Monaghan V Armagh

[corn02]

Totally agree Uladh, I think it is madness that people are wrting Armagh off. Last season we went to Donegal expecting to get easily defeated, we got the wrong result but put in the right performance.

[lfdown2]

 

[Main Street]

My point was that it was ironic that banty felt he needed to spin the status of the respective teams in order to get satisfaction. Without looking at sunday's game at all, like it or not Armagh were 6 or 7 short of what will hopefully be their championship side.

I am still confused.
here are Banty's quotes

pre match
"I'm blue in the face from saying it," agrees Monaghan manager McEnaney, "there is no point in anyone talking to me about making a breakthrough in Ulster until we actually do it. The simple facts are that out of the last nine Ulster titles, Armagh and Tyrone have won all of them, so all this talk about some county coming through is only nonsense until it happens."
"We've won two league games out of two but Armagh have the Cross' boys back now and they'll be a different proposition".

Post match
Monaghan manager Seamus McEnaney
03 March 2008

Monaghan manager Seamus McEnaney hailed his side's mental strength after they edged out neighbours Armagh to maintain their 100 per cent record in Division 2 of the NFL.

"You're home with the evening tea in you before you know you've beaten Armagh," 'Banty' joked after Monaghan's 1-11 to 1-10 victory.

"It was a very tight game all the way through. We knew it would come down to a dogfight - the question was 'were we going to come out on the right side of that dogfight?'

"We knew this was a big match psychologically. We were at a crossroads with Armagh. I felt Monaghan were mentally very strong."

He added: "We were four points down at the beginning of the game, went four up then at the other end, looked like we were going to lose the game, and then came and won it."

[mackers]

Main Street, I think most of the Armagh support would recognise that Monaghan are a serious team who are on their way up, whilst we are worried about the future. Sunday's performance from Armagh was an "encouragement" (nothing more) and I would like to concentrate on that positive note, rather than saying Monaghan are over-hyped. I would rather say that the younger Armagh players stood up to be counted when some of the elder statesman were off the park (McGrane) or entering a foulathon (McNulty).




   

[Hank Everlast]

Mc Kinney

Mallon
Bellew
mcnulty/donaghy

McKeever
O'Rourke
Kernan

McGrane
Toner

S Kernan
Mallon
O'Rourke

McDonnell
Clarke
T Kernan

[Imposerous]

I don't think Gareth O'Neill will be McGrane's partner come championship time.  If Francie regains the fulback slot, then Kieran Toner may be the most likely of all the contenders.  Naturally, he seems to have developed further, and was more convincing in his cameo on Sunday than O'Neill has been in the previous games.

Is it foolish to assume that McGrane should not be considered a certain starter come the Summer?  Shouldn't we wait until Lavery and Vernon have been tried?  Have McGrane's performamces been that convincing, or is his leadership indispensible?  If it's an issue of leadship, then A'O Rourke took control of things on Sunday.  

AO'R on Sunday -  and in the earlier games - got me thinking that his role as CHB is seeing him give his most consistent and influential performances.  Are there others in the squad who would thrive in other positions?  It has been mentioned before that AK may be better in a more forward role, though Cross men would say it didn't work out when he played HF for them (can't recall this myself).

[Main Street]

Main Street, I think most of the Armagh support would recognise that Monaghan are a serious team who are on their way up, whilst we are worried about the future. Sunday's performance from Armagh was an "encouragement" (nothing more) and I would like to concentrate on that positive note, rather than saying Monaghan are over-hyped. I would rather say that the younger Armagh players stood up to be counted when some of the elder statesman were off the park (McGrane) or entering a foulathon (McNulty)

Agreed. My point was that Banty didn't spin anything in order to be satisfied or exaggerate the importance of the victory.
Though I tend not to take too much notice of immediate post match comments I would expect a standard of decorum from both the losing and winning manager. I would be surprised if Banty didn't maintain those standards.

[Uladh]

The words you attribute to Banty certainly weren't the ones he used on rte radio directly after the game

[Onion Bag]

I wouldnt have mc nulty near the c'ship team, hes a liability, gives a way too many frees in stupid postions and will get sent off just when we need everyone behind the wheel, his best days are past him, he will only let us down. Thanks but no Thanks Enda, and Good luck

[Main Street]

The words you attribute to Banty certainly weren't the ones he used on rte radio directly after the game

I suggest a possible scenario. You were gutted after the game, emotions having sunk one way, then up the other way, then back to the dark depths at the end and then you heard Banty.
This is what I understood from Banty on RTE straight after the game and wrote on here as soon as I heard it
http://gaaboard.com/board/index.php?topic=6888.msg254628#msg254628

'tough game but Monaghan were the best team over the game against a tough Armagh that has won 7 of the last 10 Ulster titles, Tommy Freeman still not up to match sharpness' 

[HalfFitHalfBack]

Main Street,
In the post match RTE radio 1 interview Seamus McEnaney was heaping praise on his team for beating a full strength Armagh side, those were the words he used.

It was an improved performance from Armagh, but still haven't come close to firing on all cylinders.

Big improvement from Stevie before he was clattered in a heavy tackle. Ronan Clarke was being fouled a lot before the ball was played in, he improved as the game went on and was showing more in last 15 minutes.

Still not convinced by Finn Mo, he's the type of defender that lets his opponent get to the ball first and then try to dispossess/stop him, against some forwards that will be a disaster. Don't like to be overly critical of any lad, and to be fair he has done all that has been asked of him thus far.

As discussed by others Enda gave up a lot of frees, many of them when there was absolutely no need.

Courtney,although he fumbled a few passes, did enough to warrant a few more chances - enough of a showing to suggest he maybe has a future.

I was a bit disappointed with TK's contribution from open play, though SK had a good game - was harshly blown for over carrying.

AOR was impressive again, but still has the tendency to go for a difficult pass which when it goes wrong leaves the defence in all sorts of bother. Example in second half when several Armagh players were passing the ball around the half forward line trying to work an opening, ball was played back to AOR who launched a 50/50, Monaghan won it and then it was a scramble for Armagh half backs (who had pushed up) to get back. I think Monaghan scored from that incident.

Special mention to McKinney who has a solid game in goals and didn't seem to be suffering nightmares from the Westmeath game. No chance for the Monaghan goal, his kickouts were pretty good too.

Mal Mackin is a worker, but I don't think that's what Armagh need as a midfield partner for McGrane. I've seen Lavery play a few times for different teams and would really like to see him given a chance. He has good hands and although clumsy looking (running style a la Alan O'Neill) rarely loses possession and rarely gives a bad pass.

Armagh starting to go in the right direction, but still a serious amount of work to do.

[Uladh]

As i say i wasn't at the game and was dependent on rte for updates. the interviewer prompted banty by starting with "you'll be happy armagh had their crossmaglen contingent on board for the game given the result...." and off he went.

Its an irrelevence anyway. not even the monaghan players give banty much heed!

on the bigger picture 3 games in from an armagh point of view, there are quite a few positives but also quite a few worries. namely

lack of pace in the full bac line without mallon
the foul count at the back (has cost badly in all 3 games)
ak will obviousy play but shows no signs of being able to deal with any forward with any kind of offensive threat
the absence of a second consistent ball winner alongside mcgrane at midfield
lack of a creative influence from the half forward line
clarke's lack of form.

[mackers]

Uladh, think you're being a bit harsh on our back line. With the exception of McNulty against Monaghan and Duffy in the first two matches I think we have defended reasonably well. Finn Mo whilst not the finished article has come on well. If you compare his performance on Sunday to that against Down last year in Cross where Daniel Hughes gave him the mother and father of all roastings, then you can see the improvement. The goal against Westmeath was a goalkeeping error and we haven't been shipping huge scores.
I'd agree that there has been an absence of a regular partner for McGrane but me being an optimist I'd put that down to McDonnell looking at all of his options which I'm sure you'd agree is the right thing to do and added to this is the fact that a few of the options are good ones.
I know you weren't at the match on Sunday but as I said on an earlier post there were signs of some improved movement in our troubled HF line. It'll be one to watch over the next few games.
You're right with regard to Clarke, also McDonnell has only shown glimpses of form and in general our forward play has been poor.

[Throw ball]

Mackers. After getting abuse from you on the golf course for not going to the Westmeath match I made the track to Clones on Sunday. I agree there was a vast improvemnt from the last day I saw them play! However, I believe you are being a bit tough on Clarke saying his form is of. If I remember well he has not played much league football over the last couple of years and his efforts this year have been more concerned with getting fitness and sharpness. I thought when the chips were down on Sunday and he moved out the field he played well and showed others the way. As for Bannon maybe it is just the way that we play does not suit his still of refereeing. Tyrone find it tough to win with Pat McAneaney as ref and I believe he is the best there is.

[Shortso79]

On a funny note.....

What about the umpire falling behind nets when he was about to signal a wide ! Classic

Got the biggest cheer of the match !