So whats the bigger picture?

[feetofflames]

Paul Galvin has done the GAA a favour by showing the disciplinary procedure is absolutely worthless.  People are talking about spending millions on a new rule book.  Can i suggest that the following happens and a line is drawn in the sand ie incidents which ghave taken place before now can no longer be refereed to as precedents. 
The rules of playing the games are drawn up and categories of offences are clearly defined as are punishments.  The book is reduced to quite simply a couple of pages.  The role of tv replay in discipline is either defined as is the final decision of the referee.   the referee becomes sacrosanct although they are heavily trained vetted and privately assessed as often as can be feasibly done. The rule book is for playing the game only and a sperate series of aspirations aims ie constitution eg rule 42 etc  - this is kept separate as part of the GAA constitution and has little to do with playing the games. 
All GAA members sign up to a new code of conduct reneging their right to challenging legally any rulebook implementation and recognising the right of the disciiplinary body to implement GAA law ie the referee to rule the game.  Clubs, counties , individuals must sign up to this before fixtures are announced. 
Lets make one thing clear - there is no grey area surrounding Paul Galvins actions and wrongness, the grey area is to do with efficient, transparent rules.
We should aim for 95 % automatic penalty ie there is little room for doubt / interpretation ie a guy knows he kcks knees etc what he will get for it - discipline should be a mere rubberstamping exercise.  An outlook for appeal for say clubs where they can appeal a referee performance if they deem it to be unacceptable but not individual decisions, penalties are hard on any appealing against the performance of a referee when they are deemed to be michievous.  A small 3 man body overviews this whole prodcedure at county and club level.  They are known to everyone and are appointed by the clubs counties at the start of the year form a shortlist.   
The question we must ask ourselves do we really want a lawyer to write our rulebooks or ourselves.  I could write a new Gaelic Football rulebook myself withing 2 pages in one day.  How many more could here?  We might need a legal mind to have a once over but it would be an honest effort.  Lets stop making a maggie more out of everything.         

[orangeman]

The rugby system of citing commissioners seems to work well - there seems to be a tranparent appeals process - appeals in rugby are few and far between - if you take an appeal and lose, that's the end of the road.


But then, we're not like rugby - the games are different - the rules are different - the cultures are poles apart - the ethos is different in rugby - there is little or no parochial thinking - gaelic games tend to be more insular -


It's a difficult one.

[Leo]

The rugby system of citing commissioners seems to work well - there seems to be a tranparent appeals process - appeals in rugby are few and far between - if you take an appeal and lose, that's the end of the road.


But then, we're not like rugby - the games are different - the rules are different - the cultures are poles apart - the ethos is different in rugby - there is little or no parochial thinking - gaelic games tend to be more insular -


It's a difficult one.

The citing system as in rugby would never work as we in the GAA prefer the nod & wink approach.
Take County A vs. County B.
County A's captain interferes with the referee; B is not goint to cite him for that.
County A player elbows County B player - County B will make shapes, its supporters will growl, but no citing will be made as that would require an honest or brave decision, and fear of reprisal by County A for some other incident would operate.
Just two examples of where our cultures are poles apart.

[Hardy]

I agree. But rugby also has a citing commissioner. That's what we should have - but a commission instead of a commissioner. Or, I should say, we should replace the current unofficial commission, known as The Sunday Game, with an official one (which should be barred from watching The Sunday Game).

[ildanach]

[The citing system as in rugby would never work as we in the GAA prefer the nod & wink approach.
Take County A vs. County B.
County A's captain interferes with the referee; B is not goint to cite him for that.
County A player elbows County B player - County B will make shapes, its supporters will growl, but no citing will be made as that would require an honest or brave decision, and fear of reprisal by County A for some other incident would operate.
Just two examples of where our cultures are poles apart.

but it will be up to the citing commissioner to decide if the citing is valid. Also if one of the teams is taking the piss with the citing than they will lose credibility when it comes to citing in future cases. Indeed it might warrent losing the right to cite for 2 games. in these games only the citing commissioner will be in their corner watching out for them.

As it stands the whole procedure is a complete embarrasment and a shambles. The citig commisoner does not have to be one man, perhaps a panel of 3 ex referees. However it is important that in advance of the games for that weekend the citing commiosner is made known to the public for true transparinsy.

i think we should email croagh park with a definitve (collective) set of proposals when this thread ihas run its course.

[Leo]

My point is that NO county will ever seek to have an opponent cited .....

As for an email to "croagh" park - it is likely to receive a higher audience and more enlightened reply than one to Croke Park

[DUBSFORSAM1]

Just bring in the system they have in the AFL.