Iran are ok.

[J70]

As has been quoted and cliched many times, the only really dangerous nuclear power is the US and still the only outfit to use nukes on civilian populations. Hereiam is absolutely correct. For example, If Bush had really believed that Saddam had weapons of mass destruction, he would never have invaded, too f@ckin risky. His da conned Saddam into invading kuwait the first time round ffs!!
Notice he hasn't made too many moves on Korea...much as he'd like to. Scared shitless of them, that's why. I've no big time for Iran, but i hope they do have nuclear capabilities, if thats what it take to keep those money hungry, corrupt animals from gaining absolute power.
I think it was Orwell (though i'm open to correction here) that said, one thing worse than 2 super powers, is 1 super power.

Saddam was conned into invading Kuwait? Please do elaborate!

I think you need your head examined if you want to see a regime like Iran gain nuclear weapons capability. It will also be interesting to see if it was a coincidence that Iran suspended their programme around the time Bush invaded Iraq. If so, its about the only benefit to be gained from that debacle.

Regarding North Korea, they're in the process of dismantling their nuclear weapons programme in exchange for aid, after they reached an agreement with the U.S., China, Japan, Russia and South Korea. Thankfully after all Bush's bravado in the early years of the decade regarding Kim Jung Il, saner heads prevailed in his administration.

It will be a long time before a US president does again what Bush did in invading Iraq. For starters, they're probably going to be stuck there for years trying to fix the mess. Second, barring another major terrorist attack, I doubt very much if the US public is going to be cowed and manipulated again by an administration in the manner that they were in the years following 9/11. Even if the threat is very real (and ignoring it potentially very costly), its going to take a hell of a lot more than "classified intelligence" and "freedom fries" to raise support amongst the American public, although the drumbeat has already started in the right-wing media that Iran is still very much a threat! Thank f**k there is only 13 months of one of the worst administrations in US history left!

[Zapatista]

There is a much more serious issue which is being completely overlooked. The US and British where imposing sanctions and calling for more sanctions against Iran. The most vulnerable people of Iran have been suffering for years due to sanctions. Now they say there are no nukes there needs to be some sort of punishment for the US and British to show how serious this issue is and if you get things that wrong you must be punished in order to prevent it in the future.

[Rav67]

There is a much more serious issue which is being completely overlooked. The US and British where imposing sanctions and calling for more sanctions against Iran. The most vulnerable people of Iran have been suffering for years due to sanctions. Now they say there are no nukes there needs to be some sort of punishment for the US and British to show how serious this issue is and if you get things that wrong you must be punished in order to prevent it in the future.

You can't police the world police unfortunately.  Unless we get Nuala O'Loan in as a US/British ombusman.

[jodyb]

As has been quoted and cliched many times, the only really dangerous nuclear power is the US and still the only outfit to use nukes on civilian populations. Hereiam is absolutely correct. For example, If Bush had really believed that Saddam had weapons of mass destruction, he would never have invaded, too f@ckin risky. His da conned Saddam into invading kuwait the first time round ffs!!
Notice he hasn't made too many moves on Korea...much as he'd like to. Scared shitless of them, that's why. I've no big time for Iran, but i hope they do have nuclear capabilities, if thats what it take to keep those money hungry, corrupt animals from gaining absolute power.
I think it was Orwell (though i'm open to correction here) that said, one thing worse than 2 super powers, is 1 super power.

Saddam was conned into invading Kuwait? Please do elaborate!

I think you need your head examined if you want to see a regime like Iran gain nuclear weapons capability. It will also be interesting to see if it was a coincidence that Iran suspended their programme around the time Bush invaded Iraq. If so, its about the only benefit to be gained from that debacle.

Regarding North Korea, they're in the process of dismantling their nuclear weapons programme in exchange for aid, after they reached an agreement with the U.S., China, Japan, Russia and South Korea. Thankfully after all Bush's bravado in the early years of the decade regarding Kim Jung Il, saner heads prevailed in his administration.

It will be a long time before a US president does again what Bush did in invading Iraq. For starters, they're probably going to be stuck there for years trying to fix the mess. Second, barring another major terrorist attack, I doubt very much if the US public is going to be cowed and manipulated again by an administration in the manner that they were in the years following 9/11. Even if the threat is very real (and ignoring it potentially very costly), its going to take a hell of a lot more than "classified intelligence" and "freedom fries" to raise support amongst the American public, although the drumbeat has already started in the right-wing media that Iran is still very much a threat! Thank f**k there is only 13 months of one of the worst administrations in US history left!

J70, Dunno if you takin the p!ss or just as naive as f@ck. In general, your stance on the bush administration, I agree with, but lets be clear, the US under both Republican and Demoract regimes in one way or another have been either complicit or fully active in terror campaigns since wwII.
To get to the con. After saddam (who i also consider to have been a evil b@st@rd) kept the Ayatolla busy for eight years or so, on behalf of the Reagan/Bush Snr administations, they cut him loose.
The agreement had been that when the US give the go ahead, Saddam would cease fire and would be treated favourably in  subsequent trade. With Iraqs infrastructure shot to sh!t, he set about restoring it with Oil sales.
However, Kuwait at the same time went into 300% production and hammered the price of Oil ( many believe, under the instruction of the CI A). Saddam appealed to the US (who also have heavy influence in Kuwait) to intervene for months and received assurance after assurance, but no action. When he finally proposed taking matters into his own hands, they shrugged and didn't advise him either way.
when he moved in, they hammered him.
Not saying he was right, but he was a bit like a vicious semi-rabid pit bull, set against a smaller terrier an when he was winning the fight, having won many before for the same handler, they beat the sh!t out of him.
He gave them the excuse  to exterminate him. But they're still the scum handlers and they orchestrate and choreograph 90% of the worlds conflicts under a cloak of respectability. The victors write history...........

[J70]

As has been quoted and cliched many times, the only really dangerous nuclear power is the US and still the only outfit to use nukes on civilian populations. Hereiam is absolutely correct. For example, If Bush had really believed that Saddam had weapons of mass destruction, he would never have invaded, too f@ckin risky. His da conned Saddam into invading kuwait the first time round ffs!!
Notice he hasn't made too many moves on Korea...much as he'd like to. Scared shitless of them, that's why. I've no big time for Iran, but i hope they do have nuclear capabilities, if thats what it take to keep those money hungry, corrupt animals from gaining absolute power.
I think it was Orwell (though i'm open to correction here) that said, one thing worse than 2 super powers, is 1 super power.

Saddam was conned into invading Kuwait? Please do elaborate!

I think you need your head examined if you want to see a regime like Iran gain nuclear weapons capability. It will also be interesting to see if it was a coincidence that Iran suspended their programme around the time Bush invaded Iraq. If so, its about the only benefit to be gained from that debacle.

Regarding North Korea, they're in the process of dismantling their nuclear weapons programme in exchange for aid, after they reached an agreement with the U.S., China, Japan, Russia and South Korea. Thankfully after all Bush's bravado in the early years of the decade regarding Kim Jung Il, saner heads prevailed in his administration.

It will be a long time before a US president does again what Bush did in invading Iraq. For starters, they're probably going to be stuck there for years trying to fix the mess. Second, barring another major terrorist attack, I doubt very much if the US public is going to be cowed and manipulated again by an administration in the manner that they were in the years following 9/11. Even if the threat is very real (and ignoring it potentially very costly), its going to take a hell of a lot more than "classified intelligence" and "freedom fries" to raise support amongst the American public, although the drumbeat has already started in the right-wing media that Iran is still very much a threat! Thank f**k there is only 13 months of one of the worst administrations in US history left!

J70, Dunno if you takin the p!ss or just as naive as f@ck. In general, your stance on the bush administration, I agree with, but lets be clear, the US under both Republican and Demoract regimes in one way or another have been either complicit or fully active in terror campaigns since wwII.

Perhaps so, and I'm not defending it, but there was a hell of a lot more involved throughout those years than just the greedy, evil United States.

To get to the con. After saddam (who i also consider to have been a evil b@st@rd) kept the Ayatolla busy for eight years or so, on behalf of the Reagan/Bush Snr administations, they cut him loose.
The agreement had been that when the US give the go ahead, Saddam would cease fire and would be treated favourably in  subsequent trade. With Iraqs infrastructure shot to sh!t, he set about restoring it with Oil sales.
However, Kuwait at the same time went into 300% production and hammered the price of Oil ( many believe, under the instruction of the CI A). Saddam appealed to the US (who also have heavy influence in Kuwait) to intervene for months and received assurance after assurance, but no action. When he finally proposed taking matters into his own hands, they shrugged and didn't advise him either way.
when he moved in, they hammered him.
Not saying he was right, but he was a bit like a vicious semi-rabid pit bull, set against a smaller terrier an when he was winning the fight, having won many before for the same handler, they beat the sh!t out of him.

I honestly had never read up on the specifics of what led to Saddam invading Kuwait. Thanks for that starting point.

He gave them the excuse  to exterminate him. But they're still the scum handlers and they orchestrate and choreograph 90% of the worlds conflicts under a cloak of respectability. The victors write history...........

Where is this cloak of respectability? Much of the world hates them, and explicitly or secretly (depending on where you are) roots for the likes of Al Qaida and Iran and so on against them. America is seen as the cause of all the ills in the world in Europe especially, but if the day comes when Islamic terrorists mount a serious campaign there, or if a serious Russian threat somehow arose again, who will they look to for protection? Its easy to sit there and point fingers, while at the same time enjoying the benefits that the Americans' particular method of handling the scum has brought to all of our lives. America and its corporations may be destroying the world manipulating governments and exploiting workers, but they keep the oil flowing and allow us to sit back and enjoy our affordable Dell/Microsoft computers, listen to our iPods, watch Hollywood films and programmes, wear Levi's and Nike and umpteen other American brands, eat at McDonald's and Starbucks, drive to work in our Fords, fly off to far lands in cheap Boeing seats, get treated at the doctor with Pfizer drugs etc. etc.

[jodyb]

[/quote]
Its easy to sit there and point fingers, while at the same time enjoying the benefits that the Americans' particular method of handling the scum has brought to all of our lives. America and its corporations may be destroying the world manipulating governments and exploiting workers, but they keep the oil flowing and allow us to sit back and enjoy our affordable Dell/Microsoft computers, listen to our iPods, watch Hollywood films and programmes, wear Levi's and Nike and umpteen other American brands, eat at McDonald's and Starbucks, drive to work in our Fords, fly off to far lands in cheap Boeing seats, get treated at the doctor with Pfizer drugs etc. etc.
[/quote]
Cant argue with you there J70. You've called me out on my fireside socialism. But fords are sh!te an lets not forget it

[Rav67]

Its easy to sit there and point fingers, while at the same time enjoying the benefits that the Americans' particular method of handling the scum has brought to all of our lives. America and its corporations may be destroying the world manipulating governments and exploiting workers, but they keep the oil flowing and allow us to sit back and enjoy our affordable Dell/Microsoft computers, listen to our iPods, watch Hollywood films and programmes, wear Levi's and Nike and umpteen other American brands, eat at McDonald's and Starbucks, drive to work in our Fords, fly off to far lands in cheap Boeing seats, get treated at the doctor with Pfizer drugs etc. etc.

"The Americans particular method of handling the scum" - you sound like a redneck Texan or an old Tory like Normann Tebitt.  I'm not sure who the official scum of the world are, but I don't attribute my comfortable lifestyle to America's particular method of handling them.

[J70]

Its easy to sit there and point fingers, while at the same time enjoying the benefits that the Americans' particular method of handling the scum has brought to all of our lives. America and its corporations may be destroying the world manipulating governments and exploiting workers, but they keep the oil flowing and allow us to sit back and enjoy our affordable Dell/Microsoft computers, listen to our iPods, watch Hollywood films and programmes, wear Levi's and Nike and umpteen other American brands, eat at McDonald's and Starbucks, drive to work in our Fords, fly off to far lands in cheap Boeing seats, get treated at the doctor with Pfizer drugs etc. etc.

"The Americans particular method of handling the scum" - you sound like a redneck Texan or an old Tory like Normann Tebitt.  I'm not sure who the official scum of the world are, but I don't attribute my comfortable lifestyle to America's particular method of handling them.

Maybe you should read the thread properly next time before offering your commentary. I was using jodyb's own words when replying to him:

He gave them the excuse  to exterminate him. But they're still the scum handlers and they orchestrate and choreograph 90% of the worlds conflicts under a cloak of respectability. The victors write history...........