Cats dominance extends to All Stars list

[Reillers]

I don't understand how so many of ye are picking Canning ahead of Kelly (Wat). Kelly was in line for hurler of the year prior to the AI final and as bad as he played that day he still ended up Waterfords top scorer. In fairness Joe was very good any time I saw him play but he really only faced one decent team in championship and it these performances that decide All Stars. And remember Kelly scored more or less the same against Offaly as Canning did against Cork.

A fair point, but Canning has done it this year at every level he's played at; club, college, came into the Galway team for semi- and final of the league and was excellent in both. It would be a travesty in all honesty if he was to miss out.

Ya true, but lets stop a second. What is the All Star for, what is it rewarding you for? It's given for the best player in the championship. Not who has been fantastic for years underage or who's brilliant anyway and should get an all star even though besides 2 games was shit all season. It is about the best player this year in the championship. Nothing more, nothing less.

[mouview]

Not necessarily true - as I've mentioned on this forum here before, John Leahy got one on the back of an outstanding display in a league final, the same year injury prevented him from playing in the championship. Not axiomatic that All-Stars = Championship.

[orangeman]

On reflection I don't think Canning will get one - has he been nominated for young player of the year ? If so, he'll have to be happy with that.

[Reillers]

But that's the exact same thing, you've got the exact same problem there, he still played one match. Now there's no doubt that the young lad is amazing and better then all of them there..probably put together, even though that's going a bit far, but he played one match, should that justify an All Star or the HOTY og??
Like Naughton is up for HOTY og as well, now he's not as good as Canning, but I think he was one of Cork's most best players through out the championship. Is it right that a player who really well one match, and I know he played out of this world, but is it right that he gets it over players who've been consistently great all season?? I just think that they feel obliged to give young Canning an award, because he finally came and played, but I think that one game shouldn't be enough.

The lads on the Sunday game when picking their team of the year made it perfectly clear that they were picking them from the championship only, not the league. Is that not the same with All Stars??

[EddieMerx]

All Stars is from both the League and Championship, I agree Reillers in that one good game doesn't deserve an All-Star although in this instance it probably could be justified by the fact that he gave one of the greatest individual performances of all time against the second best team in Ireland. It is very hard on other players who have played well throughout the championship but what other forward is capable of giving such a perfromance?? I'm on the fence here as to be honest if he gets one it can be justified and if he doesn't then it can also be justified.

[Reillers]

It would be justified ya, but it's not the point, if we give an all star to him, and I know he was he'll probably be the best player in the country in years to come, but I just think they should wait, wait till he's earned one and really earned one. He was insanely good against Cork, but there are a few things I'd critiize, he still has so much to learn, he tried to do everything himself.
I just think it's pointless giving him an All Star of HOTY Og just for the point of it, there will be plenty of seasons that he'll actually earn it, and I know me saying that he didn't earn it is harsh but in the bigger picture of the young lads who played more and played well. I just think they should wait, because I feel that they are just giving it to him for sake of it. You'll have players then who miss out because of that. There will be plenty of time to give him an all star or even HOTY/Og.

It'll be one thing if he gets an All Star but I'll be really annoyed if he gets HOTY og. That can't be justified, because it'll have the others thinking, he only played one game, we played all season really well, what more do we have to do. Players should be rewarded for playing all season well, not getting a reward for playing, despite how brilliant, one game.

[INDIANA]

don't agree reillers, The reality is Canning was playing on a galway team that were crap this season , on his own up front on several allstar defenders against cork. Naughton who is a fine player was playing on a team playing well against galway. Now if Naughton was on the galway team would he have scored 2-12 against that cork backline? I don't think so. Joe scored heavy in the other games, as well all be it against poor teams. it was single best individual performance i've seen for a decade, when you consider he was on his own marking gardiner,sean og etc at 20 years of age and for that i think he deserves it.

[slow corner back]

Canning also won an all ireland club this year and was was superb in the fitzgibbon final although on the loosing team. To say he only played one good game all year is simply wrong.

[Onlooker]

It'll be one thing if he gets an All Star but I'll be really annoyed if he gets HOTY og. That can't be justified, because it'll have the others thinking, he only played one game, we played all season really well, what more do we have to do. Players should be rewarded for playing all season well, not getting a reward for playing, despite how brilliant, one game.

Where does this nonsense come from that Joe Canning only played one game this year.  He played in the NHL Final against Tipperary and in several other games.  To say that he should not get an award because he only played one game shows how little some people know about the hurling season.

[Zulu]

Nobody is saying he only played one game all year but my point washe didn't deserve an All Star before Eoin Kelly (Wat) as many posters here seemed to suggest. He's performances for both club and college are an irrelevance (incorrectly IMO) when it comes to picking All Stars and league performances are lightly weighted. IMO both John Mullane and Kelly are more deserving of All Stars this year than Canning.

[INDIANA]

naah don't agree at all Zulu, i think Mullane deserves one but i wouldn't have Kelly ahead of Canning. Against top class opposition and playing on allstar defenders on his own at 20 years of age on a team playing badly he nearly beat Cork on his own. That to my mind surpasses anything naugton or eoin kelly did this year. With the exception of mullane i'd struggle to give any of the rest of them allstars after their miserable capitualtion in the all-ireland final. So Canning  deserves both in my view.

[Reillers]

Hang on, what are we giving an All Star for, 99% of the time it's for the championship. Canning I've said a few hundred times now that he's insanely good but I just think that if he get's an All Star or HOTY Og for that matter, it'll be like them giving it to him for the sake of it, he was outstanding against Cork, but at the end of the day, that was one game. I just think he shouldn't get an All Star for one game, as amazing as it was, in the championship.

Is that enough to get an All Star and/or HOTY Og, irrespective of who it is, is one good game enough??

[INDIANA]

it wasn't one game though, he played in the national league, played against antrim and laois and cork. I think Naugton is an excellent hurler and i'm not saying anything against him but:
naughton played against tipp, dublin, galway and the cats.
Naughton was excellent against tipp and  very good against dublin and galway. wasn't good against the cats but neither was anyone else from cork.
Canning was excellent against two poor teams and was absolutely brilliant against the 2nd best team in the country. I agree there isn't much in it but i still come back to the point that Naugton would never have done what Canning did if the roles were reversed that day. Thats the point that tips it for me. I was at the game in thurles and i couldn't believe how good he was. I mean even shefflin isn't as gifted as canning.

I see where you're coming from though, on the point about one game. But the journalists will take the fitzgibbon cup and the all-ireland club into account when they shouldn't really, and Joe Canning is a shoe in for young player of the year as a result. I still think he should get it though for that day aginst Cork. The system doesn't allow Canning to showcase his talents as much as Naughton.

[Zulu]

naah don't agree at all Zulu, i think Mullane deserves one but i wouldn't have Kelly ahead of Canning. Against top class opposition and playing on allstar defenders on his own at 20 years of age on a team playing badly he nearly beat Cork on his own. That to my mind surpasses anything naugton or eoin kelly did this year. With the exception of mullane i'd struggle to give any of the rest of them allstars after their miserable capitualtion in the all-ireland final. So Canning  deserves both in my view.

Ah come on now Indiana, Eoin Kelly was many people's favourite for HOTY, surely your not arguing that flopping in the AI (amongst a whole team that flopped) cancels out all that. There have been a few lads over the years who had very good years but didn't perform in an AI semi or/and final but still got All Stars, and rightly so. An All star is an award for consistently good performances over the duration of a year (championship, in particular) not for one brilliant performance or a player's ability. Kelly was almost as impressive against Offaly as Canning was against Cork, he was good against Antrim, Wexford and Tipperary. So he only played one poor game all year, that was unfortunately in the AI but that shouldn't detract from what was a very good year for him personally.

[youngfella]

He was outstanding against antrim and loais aswell, if it makes any difference. I'd be very surpised if he doesnt get one. I was watching the cork - cats game. I think hickey was amazing, he earned an all star in those two games. As was brain hogan, there wouldnt be many fellas that could keep JT of the team.
I think Aidan Fogarty also deseves a mention, he didnt get the goals that larkin and brennan but he was always keep the score board ticking over.

                       PJ Ryan
Michael Kavanagh Noel Hickey Jackie Tyrrell
Tommy Walsh Brian Hogan JJ Delaney
  James 'Cha' Fitzpatrick Tom Kenny
Eoin Larkin Henry Shefflin Seamus Callinan
Eddie Brennan Joe Canning Eoin McGrath

All the forwards are interchangeable. Joe and henry fight over who takes the frees