The 2008 US Election thread

[Hardy]

But seriously, Seanie - has he said anything specific at all? What is he talking about not turning back from and what is he talking about changing and, most importantly, what is the change going to be? I'd love to believe in the fuzzy stuff, but until we're told what it means I have two choices - take it on trust or assume it's flimflam. I'm not much good at taking on trust.

[magpie seanie]

There's actually a fair bit on his website http://www.barackobama.com/issues/ that I read that's contains some detail. His second book "The Audacity of Hope" outlines the change he believes needs to take place. I found the book excellent. The website is good too.

[J70]

If you thought Joe Biden's bizarre reference to President FDR calming the American public on tv after the Wall Street crash was bad, take a look at this mess!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npUMUASwaec&eurl=http://www.dailykos.com/.

There were rumours earlier that McCain wanted to postpone the VP debates as well - if this is any guide to what we can expect from the hockey mom, it's no wonder!

[DrinknHarp]

Could be mistaken but I think I read that Palin has declared that she has visited Ireland.

Her plane touched down at Shannon to refuel on her one and only trip abroad.

I once touched down on a broad named Shannon but didn't need a plane  

[stephenite]

That's a fine piece by Keillor. And it asks the question too few have asked - where were the cops?

Unfortunately, I'm not convinced about the alternative to McCain either. I haven't seen the slightest shred of evidence of an ounce of substance in Obama's rhetoric. It's all aspiration, sound-byte and non-specific exhortation. It reads like the stuff that fella with the portentous delivery who died recently used to read out in movie trailers:

It's coming. To a rally near you. Barack Obama will thrill you with his presentation, amaze you with his stagecraft, bewilder you in trying to figure out what he's talking about.

"America cannot turn back". Turn back from what, who or where?

"We are going to change". Great. If it needs changing. What are you going to change? Silence.

"This is a movement". Well so is what happens when I go to the toilet, but I don't expect people to vote for it.

I think empty rhetoric is still far better than the alternative

[Tyrones own]

Any of you care to touch on Jim Johnson or Franklin Raines or should I post a link

I think empty rhetoric is still far better than the alternative

Oh Holy Fcuk......

[Declan]

So Washington Mutual gone now and the bail out deal not agreed yet - Oldest member of White House press corp has an interesting article here:

Republican Government-Bashers Line Up for Federal Aid

by Helen Thomas

What has happened to those conservative Republican leaders whose mantra was "government is the problem -- not the solution"?

Tell that to the once-bloated financial giants now standing in line for whopping government handouts to the tune of $700 billion. And who can forget those who wanted to "get the government off our backs"? Their silence now is deafening.

In the rush for bailouts for the hard-hit government mortgage finance giants, the U.S. Treasury seized control of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac and is trying to rescue American International Group, the largest insurer of the world. It allowed 158-year-old Lehman Brothers to collapse, but came to the rescue of the Bear, Stearns, another Wall Street firm.

What about the thousands of suffering homeowners who face mortgage foreclosures? They are at the end of the public trough and almost forgotten in the scramble to protect Wall Street. And what about the failed CEOs who hope to walk out the door with obscene multi-million-dollar golden parachutes and big bonuses?

Isn't there something wrong with this picture?

Both Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson and Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke have worked out a plan to pass on the price of the bailouts to the American taxpayer. Congress is still scrutinizing the proposal.

The U.S. financial mess has rippled through other economies of the world. The fault rests with Wall Street greed, which brought on good times for the high rollers, who thought it would never end. And it rests with the federal government for its failure to police mortgage lenders.

Republican lawmakers and presidents who abhor government restrictions and oversight because of their anti-government philosophy have put America in a critical financial state.

We should be looking at the Franklin Delano Roosevelt blueprint. People were in despair after the stock market crashed in 1929 and the Great Depression slowly settled in. They lost hope until FDR took office in 1933 and told Americans in his first inaugural address that we had nothing "to fear but fear itself."

Roosevelt, thinking of the poor and desperate, created several New Deal programs to put people back to work. He was viewed as a savior at the time by millions of Americans, but he also had bitter detractors who resented his radical steps.

I remember the suffering during the Depression in my hometown of Detroit and the long lines of forlorn men, standing in the dead of winter outside the auto factories, hoping for jobs. The popular song on the radio was "Brother, Can You Spare a Dime." The best-selling book was John Steinbeck's "The Grapes of Wrath."

Roosevelt was innovative. Some programs worked, some didn't. But many remain today to provide some sense of security, like the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation, the National Labor Relations Act to protect unions and the Social Security system to help the elderly. In the 1930s, 9,000 banks closed down. Today we have to ask: Why didn't the so-called experts see the storm coming in the 21st century?

Ironically, the remaining affluent and the poor are now on the same page with Abraham Lincoln, who said: "Government should do for people what they cannot do for themselves."


Coincidentally I started reading the Grapes of Wrath again last month -l had forgotten what a great read it was

[Ash Smoker]

The first big debate tonight.
Hopefully Obama tears McCain a new one. 

Also from that CBS interview, I can see why the McCain campaign have been trying to hide her.
She is extremely lightweight.

The worse the financial crisi gets, the better for the Dems as it was Republican ecomonic policies that brought about this mess.

[J70]

You can't blame it all on the GOP. The Democrats seriously pushed for sub-prime lending. There is plenty of blame to go around.

[Tyrones own]

You can't blame it all on the GOP. The Democrats seriously pushed for sub-prime lending. There is plenty of blame to go around.

Of course he can J when his head is firmly planted in his Arse

[Tyrones own]

The first big debate tonight.
Hopefully Obama tears McCain a new one. 

Also from that CBS interview, I can see why the McCain campaign have been trying to hide her.
She is extremely lightweight.

The worse the financial crisi gets, the better for the Dems as it was Republican ecomonic policies that brought about this mess.

Really....   take the blinkers off for a few minutes and educate yourself: 
http://www.nypost.com/seven/09262008/postopinion/opedcolumnists/alarms__denial_130763.htm
Perhaps Barney Frank is a Republican at Heart

[Ash Smoker]

Sarah Palin sounds like David Brent from The Office here. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKhp8PQ9_Mk&eurl=http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055386684

[Ash Smoker]

Really....   take the blinkers off for a few minutes and educate yourself: 
http://www.nypost.com/seven/09262008/postopinion/opedcolumnists/alarms__denial_130763.htm
Perhaps Barney Frank is a Republican at Heart

So the Republicans saw it coming all along?
They didn't make much effort to push through the legislation.

[magpie seanie]

They didn't make much effort to push through the legislation.

Yes - because Government should leave the market alone. Government is bad. Unless they are handing you billions of dollars....

[dodgy umpire]

obama held his own and more in the foreign policy debate , good news considering this was deemed to be his weak point