McCarthy admits he does not have backing of Cork hurlers

[Zulu]

Jesus lads it is a CB problem, it is the players V the CB and it is simple as that. But everything that needs to be said about this dispute has been said so I don't know why some of you are still posting on this topic. We will all know how this is going to pan out when the national league starts, depending on results the pressure will come on one side or the other. But it is time to put this to bed, there is nothing new being said and there are no developments emerging so all that is being posted is rehashed waffle.

[AZOffaly]

__________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

(Drawing a line under this for now)

[Reillers]

Is anybody from the county board / managment talking to them at all Reillers ?

Why is Seanie Mc Grath putting his head above the parapet ?

Because he's worked with them, he knows them. He knows what's really going on. How they are really being treated. He knows at the end of the day that they are the good guys in this in their own strange way. They are the ones who want to best for Cork hurling. He knows the players are good people, good players, hard and honest and he wouldn't be working with them other wise. He likes them. (waits for the conspiracy theory of them hypnotising him or something as ridiculous from certain people on here.)
He knows them, he knows that these guys have and will put their bodies, careers and reputations on the line for the good of Cork hurling, despite what everyone in the media who likes to spin a factless story thinks, they've only ever wanted what's best. He trusts them and he knows the truth which is a dalmside more then 90% of the people out there speculating and he wants to help them.

You've been really passionate all along in support of the players and fair play to you - but are you really trying to suggest that the players are acting ONLY in the interest of Cork hurling by going on strike for the 3rd time in 6 years, by withdrawing their services, by engaging in a shameful media led campaign against one of Cork's most decorated sons ?? This campaign has failed misersably by the way.


Here's a thought - let's say in 10 years time or whatever, Sean Og OhAilpin is appointed manager of Cork and let's say there was a brilliant Cork team who had just enjoyed the glory years previously with 3 or 4 All Irelands, and when Sean Og comes along, he runs into an awesome KK team and goes 2 years without winning an AI ?

How would he feel if the players came out in force against him and abused him publicly and accused him of telling lies etc etc etc ( not that Sean Og would ever do such a thing and I'm not suggesting that he ever would ) ?

No, well the board hasn't got the best interest of Cork hurling at heart, it never has and I doubt it ever will with these idiots leading it. TBH all this about the players is taking away the real problems with the CB, the underage structure (well lack of one) the clubs standing still..etc.
Gerald at one point I think wanted what is best for Cork but I think somewhere along the way in all of this it became more about personal pride then anything. The players I believe out of the 3 of them, the CB, McCarthy and the players, their minds have stayed the clearest, their goal has never changed. And I think that if they hadn't made such a liathrodi of it in the media then more people would see it.

In 2002 they stood up for their BASIC rights, they were getting treated appaulingly by the CB, they stood up against the bullies and they rightfully won, but the tension, the bitter under current has never left since then. The one in 2007 was just a build up of that tension coming to a climax but incase ye forget the hurlers went on strike backing the footballers, in sympathy for them, as they had done for the hurlers in 2002. Despite the fact that they had the most to loose, they ended up being the front man for the strike because they were a hell of a lot more popular then the footballers, they went on strike knowing that their sympathy with the public was growing ever thin. And we've been through God knows how many times about this time.

Gerald Mac is a decorated son of Cork, but he is the one who's been shameful when it's come to engaging in a disgraceful media led campaign, but he's played it so well that people aren't going like, what kind of person leaks private documents that would destroy any hope of reconciliation with the players and any little trust that was left, instead everyone's going oh poor Gerald, he's wrapped the media around his little finger, he's not as nice as he seems, but he's got 90% of the average joe readers believing him even though a lot of what he's said could be called lies. He's the one who went to the media first, he's the one who's been whinging looking for sympathy all the time, he's a legend he is, but there was a while back where you couldn't turn on the radio and he wasn't on it, and the players had kept quiet and they did so for about 2 or so weeks while he was getting everyones sympathy vote, they wanted to keep it as inhouse as possible but he went crying to the moon, he's the one who keeps making it personal, but you wont admit that or you don't see it, and I agree with you, the players have really screwed up with the media this time and like I said that average reader will only see oh poor Gerald, and wont look any further then that.  

But despite the overwhelming oppinion, the overwhelming backing of Gerald McCarthy the players continue to stand up for what they consider to be right, they don't care what anyone thinks of them and their attitude has shown that. Gerald though, it's seems to me that he's only stayed because his pride is hurt, and that means what he's doing is to get his own personal pride back, he's doing what's best for him, as good a player as he was, he's turned this into a get revenge for saying my training was crap, campaign and he's too stuborn to give in. The players though, if they were in it for their personal pride, for themselves, to make them look good they wouldn't be acting like they are, they wouldn't have stayed in the fight because clearly the overwhelming oppinion is backing Gerald, but that's never stopped the players before and it wont this time.

[The GAA]

I'm not happy with the line being red.....



The county board knowingly appointed a poor coach for the senior team to "get at" this particular bunch of hurlers. that is the specific skirmish in this case.

a well calculated move imho as they can point to McCarthy's club and playing record as a defense of their decision.

If you want to address a more general point, the CCB are willing to sacrafice 1 or 2 years of competitiveness on pitch in order to move some players on.

[Reillers]

I'm not happy with the line being red.....



The county board knowingly appointed a poor coach for the senior team to "get at" this particular bunch of hurlers. that is the specific skirmish in this case.

a well calculated move imho as they can point to McCarthy's club and playing record as a defense of their decision.

If you want to address a more general point, the CCB are willing to sacrafice 1 or 2 years of competitiveness on pitch in order to move some players on.

Like I said, like Tom Humphries said way back in the Cork-Galway match, control over success. And one or two years, if were lucky, 5 or 6 years. The damage will be uncalculable. It'll be years until we recover from this, and bar a miracle, a hell lot more then 1 or 2 years.

"What was going through the minds of a few county board men as they saw the spikiest team in Cork's turbulent history being ribboned and shredded and their totem, their leader, taking the long walk. A championship defeat, yes, but control, complete control of the hurlers back with the blazers?"
-Humphries after Donal Og was sent off against Galway.

The only thing, the ONLY thing this board has ever wanted was control and then maybe success if it could be managed, but on their terms. See the period of dominance from 2003 on wasn't good enough, no, no because they weren't involved. They know, we all know that the players did it inspite of the board, and that to the board isn't good enough. They didn't have the power and say in it as they would have liked. So when Allen was gone, instead of doing the right, smart, proven system of looking within his backroom team, men who at least earned an interview, they blatantly gave two fingers to them, and the players by appointing an outside man, a yes man, their man. They were taking control back. They didn't care and they still don't that Gerald is not the right man for this, they don't care about results as much as they do about power and appointing someone like Cunningham would be loosing power. They don't care how bad a manager Gerald has been with this team, how bad the relationship had gotten, before all this happened, they knew full well that this was on the cards, they were very well aware that they needed a mediator to get through the season. They knew how poor the training session had become, they were very well aware of all the players grievences..so what do they do, they bring him back with one intention and one intention only, to get rid of what is left of the only people who will stand up to them and it couldn't have gone any better for them. Anything that the players say, no matter how right or true it is is speculated on and judged and second guessed and seen in a bad light, they'll always be the bad guys and anything that the board or Gerald does is the right thing, because it's poor old Gerald.
Let's stop kidding ourselves here, we all know, except Gerald apparently, how poor a manager he's been, and how as soon as this goes belly up, as soon as this team that he has is destroyed (I don't want it to happen but if we're honest we all know that it's only a matter of time) and they'll just wash their hands of him and all the blame will fall squarely on his shoulders, despite the board knowing that this would happen. Gerald Mac is a pawn and the only people who are going to get really hurt in this is him and the kids he's put together as a team. The board know that there is a tiny, tiny chance of anything good coming from this but they are willing to loose some of the best hurlers this county has ever seen, use a Cork legend as a pawn in it all and let 30 pllus players get absolutely humilated all in the name of power and control.

[INDIANA]

It dates back to Allen as much as anything for me. The players ran the team in that period. The difference between O Grady and Allen was that you always knew O Grady was in charge. With Allen you never felt that, and the team was run according to what the players wanted.
The reality is the county board are a joke, but a new manager who isn't known to the players will be unable to work with some of the senior players, some of them want too much of a say. At this stage the best solution is for Mc Carthy to step down and a number of senior players to go. The county board should have a shakeup , but at this stage its about cork fielding a team , and thats the only solution i can see.

[orangeman]

I'm not happy with the line being red.....



The county board knowingly appointed a poor coach for the senior team to "get at" this particular bunch of hurlers. that is the specific skirmish in this case.

a well calculated move imho as they can point to McCarthy's club and playing record as a defense of their decision.

If you want to address a more general point, the CCB are willing to sacrafice 1 or 2 years of competitiveness on pitch in order to move some players on.

Like I said, like Tom Humphries said way back in the Cork-Galway match, control over success. And one or two years, if were lucky, 5 or 6 years. The damage will be uncalculable. It'll be years until we recover from this, and bar a miracle, a hell lot more then 1 or 2 years.

"What was going through the minds of a few county board men as they saw the spikiest team in Cork's turbulent history being ribboned and shredded and their totem, their leader, taking the long walk. A championship defeat, yes, but control, complete control of the hurlers back with the blazers?"
-Humphries after Donal Og was sent off against Galway.

The only thing, the ONLY thing this board has ever wanted was control and then maybe success if it could be managed, but on their terms. See the period of dominance from 2003 on wasn't good enough, no, no because they weren't involved. They know, we all know that the players did it inspite of the board, and that to the board isn't good enough. They didn't have the power and say in it as they would have liked. So when Allen was gone, instead of doing the right, smart, proven system of looking within his backroom team, men who at least earned an interview, they blatantly gave two fingers to them, and the players by appointing an outside man, a yes man, their man. They were taking control back. They didn't care and they still don't that Gerald is not the right man for this, they don't care about results as much as they do about power and appointing someone like Cunningham would be loosing power. They don't care how bad a manager Gerald has been with this team, how bad the relationship had gotten, before all this happened, they knew full well that this was on the cards, they were very well aware that they needed a mediator to get through the season. They knew how poor the training session had become, they were very well aware of all the players grievences..so what do they do, they bring him back with one intention and one intention only, to get rid of what is left of the only people who will stand up to them and it couldn't have gone any better for them. Anything that the players say, no matter how right or true it is is speculated on and judged and second guessed and seen in a bad light, they'll always be the bad guys and anything that the board or Gerald does is the right thing, because it's poor old Gerald.
Let's stop kidding ourselves here, we all know, except Gerald apparently, how poor a manager he's been, and how as soon as this goes belly up, as soon as this team that he has is destroyed (I don't want it to happen but if we're honest we all know that it's only a matter of time) and they'll just wash their hands of him and all the blame will fall squarely on his shoulders, despite the board knowing that this would happen. Gerald Mac is a pawn and the only people who are going to get really hurt in this is him and the kids he's put together as a team. The board know that there is a tiny, tiny chance of anything good coming from this but they are willing to loose some of the best hurlers this county has ever seen, use a Cork legend as a pawn in it all and let 30 pllus players get absolutely humilated all in the name of power and control.

[/quoTE


What credit dd the county board get for Cork winning the AI title in 2004.2005 and before that ? None - no county board gets any credit for winning anything - it's always the players and the manager who gets any credit when they win - nothing to do with the Cork county board or any county board for that matter.

[Reillers]

I'm not happy with the line being red.....



The county board knowingly appointed a poor coach for the senior team to "get at" this particular bunch of hurlers. that is the specific skirmish in this case.

a well calculated move imho as they can point to McCarthy's club and playing record as a defense of their decision.

If you want to address a more general point, the CCB are willing to sacrafice 1 or 2 years of competitiveness on pitch in order to move some players on.

Like I said, like Tom Humphries said way back in the Cork-Galway match, control over success. And one or two years, if were lucky, 5 or 6 years. The damage will be uncalculable. It'll be years until we recover from this, and bar a miracle, a hell lot more then 1 or 2 years.

"What was going through the minds of a few county board men as they saw the spikiest team in Cork's turbulent history being ribboned and shredded and their totem, their leader, taking the long walk. A championship defeat, yes, but control, complete control of the hurlers back with the blazers?"
-Humphries after Donal Og was sent off against Galway.

The only thing, the ONLY thing this board has ever wanted was control and then maybe success if it could be managed, but on their terms. See the period of dominance from 2003 on wasn't good enough, no, no because they weren't involved. They know, we all know that the players did it inspite of the board, and that to the board isn't good enough. They didn't have the power and say in it as they would have liked. So when Allen was gone, instead of doing the right, smart, proven system of looking within his backroom team, men who at least earned an interview, they blatantly gave two fingers to them, and the players by appointing an outside man, a yes man, their man. They were taking control back. They didn't care and they still don't that Gerald is not the right man for this, they don't care about results as much as they do about power and appointing someone like Cunningham would be loosing power. They don't care how bad a manager Gerald has been with this team, how bad the relationship had gotten, before all this happened, they knew full well that this was on the cards, they were very well aware that they needed a mediator to get through the season. They knew how poor the training session had become, they were very well aware of all the players grievences..so what do they do, they bring him back with one intention and one intention only, to get rid of what is left of the only people who will stand up to them and it couldn't have gone any better for them. Anything that the players say, no matter how right or true it is is speculated on and judged and second guessed and seen in a bad light, they'll always be the bad guys and anything that the board or Gerald does is the right thing, because it's poor old Gerald.
Let's stop kidding ourselves here, we all know, except Gerald apparently, how poor a manager he's been, and how as soon as this goes belly up, as soon as this team that he has is destroyed (I don't want it to happen but if we're honest we all know that it's only a matter of time) and they'll just wash their hands of him and all the blame will fall squarely on his shoulders, despite the board knowing that this would happen. Gerald Mac is a pawn and the only people who are going to get really hurt in this is him and the kids he's put together as a team. The board know that there is a tiny, tiny chance of anything good coming from this but they are willing to loose some of the best hurlers this county has ever seen, use a Cork legend as a pawn in it all and let 30 pllus players get absolutely humilated all in the name of power and control.

[/quoTE


What credit dd the county board get for Cork winning the AI title in 2004.2005 and before that ? None - no county board gets any credit for winning anything - it's always the players and the manager who gets any credit when they win - nothing to do with the Cork county board or any county board for that matter.

READ THE POST.
The board had very little to do with the wins in 04-05, the players like I said, like it's been said so many times, the players believe that they won it inspite of the board.

[witnof]

Problem is Reillers that Cork hulers seem to have too many opinions.

[The GAA]

Problem is Reillers that Cork hulers seem to have too many opinions.

Yeah, that sort of thing should be outlawed

[INDIANA]

difference between having opinions and wanting to run things.

[The GAA]

You feel that wanting a transparent and credible process for appointing the manager is "wanting to run things"?

[zoyler]

I havn't posted on this sceal for a long time but the sight of so many complaining about the CB wanting control has finally made me.

Of course the CB want control - its thier job as they are the body resonsible to the clubs for organising and financing the County Teams - they are the ones responsible for getting sponsors - they are the ones who have to cleanup after any mess.  If you think they can be done without or bypassed look at what happened in Roscommon when a lack of control on spending on teams among other things and general lack of control resulted in their  well known financial difficulties.  As the ones who carry the can you bet they want to be in control and so it should be.

[INDIANA]

No I'm talking about within the squad itself. A manager has to be allowed to breathe. As said before when O Grady was in charge , there was no shite taken and he had several run ins with some of the players. But the players respected him. As said before I think under the Allen regime i think the players ran things, and struggled to adapt when Mc Carthy came in, but there also is the issue that Gerald may not be as good a coach as he once was. The problme is a new manager regardless of status will struggle to work with some of the senior players after this.
Cut their losses, mc carthy should go and let the younger players rejoin the squad. The older players have burnt their bridges for me. The county board is a shambles, but the cork county board has been a shambles for decades and people still vote them in. So its hard to have a whole lot of sympathy for cork's plight.

[The GAA]

Not being smart Indy but what about -

You feel that wanting a transparent and credible process for appointing the manager is "wanting to run things"?

?