidence' in Gerald McCarthy's management of the hurling team.


An overwhelming majority of clubs took up an invitation for talks with the players in a special forum that lasted some two and a half hours last night.

And they have proposed a second meeting on Sunday week with the same club delegates to determine if they have sufficient support.

Some 450 delegates gave the players a standing ovation as they entered the room, another sign that the tide in this battle is turning in their favour. They have now been asked to discuss a number of motions by the 2008 squad, principally a vote of 'no confidence' in McCarthy as manager.

Only two members of the 30-man squad were not present in the Maryborough House Hotel, where the presence of Cork footballer Graham Canty at the forum, ahead of his departure for a week-long training camp in Portugal this morning, was a reminder of the potential withdrawal of services by the football squad if a resolution isn't found prior to the championship.

The 2008 hurlers had not expected such a number of clubs to make their presence felt and they were taking it as a sign of encouragement for the stance they had taken.

Afterwards, 2008 captain John Gardiner and Donal Og Cusack issued a statement outlining their desire to see the delegates return to their clubs and seek a final, proper mandate on the senior hurling management. "What we wanted to do was get the view of the clubs and we wanted them to take some stuff back to be discussed at club level – and that's exactly what happened, we were delighted with the outcome," said Gardiner.

Former Cork football selector John Corcoran was one of the delegates present representing his club St Mary's and he gave the players firm backing.

"I think tonight was an ideal outlet for the players to put their feelings across and I think they were asked a lot of questions as to the sequence of events that happened. They put their points across very well and cogently."

[orangeman]

This is very interesting and might be part of a solution as well :


Will Cooney give key role to Frank Murphy ?

Monday February 23 2009

The GAA is great organisation for setting up committees and around now, the incoming president, Christy Cooney from Cork, will be filling appointments for the many committees a GAA president has control over.

In 2006, when the current GAA structures were set up, I counted a staggering 52 different bodies in the GAA's annual report, and presumably this number has not lessened. In any organisation, from the government down, committees have a habit of breeding like rabbits rather than fading out.

Most of these bodies are never heard about, and often have strange names such as 'work groups', 'task forces' and the old reliables, 'sub-committees'. Where would the GAA be without 'sub-committees', or even 'special committees'.

But no organisation that I know of comes up with such exotic sounding names as the GAA. There is a Disputes Work Group chaired by PJ McGrath from Mayo. I wonder what they do, but certainly there is no scarcity of disputes in the GAA from top to bottom. There is a Social and Recreational Games Sub-Committee and there is also a Social/Awards Work Group. There is a Ladies Integration Work Group and a Gradings Sub-Committee. And there is also a committee with the name IT & MIS.

Believe it or not, there is a Playing Gear Task Force and I wonder how often they need to meet under the chairmanship of former Kerry chairman Sean Walsh. There is a national Referees Assessors Task Force and a Code of Ethics Work Group, not to mention a Bye-Laws Sub-Committee. And just in case anybody is forgotten, there is a Sub-Committees Review Task Force.

Allowing for mathematical ineptitude, I make it that 488 people are involved in Croke Park committees from Management Committee and Central Council down. Does the GAA really need all those people travelling around the country to hold meetings? Most of them have accumulated experience over the years and remain on the GAA's statute books without ever having their terms of reference analysed.

Incoming presidents have tended to use the appointments to many of these committees as a means of saying 'thank you' to those who backed their presidential election campaigns. Cooney will probably do the same as that is simply the way of the world. Only a very small number of GAA bodies are actually elected, and one of those is the Central Council, whereby each county convention votes for its member. Some other important bodies are, in part, elected by other bodies, such as provincial councils, but also include members appointed personally by the incoming president, who clearly has immense power in that he can appoint people to several very important bodies.

An interesting presidential decision due shortly is whether Cork county secretary Frank Murphy, a long-term supporter of Cooney, will be offered one of the key positions in GAA administration. Most presidents of the past 20 years have seen fit to single out Murphy for high office, but we will have to wait and see if the recent fiascos in Cork GAA will have any bearing on a similar appointment this time around.

By tradition, and the GAA swears by tradition, defeated and/or future presidential candidates are awarded high-profile appointments by the incoming president, and therefore Liam O'Neill, already favourite to replace Christy Cooney, can be sure of receiving an important job shortly.

The Management Committee is THE most important body among all the GAA committees. It is, in effect, the board of directors of the GAA, but strangely the incoming president has very little say in who becomes a member of this important body.

The four chairpersons of the provincial councils are automatically members of management and there are other automatic positions also. There was an historic decision made a couple of years ago when 'an outsider', Dr Tony Meenaghan, professor of marketing at the Smurfit Graduate Business School, was co-opted onto the Management Committee, and this is something many other GAA bodies could follow to good effect.

There are hundreds of outstandingly qualified people in all walks of life who are very dedicated GAA people, but, because they never had time to battle their way through the tortuous politics of the GAA from club level up, do not take part in the running of the organisation. This appointment was a major break with tradition and could well start a trend, but only if GAA rules are altered in many cases.

On a small number of the 52 GAA committees other outside experts in various fields, such as medical people, have also been brought in because of their GAA background -- former Dublin footballer Dr Pat O'Neill being a good example. But in general, these committees, task forces, etc, are the preserve of those who have laboured hard and long in the vineyard of the GAA and are being thanked by a president elect for that.

POSTSCRIPT: It was Mark Twain who said one time, "Reports of my death are greatly exaggerated", which was fairly self-explanatory. On Saturday night, when making presentations at the Clonguish GAA dinner in Longford, I got a salutary reminder of the same phrase and it is not a pretty feeling. While listing a group of selectors who were in charge of a Longford SFC double team 40 years ago, I mentioned that they had all passed away. When laughter broke out in the audience I got that sinking feeling which immediately requires that the ground opens and swallows you.

One of the group, Tommy O'Malley, has not only not passed away, but turned up minutes later to receive, from me, his award along with the players. As a great Clonguish clubman in good times and bad for 50 years, Tommy was able to see the funny side of it -- for which the Lord be praised!

- Eugene McGee

[johnneycool]

Taken from rebelgaa and a poster named Podsy, who was at the meeting tonight.....


"Right, I'm tired so this is a brief re-cap. As honest as I can possibly be.

Players entered to a huge standing ovation. Of the 400plus in attendance, only about 10-20 stayed sitting.
Gardiner said that the agenda was really up to the clubs, but maybe they'd start with questions from the floor, then talk about clubs' and players' proposals and solutions.

Alan White spoke - explained himself very well in fairness. Said that his information came from an ex-player (non-2008), that he asked the CCB if the players could agree to any of the Croke park document. The Executive told him they agreed with all of it except point 2. White said that, as this seemed to confirm what he'd heard, he thought nothing of stating that he'd heard such. At this, he said, the top three officials all feigned surprise, despite the fact that they'd just said much the same thing, and despite the fact that Frank Murphy had at that moment in his briefcase a letter from Gerald McCarthy saying exactly the same thing. Frank later said that he hadn't intended reading out the letter but he may as well now, which he did. White said that had the letter been been read out first that he wouldn't have spoke at all, that he was sorry he had, and he apologised for any confusion or hindrance he'd caused. John Gardiner told him it was alright, and White got considerable unsolicited applause for showing up and for being honest.

The vast majority of the speakers that followed spoke in favour of the players' stance, with only a few urging a return to playing. Most urged them to continue, and urged fellow club folk to continue the fight.

Most of the speakers, it seemed to me, were from Junior clubs and there was incredible anger at the lack of representation, or the absence in a lot of cases. Many intermediate and Senior clubs joined in, again overwhelmingly in favour of the players and anti-CCB

Many speakers stated that their clubs had held EGMs, many more said that EGMs were planned, urging others to follow. One member backed the players but urged them not to suggest EGMs as this would split clubs in two, and got some applause. Another asked why anyone would be in favour of democracy, and insisted that clubs should hold EGMs. This near brought the house down.

At this stage, the meeting seemed to be controlled almost entirely by the clubs. Enough anger at the CCB had been vented so the next step seemed to be to ask for proposals. Proposals from the floor included holding an annual such meeting of all club people (warm applause), suggesting further dialogue (muted response), that the 'kids' should go home and talk to their parents (a lot of rage and an indignant response from Cathal Naughton that he found the suggestion insulting and that, besides, if he went home and told his parents that he was going to play under Gerald Mc that he wouldn't wake up in the morning). Most though were curious as to what the players were proposing, so Gardiner read out their two suggested motions for clubs to consider within their clubs and act upon if they saw fit (these will be in the papers, but I'll give them to ye as best I can):-

1) Save in relation to routine matters such as fixtures, venues etc that delegates to the CCB do not vote on any matter without having time to talk to their clubs' Executives as to how they should vote (requires 70/30 majority)

and

2) That Gerald McCarthy and his management team resign as the 2009 Senior Hurling Management Team (requires 51/49 majority)

There seemed little doubt that both votes would have carried comfortably had they been put to the room, and the discussion that followed mirrored that.

At that stage the meeting was, as the players thought, winding to a close. However some members intervened strongly and suggested two further actions for the night.

Firstly, that the members go back and talk to their clubs, and that a follow-up meeting be called therafter. The players hadn't seemed to have bargained on this but said they were available whenever suited. It was fixed for Sunday the 8th March.

Secondly there was a fear that the huge turnout, the spread of the attendance throughout the grades, and the overwhelming support might not be credited or recorded. A roll-call of the clubs present, and their grades was proposed, and quickly agreed upon. This was done. I couldn't put an exact number on it, of course, but clearly the vast majority of clubs were present, which led to the obvious conclusion that the vast majority of clubs are now pro-the-players and Anti-CCB.

Nearly there now!

Only fair to say that the meeting was extremely decorous, and that all members were allowed time to finish their questions/comments.  Those in the minority had their say, and I was proud to be a part of such a dignified meeting held in such controversial times.

Finally, I hope everyone believes me when I say that I've been as honest as I can be, and I've tried to report it free of spin. I'll think of more, I'm sure, but that will have to wait until the morning. I'll finish with  what seemed to be a consensus of actions among the clubs

1) Those clubs that haven't already to set the wheels in motion to call EGMs as soon as the constraints within the rule-book will allow
2) Clubs to discuss both motions, and gain a consensus
3) Meet players again on Sunday the 8th March

'Night all.

Pods."

This is the sort of thing the players should have been doing months ago.

Now they have a path through the correct process' providing that the clubs follow through with the rhetoric.

[The GAA]

It wouldn't have worked months ago johnny. only now, with all that has passed, have they got the full attention of the clubs.

[orangeman]

It wouldn't have worked months ago johnny. only now, with all that has passed, have they got the full attention of the clubs.

It wasn't tried.

[The GAA]

It was tried many times. how long is it since the very motion that the clubs are now going to propose again to ensure club consultation before important votes by delegates was defeated? a month? less?

[The GAA]

Just one of the many things you've been told consistently from the beginning here...

[orangeman]

The last strike was over in a few days. The union had not envisaged such a long strike this time around ( and it's NOT over yet ).

[youngfella]

Thanks for trying to some it up all I know it mustnt be easy.

So it boils down to, cork county board mis-managing things and appointing an unsuitable manager.
The cork senior hurling disagreeing with this and take a stand.
The cork players, decide not to take to the field to punish the county board.

Results
cork are a shadow of there former selves.
young blood and fellas who wouldnt normally make the bench are starting.
Cork gets a tanking, hurling suffers.
Both sides stand firm, kilkenny go further ahead.

Solutions??v
Change of the cork county board? review by the Gaa to ensure this doesnt happen again
Ignore the real cork players, There getting on any way and will soon be of little use. - change the players 
Give someone else the thankless task of managing this outfit, its an junction between old and new. - change the manage 

How have I done? Is this correct, apart from the solutions