McCarthy admits he does not have backing of Cork hurlers

[Reillers]

What's this about a protest?? Ffs will have to endure that guy with the sombrero on the 9 o clock news....yet again. I get the impression that the Cork public have more on their plates at the moment.

No see that's where your wrong, in the doom and gloom that is the weather and economy sport GAA, hurling especially in Cork, is what we cling to. It's our escape. It's the same up and down the country.

[heffo]

What's this about a protest?? Ffs will have to endure that guy with the sombrero on the 9 o clock news....yet again. I get the impression that the Cork public have more on their plates at the moment.

hurling especially in Cork, is what we cling to. It's our escape.

It's going to be a long, cold winter so.

[Eoghan Mag]

Is there anyone left in Cork today? I thought the rain might have washed ye all away!

[Bud Wiser]

here we are 5 plus pages latter and you haven't said a word about it..that shows me what type you are.

Reillers, it's not the pages you should have counted but the time in between.  One post I made about 9.30 in the morning, the other around 8pm at night.  Reason? Well you see in Dublin I have to do a bit of work to pay for my car wheras in Cork it would appear they go on strike to get a car.

Who would you say will be interested in sponsoring the Cork senior hurling team this year, based on the return they will get from the "Cork hurling public" ?

[Reillers]

here we are 5 plus pages latter and you haven't said a word about it..that shows me what type you are.

Reillers, it's not the pages you should have counted but the time in between.  One post I made about 9.30 in the morning, the other around 8pm at night.  Reason? Well you see in Dublin I have to do a bit of work to pay for my car wheras in Cork it would appear they go on strike to get a car.

Who would you say will be interested in sponsoring the Cork senior hurling team this year, based on the return they will get from the "Cork hurling public" ?

And yet here we are a couple of pages after that and still no apology.
I suppose I shouldn't expect one from what was it, from your "type."

[Bud Wiser]

Get over it.

[Uladh]

Some things never change.


Particularly Bud

[dowling]

Cheers Reillers even though it wasn't all your own effort but appreciate it. I have to agree with Tatler Jack though, it's all too general and his response would be fairly spot on for me. What that original post shows is the unreal analysis that one man can be blamed for all Cork ills. In the case of the present dispute G McC is getting the blame for Cork's failure to win. Yourself and others keep writing how everthing isn't black and white and maybe you all need to revisit your opinion making processes. Not only is it slightly unreal to expect that Cork's fortunes would chage without these two men but the manner of what has gone on can only be damaging to Cork. The 2008 panel believed their strike would effect change but so far it hasn't and is some way off from achieving any but I don't think they foresaw the mess that now exists. Surely there must be some among the panel who regret what they've caused by the strike.

[Bud Wiser]

Particularly Bud

?? Explain?

[orangeman]

Did anyone hear the song tonight on Failte Isteach about the Cork hurling strike ?? It goes to the tune of the Hallelujah song.


Did you see the banner the Dubs supporters had about Bernanrd Brogan - it said Brogan strikes quicker than a Cork hurling panel !

Also found this on youtube  -


http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Jf_g4RGTjuE

[Reillers]

The songs good enough in fairness.

The video, I've seen it all ready, it looks like it was made by a 12 year old girl, one of tose vids you'd find on bebo. But the point is still pretty much there..when the strike is on.

[RedandGreenSniper]

Did anyone hear the song tonight on Failte Isteach about the Cork hurling strike ?? It goes to the tune of the Hallelujah song.


Did you see the banner the Dubs supporters had about Bernanrd Brogan - it said Brogan strikes quicker than a Cork hurling panel !

Also found this on youtube  -


http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Jf_g4RGTjuE

The song would bring a tear to your eye

[Reillers]

Saturday, January 31, 2009

Murphy must talk Frankly to Cork public

THE 2008 players' press conference was significant for two reasons — because the Cork public may want an explanation from Gerald McCarthy as to why he continued as manager having told a player, Niall McCarthy, that he wouldn't unless he was wanted by the players and also because many of the players, experienced and inexperienced, spoke, with all available for media questions.


They have put their faith in the public and the clubs and have also given every panellist an 'out' — they can go back playing or retire if support isn't forthcoming.

That's very honourable and puts to bed the idea that some panellists are influencing others.

By contrast, why was this week's county board meeting held in camera, and who makes this decision?




The reasoning behind it wasn't explained, and it gives the impression of having something to hide or fear.

More openness and clarity, not less, is needed around current issues. It wouldn't have harmed the board's officership to explain to the public and ordinary club members why this had to happen, as those ordinary club members and supporters need to hear and see all board business being done openly, properly, honestly — and for the right reasons.

I wrote last week that this is a crisis, and it is. George W Bush lost his authority when he failed to visit New Orleans after Hurricane Katrina. As their leader he failed to engage with his people when their need was greatest.

Frank Murphy is the de facto leader of Cork county GAA and has been for over 30 years, yet we have had no explanations or interviews from him on this issue.

He should explain to the supporters why certain decisions have been made. I know he answered questions at the county board convention in December but he needs to go further.

Under the circumstances he should have come out far earlier to explain what had been done regarding Gerald McCarthy's reappointment.

As this crisis developed, the manager selection panel should have explained why they picked Gerald and why they felt he was the best man in their view, rather than repeating the mantra, "we did things democratically."

Then people would be clear in their minds as to why that candidate was appointed unanimously and why no-one else was considered.

If players wouldn't play for him subsequently at least the reason for picking him would be clear and would dispel doubts (which still persist) that other personal agendas were at work.

Even if the board said 'we feel we can work with him compared to others', that would be a legitimate reason. That's more important than it looks — it's no good having the greatest coach if he's an impossible person that nobody can work with.

Regarding the GAA offer to get involved, the first thing that struck me was that Central Council had initially refused to get involved, and you can understand why.

Then suddenly a source, as yet unnamed, materialises with an offer to help resolve the matter, but no great details were forthcoming from the county board meeting last Tuesday about that offer.

If the board were moving to make things more open and transparent, delegates should have been told who exactly contacted the board with that offer.

Also, the board was quick to point out that Gerald's position wasn't up for discussion and whoever comes down from Croke Park would talk to the '08 players only, while the county board would talk to Gerald.

This makes no sense. If proper mediation is involved the board and manager are one side, the authority involved, and the 2008 panel are the other. Otherwise it's a farce. Incidentally, the mediation organised by Derry Gowen was always doomed to fail, because the suggestion was that a vote was going to be four-two no matter what: two executive and two management versus two players.

You couldn't expect people to go into proper mediation talks on that score, or where there are preconditions, and it's wrong to cast the players as villains because of their refusal to engage in talks of this kind.

The board can argue that they have "done things by the book" and made a democratic decision, but the big question — maybe for all county boards — relates to the next stratum of the GAA hierarchy.

Who appraises the work of county boards and full-time secretaries (more of who are to come on stream in the near future)? Who determines whether procedures are followed properly or that officers' do not exceed their authority? Is it the Munster Council? Or does Croke Park function like central government, sending in someone to administer a local authority which can't agree a budget or where disputes on procedure arises? Either way, this dispute needs to be resolved. Cork have no "academies of excellence" to fall back on if the top players are unavailable.

One administrator central to this dispute was fond of saying Cork hurlers were like mushrooms, springing up over night. This theory will now be sorely tested. Unfortunately, Cork do not have the mushrooms at present, but for the second year running we have plenty of manure.

* Note: contrary to reports published yesterday, the march in support of the 2008 Cork hurling squad takes place on Saturday, February 7, with supporters asked to gather in Emmet Place before 3pm.

[heffo]

Saturday, January 31, 2009

Murphy must talk Frankly to Cork public

THE 2008 players' press conference was significant for two reasons — because the Cork public may want an explanation from Gerald McCarthy as to why he continued as manager having told a player, Niall McCarthy, that he wouldn't unless he was wanted by the players and also because many of the players, experienced and inexperienced, spoke, with all available for media questions.


They have put their faith in the public and the clubs and have also given every panellist an 'out' — they can go back playing or retire if support isn't forthcoming.

That's very honourable and puts to bed the idea that some panellists are influencing others.

By contrast, why was this week's county board meeting held in camera, and who makes this decision?




The reasoning behind it wasn't explained, and it gives the impression of having something to hide or fear.

More openness and clarity, not less, is needed around current issues. It wouldn't have harmed the board's officership to explain to the public and ordinary club members why this had to happen, as those ordinary club members and supporters need to hear and see all board business being done openly, properly, honestly — and for the right reasons.

I wrote last week that this is a crisis, and it is. George W Bush lost his authority when he failed to visit New Orleans after Hurricane Katrina. As their leader he failed to engage with his people when their need was greatest.

Frank Murphy is the de facto leader of Cork county GAA and has been for over 30 years, yet we have had no explanations or interviews from him on this issue.

He should explain to the supporters why certain decisions have been made. I know he answered questions at the county board convention in December but he needs to go further.

Under the circumstances he should have come out far earlier to explain what had been done regarding Gerald McCarthy's reappointment.

As this crisis developed, the manager selection panel should have explained why they picked Gerald and why they felt he was the best man in their view, rather than repeating the mantra, "we did things democratically."

Then people would be clear in their minds as to why that candidate was appointed unanimously and why no-one else was considered.

If players wouldn't play for him subsequently at least the reason for picking him would be clear and would dispel doubts (which still persist) that other personal agendas were at work.

Even if the board said 'we feel we can work with him compared to others', that would be a legitimate reason. That's more important than it looks — it's no good having the greatest coach if he's an impossible person that nobody can work with.

Regarding the GAA offer to get involved, the first thing that struck me was that Central Council had initially refused to get involved, and you can understand why.

Then suddenly a source, as yet unnamed, materialises with an offer to help resolve the matter, but no great details were forthcoming from the county board meeting last Tuesday about that offer.

If the board were moving to make things more open and transparent, delegates should have been told who exactly contacted the board with that offer.

Also, the board was quick to point out that Gerald's position wasn't up for discussion and whoever comes down from Croke Park would talk to the '08 players only, while the county board would talk to Gerald.

This makes no sense. If proper mediation is involved the board and manager are one side, the authority involved, and the 2008 panel are the other. Otherwise it's a farce. Incidentally, the mediation organised by Derry Gowen was always doomed to fail, because the suggestion was that a vote was going to be four-two no matter what: two executive and two management versus two players.

You couldn't expect people to go into proper mediation talks on that score, or where there are preconditions, and it's wrong to cast the players as villains because of their refusal to engage in talks of this kind.

The board can argue that they have "done things by the book" and made a democratic decision, but the big question — maybe for all county boards — relates to the next stratum of the GAA hierarchy.

Who appraises the work of county boards and full-time secretaries (more of who are to come on stream in the near future)? Who determines whether procedures are followed properly or that officers' do not exceed their authority? Is it the Munster Council? Or does Croke Park function like central government, sending in someone to administer a local authority which can't agree a budget or where disputes on procedure arises? Either way, this dispute needs to be resolved. Cork have no "academies of excellence" to fall back on if the top players are unavailable.

One administrator central to this dispute was fond of saying Cork hurlers were like mushrooms, springing up over night. This theory will now be sorely tested. Unfortunately, Cork do not have the mushrooms at present, but for the second year running we have plenty of manure.

* Note: contrary to reports published yesterday, the march in support of the 2008 Cork hurling squad takes place on Saturday, February 7, with supporters asked to gather in Emmet Place before 3pm.

Who wrote that? Not particularly impartial..

[heffo]

BY any standards, the 2008 Cork panel staged an elaborately impressive show in the Maryborough House Hotel in Douglas on Monday evening. The strength of their unity had been questioned. Doubts had been expressed at the resolve of younger players to continue with their exile. By the time the 30 players had entered the room and taken their seats in a carefully choreographed exercise, without a word being spoken they had made their main point.

As always in this affair you could debate how further forward Monday moved the dispute. Arguably not an inch. On the surface, the charge sheet read out against Gerald McCarthy by successive players seemed impressively detailed but without the manager there to engage with the complaints, it lacked real meaning. A day later McCarthy dutifully answered some of the accusations levelled against him and ignored others. It left nobody much further down the road than they had been.

Who that situation suits most is a moot point. Apart from continuing to elicit the support of the Cork public and, by extension they hope, the clubs, the players don't have too many available weapons in their arsenal beyond the extension of the impasse. It is a truism of industrial disputes, of course, that the longer a strike drags on, the broader the impact it will have.

The talk now is of an eruption of civil war in the county but, in truth, the present hurling dispute is a mere skirmish compared to the all-out war that sundered families before and after the 2002 World Cup. Few people ever grew bored or desperate even as the Roy Keane saga drew interminably on, a sense that permeates the air down south now as hopes of a resolution appear to recede by the day.

Now there is fear, though, and likely a hardening feeling as the baptism of fire that is the League awaits a necessarily callow and untested Cork team. First Dublin visit Páirc Uí Chaoimh next Sunday, figuring that a decent scalp should be eminently within their grasp and then, six days later, the bracing prospect of a visit to Semple Stadium where the evening lights will be switched on and Tipperary, presumably in no mood to take pity on their weakened guests.

And in that there is some forlorn hope too that, away from the stage-managed press conferences and the hushed proceedings of committee rooms, a couple of sobering defeats on the hurling field might concentrate minds towards finding a solution, whether that would entail McCarthy walking away or the players finding a way to disband without losing honour, leaving the younger members free to return to the fold should they wish.

Cork people wishing a heavy defeat for their team isn't the most noble of sentiments, of course, but it isn't without precedent. When Stephen Staunton's reign in charge of the Ireland football team was hitting the rocks, the opinion was aired, only half-jokingly, that a few sharp defeats might actually be in the best interests of the team if it ultimately led to the manager's exit.

Staunton never had to face the mutiny of his players, of course, but the same principle applies. In general, the majority of the American public would be indifferent, if not supportive, of their troops as they jetted off to war until pictures of body bags arriving back at airports opened their minds to the awful reality of battle. Who knows whether the corpse of a Cork team leaving Semple in two weeks' time could have a broadly similar impact?

The chances of a major breakthrough before that date with destiny are virtually non-existent. The motion fielded by Cloyne at Tuesday's county board meeting, which sought a full debate on the dispute at club level, was always doomed to failure but the manner of its defeat, and the exclusion of reporters from the room, merely served to focus more attention on the board itself and, in particular, on Frank Murphy, Cork's long-serving secretary.

In seeking to draw Murphy and the board towards centre-stage, the players alluded to a strange irony in the whole story. Essentially, the criticism aimed at Murphy is that he is an old-school official, critically out of step with the needs of modern players and, even if that is an arguable assertion, it is also one that cannot go without qualification.

When Seán óg ó hAilpín spoke of standards slipping in the county, members of the management team were quick to take umbrage. They would reason that the players would have had Murphy to thank when he fought their disciplinary battles in committee rooms over the years and, more crucially, they would point to clubs around the county where some of the best hurling facilities in the country have, under Murphy's shrewd guidance, been assembled.

They would see clubs like Sarsfields in Riverstown, a few miles east of Cork city. At the moment, Sarsfields are installing floodlights, a hurling alley and upgrading their pitch to a sand-based surface at a cost of €2m as well as investing in another two full-sized pitches further up the road. Last year the club won its first senior county title in 51 years and also retained the minor title they won the year before.

You see it too in the breath-taking surroundings of Mallow GAA club in Carrigoon where McCarthy and his raw band of recruits gather to train. The centre cost €18m to build and contains a floodlit pitch with a capacity of 8,000 as well as facilities that would shame many Premier League football clubs and how incongruous it seems that a county blessed with such world-class facilities at hand could be at war with itself.

It is Thursday evening and with a winter squall thrashing the land outside, life, of sorts, for Cork hurling goes on. Aodhan MacGearailt flits around the corridors, mobile phone pressed to ear, trying to secure a pitch for training that isn't below two feet of water. McCarthy is there too, engaging with his players, a quiet word here, a gentle query there. Life goes on because it has to. There is no other way.

Teddy McCarthy takes a seat upstairs in the lounge. Teddy is a Sarsfields man and, since November, a selector on Gerald McCarthy's management team. Teddy was there too when a row broke out with the footballers in 2007 and, in the fall-out, he lost his position along with manager Teddy Holland. Why he would wish to return a year on and subject himself to another trial is a source of wonder to many.

To McCarthy, it is simple, though, a mix of ambition and the timeless honour of representing your county. "I make no bones about it," he says. "Life is short and a career in sport is shorter. This is a chance I might never have again. It's the same for the players. When I came on board, Gerald was well in position. The process was perfect. The simple fact is the clubs and the county board had put him in."

McCarthy speaks in the same direct style that, as a player, won him four All-Ireland medals as one of the game's most celebrated dual stars. Words and phrases like "make no bones about it" and "bottom line" pepper his conversation and if what he has to say would hardly be likely to appease the players, there is yet the clear sense that he has tried to engage with their position and understand where they are coming from, however wrong-headed he thinks they are.

With the frightening collapse of the economy, he feels it is a good time for all sides to gain a perspective on the dispute. He still holds great respect for the absent players and doesn't see their problems impinging on life outside hurling. A few days ago, he encountered one of the players in a mutual friend's house and they were comfortable in each other's company. They didn't talk hurling, though. There was no point.

For McCarthy, the critical error was committed when Croke Park ushered in Kieran Mulvey as arbitrator to fix the 2007 dispute. McCarthy was a loser then, but insists he feels no sense of bitterness towards the players. "I would have been disappointed with his findings irrespective of what way they went. It went in favour of the players but that's not the point. I've lost All-Ireland finals. That's a bigger disappointment but you take it on the chin. You get on with it."

Following Mulvey's intervention, two players were allowed to be involved in the selection process of the new manager, a concession McCarthy believes to be fundamentally wrong. "I believe players have no business being in that position in any county. Because of what Mulvey did the situation developed this year."

He imagines it did the players no favours either. "What disappointed me about the players was they could not see it coming. I know them and they're smart and well-versed and good luck to them but how they couldn't see the wood for the trees on this issue is beyond me. They were always going to be out-numbered. How did they accept that? They didn't see the train coming down the track." McCarthy didn't see much by way of progress after the well-publicised events of the week. On Monday, Donal óg Cusack reminded the gathering in Douglas that the players' released statement wasn't calling for any resignations, but McCarthy isn't of a mind to play around with semantics. "If you want to get to the nitty gritty," he says, "they want to get rid of us the same way they got Teddy Holland out last year.

"If you look at how the players started out, it was on the basis that the process was flawed. Was it not proved to them that it wasn't? I don't know. Then they started after Gerald McCarthy. Now it's Frank Murphy and the executive. On Monday, it started to get personal with Gerald. I mean how many angles can you have? I haven't a clue. All I can do is reiterate that we want every player available that can enhance and move Cork forward."

Croke Park's sudden intervention after a protracted silence surprised but barely heartened him. They have been in touch and Gerald McCarthy has given his commitment to engage in negotiations but, as of yet, they have heard no response from the players. McCarthy is not hopeful that much will come from it.

He wonders too at the position of the GPA, where the supposed players' representative body has been when its members are locked into such a divisive struggle. "What are the GPA doing about this? Sitting on the fence? Why don't they come in and put their tuppence in? If they've something to offer I'd be glad to see them come in. If this was English soccer, do you think the PFA would stay out of it? Or any other sport for that matter."

He doesn't know how or when it will end, just that they have 36 players committed to the cause and they face the difficult job of moulding them into inter-county players. If that is the way it has to be, then they see little else to do but get on with it.


------------------

Teddy Mc - Legend