Ulster Final 2008 - Armagh vs Fermanagh

[Croí na hÉireann]

Open hands, aimed at the ball, looks ok to me...

[sammymaguire]

Open hands, aimed at the ball, looks ok to me...

Croi - no issue with O'Rourke or Kernan, but Toner should not be involved in the play, his left leg is stopping Keenan move forward with the ball and Keenan knows he cannot turn in that direction to move out of the tackle and play the ball. This is another reason why the fans and pundits complain about the style of negative play. I realise Fermanagh also like to pack the defense but they do not have 3/4 men surrounding the player in possession on regular occurences on each attack... it should be clamped down on by the authorities and referees (tackling from behind is not allowed in the rule book) as this is not enjoyable to look at or play against.

[Fermanaghandsam]

Any more word on tickets lads?  Whats demand like in the counties? Was there last week would love to go back again, might be able to get my hands on 2 pat mcgrane tonight finding out later, just wondering is it going to be close to a full house?

Demand in Fermanagh is the same as last week if not greater, so I would suspect over 30k in Clones on Sunday again.

Really looking forward to the game, hopefully the atmosphere is every bit as good as last week, with a great Fermanagh win at the end of it all 

[corn02]

Sammy you have to be a WUM?

[wanderer]

Now as i've said before i'm slightly bias but there is not a hope that Armagh broke even in midfield. I was at the match and have watched it twice since, and Fermangh had the majority of the possession right the way through the match. Even in the first half, you can talk all you like about Armagh tactics, but Fermanagh men played into their hands which made the Armagh defence look brilliant. Once they had a decent talking to at half tim, they turned it around.
The thing I will give to Armagh was that they were economical with what they had. McDonnell was excellent and Clarke was causing nervous moments everytime he got the ball, but bar that they were nothing exciting.

Armagh2002: No disrespect to fermanagh but i believe we are better in every position 1-15

I'm still trying to work out if you are serious with this? Alright you could have exageratted and said better in most positions, but 1-15 is the biggest load of sh&%e i have read on this board in my life

[FermGael]

Well another Ulster final a waits this Sunday.
From a Fermanagh point of view I think there will be a few changes.  First I think that Lyons will start, whether that be for McDermott or Kelly I am not so sure.
Think that Goan should be given another chance on McDonnell.  He is not as good a man maker as McCluskey but if we are to win on Sunday we need him at CHB organising the defence and setting up the attack.  McCabe is a better player to spring of the bench when Armagh are tiring.  McBarron may get the nod this time.  Again Owens does not look as if he is fit for 70 minutes but Doherty could do a job on the edge of the square either. 
From watching the match it really did surprise me how much the high ball into the edge of the square panicked the Armagh full back line.  Maybe not in the first half, but definitely in the second half.  Francie did not look comfortable on Owens at all.  That is something we must look to exploit.
If we are to run with the ball, we must attack Armagh down the wings.   When you look at the first half again, Fermanagh constantly ran the ball down the middle and Armagh just waited until we spilled the ball and then hit us on the break.  They funnel too many men back towards the goal for this to be effective. Our scores came form when we hit Armagh out wide and at pace. 
As I have previously said, and others too, the main reason we came back into the game on Sunday was that Clucker attacked from CHB and we pressed Armagh in their half of the field.  We must do this again on Sunday.  That really does leave our full back line exposed but that is the risk we have to take.
So far Fermanagh have comfortably won the midfield third and breaking ball against Monaghan, Derry and Armagh.  Armagh knew of our strength there before last Sunday but could do nothing about it.  Will they have learned the lesson this Sunday?? I hope not.
I freely admit that Armagh dominated the first 50 minutes of the match but then again Fermanagh really only played for 20 minutes. Our free taking problem may not be solved for the next day but I cannot see it being that bad again.  We were lucky to get the draw and certainly cannot give Armagh an 8 point lead on Sunday or we will be beat.  We can win this game and we are the fitter team.  So far O'Rourke has had the Midas touch when it comes to substitutions; let's hope it continues on Sunday.

[mackers]

Now as i've said before i'm slightly bias but there is not a hope that Armagh broke even in midfield. I was at the match and have watched it twice since, and Fermangh had the majority of the possession right the way through the match. Even in the first half, you can talk all you like about Armagh tactics, but Fermanagh men played into their hands which made the Armagh defence look brilliant. Once they had a decent talking to at half tim, they turned it around.
The thing I will give to Armagh was that they were economical with what they had. McDonnell was excellent and Clarke was causing nervous moments everytime he got the ball, but bar that they were nothing exciting.

Armagh2002: No disrespect to fermanagh but i believe we are better in every position 1-15

I'm still trying to work out if you are serious with this? Alright you could have exageratted and said better in most positions, but 1-15 is the biggest load of sh&%e i have read on this board in my life

Wanderer, Armagh2002 is the same as a few of the "younger" new Fermanagh posters, poor WUMs. He was dropping Kieran Toner off his team which is strange to say the least.
Typically, the Fermanagh posters are reading a lot into the last 20 mins while the Armagh posters are doing the same for the first 50 mins. Fermanagh posters are citing their players pushing up the field as the turning point whilst Armagh posters are stating their players got too deep.
Sunday will put all this to bed.

[Skiddybadoo]

Armagh unchanged.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/northern_ireland/gaelic_games/7524497.stm

[brokencrossbar1]

Armagh manager Peter McDonnell has kept faith with the same starting line-up for Sunday's Ulster SFC final replay against Fermanagh at Clones.

The Orchard County led by eight points early in the second half of last week's decider but the Ernemen bounced back to secure a second chance.

McDonnell admitted after the game that his side should have won.

Fermanagh will have the services of Shane McCabe who started last week as a late replacement for Liam McBarron.

Glentoran have given permission for McCabe to play in the match.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Armagh: P Hearty, A Mallon, F Bellew, F Moriarty, A Kernan, A O'Rourke, C McKeever, P McGrane, K Toner, C Vernon, B Mallon, M O'Rourke, S McDonnell, R Clarke, S Kernan.

[Rufus T Firefly]

It's all about development for Armagh, we are still in the transition phase for this squad.

– noone else really believes that

Sorry Uladh - but I do. I guess this all comes down to what one defines as 'transition' and what is natural evolvement

I realise that a football team is constantly changing from one year to the next, and for our great side over the period 1999 - 2005, that was approximately at the rate of one or two a year. Both last year, this year, and I would guess next year, that degree of change has increased and will increase. This is necessary as many of the greats on our team are reaching the stage where they wil be considering retirement. I would guess that over the next couple of years Paul McGrane, Aidan O'Rourke, Enda and Oisin will take their leave of us. These boys will have to be replaced and the introduction of Moriarty, Tony Kernan and Vernon to name three, will occur.

I just feel the degree of change is that much greater now that we would have to be considered a team in transition. That though is not to say we do not remain competitive on the National stage. I have been pleasantly surprised at how well we have been doing in this regard. I feel in a year or twos time, we will fall into another period of gradual / natural change that marked the 1999 - 2004 years, with a generally settled team (based on our recent good underage teams) and this will be hopefully a period in which we can move towards another All Ireland winning team.

[sammymaguire]

Boys... clarify, whats this WUM business? if you think I am winding people up then I fear not I am only passing on my comments on what has and what will happen

Sammy you have to be a WUM?

Fermanagh had to wait 26 years for an Ulster Final, now we have 2 in a week. The first one was a warm up for Sunday, it took us a while to get going and to really get into the game but when we got going we outplayed and outscored Armagh and missed a bagful of chances.

This Sunday we won't make the same mistakes and will put Armagh firmly in the Qualifiers

[Uladh]

If all mistakes are removed from sundays game then armagh will bate fermanagh out the gate. they won't be though.

[Onion Bag]

ARMAGH FOWL TACKLES

http://www.gaa.ie/plugins/newsfeed.cgi?rm=content&plugin_data_id=23765

pretty easy to spot the fowl tackle from behind... why didn't the ref? fair enough two men from the side or 1 in front plus one from the side but this type of tackling was going on by the Armagh players continually throughout the 70 minutes and should be stamped out of the game.

how is the player in possession supposed to play the ball when he is being mauled from all quarters? The GAA need to cut this out of the game!

Dry your eyes Sammy, what the Gaa need to Cut out is this diving, Fermanagh man dived in the dying seconds and was give a free against him for throwing the ball not for the dive, he should have been booked 

[sammymaguire]

ARMAGH FOWL TACKLES

http://www.gaa.ie/plugins/newsfeed.cgi?rm=content&plugin_data_id=23765

pretty easy to spot the fowl tackle from behind... why didn't the ref? fair enough two men from the side or 1 in front plus one from the side but this type of tackling was going on by the Armagh players continually throughout the 70 minutes and should be stamped out of the game.

how is the player in possession supposed to play the ball when he is being mauled from all quarters? The GAA need to cut this out of the game!

Dry your eyes Sammy, what the Gaa need to Cut out is this diving, Fermanagh man dived in the dying seconds and was give a free against him for throwing the ball not for the dive, he should have been booked 

You bring your hankies on Sunday Onion Bag cos you Armagh boys will be the ones crying into your beers! All the pundits said this was an Armagh team in transition, it was going to be one of the most wide open Anglo Celts for many years and they were right BUT they were all plumping for Monaghan/Derry to come to the fore not Fermanagh and if this was any other team in Ulster bar Fermanagh, Cavan and Antrim, this Armagh side would be going in as the underdogs cos they are simply not that good. Yes, they have the experience but those experienced legs will be getting tired after two intense games when we get into the last twenty this Sunday and if Armagh do not have a sizeable enough lead then I can only see Fermanagh's fitness, determination and hunger prevailing. Armagh will probably have a man sent off in frustration near the end...

[Onion Bag]

Jasus Sammy you have it all worked out, Any chance you could give me the lotto numbers for sat night?