Author Topic: Official Irish Football Association Thread (Northern Ireland)  (Read 104929 times)

David McKeown

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Re: Official Irish Football Association Thread (Northern Ireland)
« Reply #1215 on: March 29, 2019, 09:28:20 PM »
Are there many Catholics in North squad these days?

More than you would think and always has been which makes the IFA look even worse

Those Catholic players in the squad donít look particularly good either, declaring for NI.
If you are a bigot yourself, maybe.  For the likes of Niall McGinn, Shane Ferguson & Liam Boyce it is has given them the opportunity to play at the highest level and has likely had a positive impact on their club careers.

Given the treatment of Neil Lennon and the sectarian songs sung openly at Windsor over the years, it would be perfectly understandable for a northern born catholic to declare for Ireland or not play international football at all. McGinn and co play for NI, thatís fine. I donít criticise them for it. I just canít understand why they would.

While there have been many catholics who played for NI, the affiliation to a NI team for catholics/nationalists has vastly diminished over the years. While itís more than just sectarianism thatís the problem, it certainly doesnít help and the IFA waited too long to try and create a team and an atmosphere  for both communities. Yes, things have improved at Windsor, but the horse had long bolted.
You did criticise them - See your earlier post.  I would imagine that there is not much that the IFA could do to make you change your views.  I would say equally as significant factors in the diminished affiliation that you refer to have been the improvement in the ROIs on field results in recent decades and the ability of Northern catholics / Nationalists such as Gibson, McClean etc being able to now declare for the ROI.

That was merely an observation, and a response to the previous post.

Yes, the Big Jack era did have an affect too. But I think by the time Gibson/McClean etc declared for Ireland, the interest for the NI team for catholics/nationalists was already very low.

And yes, youíre right, thereís not a lot the IFA could do to change my views. The fact that NI exists is reason enough for me not to support them. Having said that, I donít detest them either. Iím just not that interested. A bit like being a Liverpool fan and not being interested in how Grimsby are getting on.

But there was a time when NI was successful, and that was the time to get more nationalists on board. Looking at the Union flags, sectarian chanting, national anthem, flag etc years ago might have made a difference. As of now, most of those issues still havenít been looked at.
To be fair, there are next to no Union Jacks and there is no sectarian chanting at the ground.  Out of interest, if they got rid of GSTQ, would that make a trip to Windsor Park anymore palatable for catholics / nationalists?  I wouldn't expect you to become a super fan, but does the opportunity to go and watch Ronaldo etc on your doorstep for 30 odd quid have zero appeal?

I probably sound like a broken record on this but having been involved in local and youth football for over 10 years I accept the IFA have done a lot to be more inclusive but their position on Irish men playing for Ireland is reprehensible as is their willingness to take those same men to court. Until that position changes and the agreement with the FAI on youth players is torn up I doubt Iíll Ever be in Windsor for an international match.

michaelg

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Re: Official Irish Football Association Thread (Northern Ireland)
« Reply #1216 on: March 29, 2019, 09:37:29 PM »
Are there many Catholics in North squad these days?

More than you would think and always has been which makes the IFA look even worse

Those Catholic players in the squad donít look particularly good either, declaring for NI.
If you are a bigot yourself, maybe.  For the likes of Niall McGinn, Shane Ferguson & Liam Boyce it is has given them the opportunity to play at the highest level and has likely had a positive impact on their club careers.

Given the treatment of Neil Lennon and the sectarian songs sung openly at Windsor over the years, it would be perfectly understandable for a northern born catholic to declare for Ireland or not play international football at all. McGinn and co play for NI, thatís fine. I donít criticise them for it. I just canít understand why they would.

While there have been many catholics who played for NI, the affiliation to a NI team for catholics/nationalists has vastly diminished over the years. While itís more than just sectarianism thatís the problem, it certainly doesnít help and the IFA waited too long to try and create a team and an atmosphere  for both communities. Yes, things have improved at Windsor, but the horse had long bolted.
You did criticise them - See your earlier post.  I would imagine that there is not much that the IFA could do to make you change your views.  I would say equally as significant factors in the diminished affiliation that you refer to have been the improvement in the ROIs on field results in recent decades and the ability of Northern catholics / Nationalists such as Gibson, McClean etc being able to now declare for the ROI.

That was merely an observation, and a response to the previous post.

Yes, the Big Jack era did have an affect too. But I think by the time Gibson/McClean etc declared for Ireland, the interest for the NI team for catholics/nationalists was already very low.

And yes, youíre right, thereís not a lot the IFA could do to change my views. The fact that NI exists is reason enough for me not to support them. Having said that, I donít detest them either. Iím just not that interested. A bit like being a Liverpool fan and not being interested in how Grimsby are getting on.

But there was a time when NI was successful, and that was the time to get more nationalists on board. Looking at the Union flags, sectarian chanting, national anthem, flag etc years ago might have made a difference. As of now, most of those issues still havenít been looked at.
To be fair, there are next to no Union Jacks and there is no sectarian chanting at the ground.  Out of interest, if they got rid of GSTQ, would that make a trip to Windsor Park anymore palatable for catholics / nationalists?  I wouldn't expect you to become a super fan, but does the opportunity to go and watch Ronaldo etc on your doorstep for 30 odd quid have zero appeal?

I probably sound like a broken record on this but having been involved in local and youth football for over 10 years I accept the IFA have done a lot to be more inclusive but their position on Irish men playing for Ireland is reprehensible as is their willingness to take those same men to court. Until that position changes and the agreement with the FAI on youth players is torn up I doubt Iíll Ever be in Windsor for an international match.
Is that not a done deal now?  Also, given the arrangements that were in place for many years previous, can you not understand the IFA's initial reluctance to allow the changes that have come in in recent times after Gibson and McClean etc declared for the ROI?  Not on the wind-up here, but I think ROI fans have also seen with the Declan Rice situation how annoying it is when an association helps to develop a player only for them to then represent a different senior team.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2019, 10:05:21 PM by michaelg »

BennyCake

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Re: Official Irish Football Association Thread (Northern Ireland)
« Reply #1217 on: March 29, 2019, 10:38:55 PM »
Are there many Catholics in North squad these days?

More than you would think and always has been which makes the IFA look even worse

Those Catholic players in the squad donít look particularly good either, declaring for NI.
If you are a bigot yourself, maybe.  For the likes of Niall McGinn, Shane Ferguson & Liam Boyce it is has given them the opportunity to play at the highest level and has likely had a positive impact on their club careers.

Given the treatment of Neil Lennon and the sectarian songs sung openly at Windsor over the years, it would be perfectly understandable for a northern born catholic to declare for Ireland or not play international football at all. McGinn and co play for NI, thatís fine. I donít criticise them for it. I just canít understand why they would.

While there have been many catholics who played for NI, the affiliation to a NI team for catholics/nationalists has vastly diminished over the years. While itís more than just sectarianism thatís the problem, it certainly doesnít help and the IFA waited too long to try and create a team and an atmosphere  for both communities. Yes, things have improved at Windsor, but the horse had long bolted.
You did criticise them - See your earlier post.  I would imagine that there is not much that the IFA could do to make you change your views.  I would say equally as significant factors in the diminished affiliation that you refer to have been the improvement in the ROIs on field results in recent decades and the ability of Northern catholics / Nationalists such as Gibson, McClean etc being able to now declare for the ROI.

That was merely an observation, and a response to the previous post.

Yes, the Big Jack era did have an affect too. But I think by the time Gibson/McClean etc declared for Ireland, the interest for the NI team for catholics/nationalists was already very low.

And yes, youíre right, thereís not a lot the IFA could do to change my views. The fact that NI exists is reason enough for me not to support them. Having said that, I donít detest them either. Iím just not that interested. A bit like being a Liverpool fan and not being interested in how Grimsby are getting on.

But there was a time when NI was successful, and that was the time to get more nationalists on board. Looking at the Union flags, sectarian chanting, national anthem, flag etc years ago might have made a difference. As of now, most of those issues still havenít been looked at.
To be fair, there are next to no Union Jacks and there is no sectarian chanting at the ground.  Out of interest, if they got rid of GSTQ, would that make a trip to Windsor Park anymore palatable for catholics / nationalists?  I wouldn't expect you to become a super fan, but does the opportunity to go and watch Ronaldo etc on your doorstep for 30 odd quid have zero appeal?

Re: GSTQ, it might do for some. Getting rid of things like that makes for a more universal and inclusive feel. Iíd imagine most catholics just donít feel comfortable with the whole setup. Iíve been to countless matches involving rival GAA clubs and county teams and never felt uncomfortable even if Iíve been wearing my own teams colours. Iím not sure id feel comfortable in Windsor. Catholics going to watch Ronaldo v NI would be more common id imagine if flag/anthems were removed or changed.

David McKeown

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Re: Official Irish Football Association Thread (Northern Ireland)
« Reply #1218 on: March 29, 2019, 10:52:50 PM »
Are there many Catholics in North squad these days?

More than you would think and always has been which makes the IFA look even worse

Those Catholic players in the squad donít look particularly good either, declaring for NI.
If you are a bigot yourself, maybe.  For the likes of Niall McGinn, Shane Ferguson & Liam Boyce it is has given them the opportunity to play at the highest level and has likely had a positive impact on their club careers.

Given the treatment of Neil Lennon and the sectarian songs sung openly at Windsor over the years, it would be perfectly understandable for a northern born catholic to declare for Ireland or not play international football at all. McGinn and co play for NI, thatís fine. I donít criticise them for it. I just canít understand why they would.

While there have been many catholics who played for NI, the affiliation to a NI team for catholics/nationalists has vastly diminished over the years. While itís more than just sectarianism thatís the problem, it certainly doesnít help and the IFA waited too long to try and create a team and an atmosphere  for both communities. Yes, things have improved at Windsor, but the horse had long bolted.
You did criticise them - See your earlier post.  I would imagine that there is not much that the IFA could do to make you change your views.  I would say equally as significant factors in the diminished affiliation that you refer to have been the improvement in the ROIs on field results in recent decades and the ability of Northern catholics / Nationalists such as Gibson, McClean etc being able to now declare for the ROI.

That was merely an observation, and a response to the previous post.

Yes, the Big Jack era did have an affect too. But I think by the time Gibson/McClean etc declared for Ireland, the interest for the NI team for catholics/nationalists was already very low.

And yes, youíre right, thereís not a lot the IFA could do to change my views. The fact that NI exists is reason enough for me not to support them. Having said that, I donít detest them either. Iím just not that interested. A bit like being a Liverpool fan and not being interested in how Grimsby are getting on.

But there was a time when NI was successful, and that was the time to get more nationalists on board. Looking at the Union flags, sectarian chanting, national anthem, flag etc years ago might have made a difference. As of now, most of those issues still havenít been looked at.
To be fair, there are next to no Union Jacks and there is no sectarian chanting at the ground.  Out of interest, if they got rid of GSTQ, would that make a trip to Windsor Park anymore palatable for catholics / nationalists?  I wouldn't expect you to become a super fan, but does the opportunity to go and watch Ronaldo etc on your doorstep for 30 odd quid have zero appeal?

I probably sound like a broken record on this but having been involved in local and youth football for over 10 years I accept the IFA have done a lot to be more inclusive but their position on Irish men playing for Ireland is reprehensible as is their willingness to take those same men to court. Until that position changes and the agreement with the FAI on youth players is torn up I doubt Iíll Ever be in Windsor for an international match.
Is that not a done deal now?  Also, given the arrangements that were in place for many years previous, can you not understand the IFA's initial reluctance to allow the changes that have come in in recent times after Gibson and McClean etc declared for the ROI?  Not on the wind-up here, but I think ROI fans have also seen with the Declan Rice situation how annoying it is when an association helps to develop a player only for them to then represent a different senior team.

Itís a done deal in so far as the IFA took a player to court and lost but continue to pontificate about the injustice they claim they are suffering completely ignoring the reality of the situation. Also there was no changes to rules since at least 1957 players born in Northern Ireland were eligible to play for either Northern Ireland or the Republic, (I actually this CAS May have been wrong to suggested it limit it to 1957 onward but ultimately nothing turned on that). The players you mentioned would have been as eligible to switch 10 years ago as they were 30 years ago.

The Declan Rice situation is vastly different. The FAI do not have an agreement with the FA to stop the FA selecting a certain group of English players for underage England teams. The IFA have managed to secure an agreement with the FAI for the FAI to ignore certain underage players (which is also disgrace by the FAI by the way).

What effectively is happening is that to ask a nationalist in Northern Ireland to support Northern Ireland you are asking them in first instance to recognise the right of any person from Northern Ireland to identify as Northern Irish. I have no problem with that. My issue then becomes that the IFA do not afford the same respect to nationalists (or in fact those of any persuasion) who chooses not to identify as Northern Irish but to identify as Irish and not only that but the IFA is prepared to actively prevent them identifying as Irish either by taking them to court or by arranging a de facto ban on them playing underage football for their country. If nothing else the hypocrisy in that is galling.

6th sam

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Re: Official Irish Football Association Thread (Northern Ireland)
« Reply #1219 on: March 29, 2019, 11:07:45 PM »
Are there many Catholics in North squad these days?

More than you would think and always has been which makes the IFA look even worse

Those Catholic players in the squad donít look particularly good either, declaring for NI.
If you are a bigot yourself, maybe.  For the likes of Niall McGinn, Shane Ferguson & Liam Boyce it is has given them the opportunity to play at the highest level and has likely had a positive impact on their club careers.

Given the treatment of Neil Lennon and the sectarian songs sung openly at Windsor over the years, it would be perfectly understandable for a northern born catholic to declare for Ireland or not play international football at all. McGinn and co play for NI, thatís fine. I donít criticise them for it. I just canít understand why they would.

While there have been many catholics who played for NI, the affiliation to a NI team for catholics/nationalists has vastly diminished over the years. While itís more than just sectarianism thatís the problem, it certainly doesnít help and the IFA waited too long to try and create a team and an atmosphere  for both communities. Yes, things have improved at Windsor, but the horse had long bolted.
You did criticise them - See your earlier post.  I would imagine that there is not much that the IFA could do to make you change your views.  I would say equally as significant factors in the diminished affiliation that you refer to have been the improvement in the ROIs on field results in recent decades and the ability of Northern catholics / Nationalists such as Gibson, McClean etc being able to now declare for the ROI.

That was merely an observation, and a response to the previous post.

Yes, the Big Jack era did have an affect too. But I think by the time Gibson/McClean etc declared for Ireland, the interest for the NI team for catholics/nationalists was already very low.

And yes, youíre right, thereís not a lot the IFA could do to change my views. The fact that NI exists is reason enough for me not to support them. Having said that, I donít detest them either. Iím just not that interested. A bit like being a Liverpool fan and not being interested in how Grimsby are getting on.

But there was a time when NI was successful, and that was the time to get more nationalists on board. Looking at the Union flags, sectarian chanting, national anthem, flag etc years ago might have made a difference. As of now, most of those issues still havenít been looked at.
To be fair, there are next to no Union Jacks and there is no sectarian chanting at the ground.  Out of interest, if they got rid of GSTQ, would that make a trip to Windsor Park anymore palatable for catholics / nationalists?  I wouldn't expect you to become a super fan, but does the opportunity to go and watch Ronaldo etc on your doorstep for 30 odd quid have zero appeal?

I probably sound like a broken record on this but having been involved in local and youth football for over 10 years I accept the IFA have done a lot to be more inclusive but their position on Irish men playing for Ireland is reprehensible as is their willingness to take those same men to court. Until that position changes and the agreement with the FAI on youth players is torn up I doubt Iíll Ever be in Windsor for an international match.
Is that not a done deal now?  Also, given the arrangements that were in place for many years previous, can you not understand the IFA's initial reluctance to allow the changes that have come in in recent times after Gibson and McClean etc declared for the ROI?  Not on the wind-up here, but I think ROI fans have also seen with the Declan Rice situation how annoying it is when an association helps to develop a player only for them to then represent a different senior team.

Read my lips😂😂
For many of us it wouldnít matter if you changed the anthem, flags and moved out of Windsor into my own back garden , and Ronaldo was playing , I have absolutely no interest or affinity to NI and why would I?
 My affinity is Irish. I respect anyoneís affinity as NI or British , please please please accept that there is a large proportion of the population of the six counties whose affinity is Irish . Is that so hard to understand and respect? Sadly too many unionists just donít get the fact that yearís of lack of respect for those with an Irish identity has come home to roost. Unionists had their chance to run a state properly pre 1969 and failed. Incredibly they were given a reprieve by the GFA and most nationalists were prepared  to work for the common good . Sadly the party that unionists either supported or at very least put in power just donít do equality, respect , empathy or even pragmatism. In fact for many within the DUP, if they could go back to pre 1969 levels of bigotry, they would.
ďNIĒ scores very badly on most social parameters and despite heavy subsidies from Britain is an economic basket case.
Most recently in Brexit, having ridden off the back of NI majority for years, the DUP ignored the majority NI mandate to remain . And though I know several reasonable unionists who only vote DUP to maintain this precious ďunionĒ , they are culpable for allowing this party from the dark ages, to retain the upper hand.
Itís time for decent sensible unionists/loyalists to say enough is enough before this manufactured statelet becomes any more of an economic and social wasteland.
If unionists/loyalists who respect Irishness get together with nationalists/republicans who respect Britishness, and debate future constitutional and socioeconomic arrangements based on equality & respect, this island north and south will thrive, and no doubt enjoy a healthier and potentially stronger relationship with Britain.
You seem sensible michaelg, Can sensible decent unionists continue to be disenfranchised by slavery to a dysfunctional union and thereby tacit support of a party who quite frankly have behaved disgracefully for many years and totally abused their power and privileged position. Time to step up michaelg, time to step up before itís too late.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2019, 11:23:00 PM by 6th sam »

Milltown Row2

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Re: Official Irish Football Association Thread (Northern Ireland)
« Reply #1220 on: March 30, 2019, 12:27:01 AM »
Can nationalists/republicans understand that they, unionists/ loyalists have a view point, which believe it or not is based on their upbringing. If you 6thSam, were brought up in a unionist family from Newtownards,  would have completely different views to what you are posting. Complete accident of birth.

Getting people to change views that have been entrenched since birth and fuelled with incidents throughout their lives is a lot harder than you think. Tolerance is a wonderful trait to have, acceptance of others views (rightly or wrongly) is another great trait.

Putting down professional footballers for opting to play for N.I while hiding behind a keyboard is cheap, at least David has balls and a levelled point of view from a background promoting the sport locally to give an opinion on it.
Anything I post is not the view of the County Board!! Nobody died in the making of this post ;-)

Fionntamhnach

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Re: Official Irish Football Association Thread (Northern Ireland)
« Reply #1221 on: March 30, 2019, 12:38:22 AM »
Why do you say that?  If it's because he's a catholic, there have been catholic managers in the past. Indeed, Peter the Great took NI to the QFs of the World Cup in 1958.  Perhaps you are relatively knew to following Irish football (Soccer).
Peter Canavan did that thirteen years before he was even born? That is some achievement right there!  ;D
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6th sam

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Re: Official Irish Football Association Thread (Northern Ireland)
« Reply #1222 on: March 30, 2019, 09:44:22 AM »
Can nationalists/republicans understand that they, unionists/ loyalists have a view point, which believe it or not is based on their upbringing. If you 6thSam, were brought up in a unionist family from Newtownards,  would have completely different views to what you are posting. Complete accident of birth.

Getting people to change views that have been entrenched since birth and fuelled with incidents throughout their lives is a lot harder than you think. Tolerance is a wonderful trait to have, acceptance of others views (rightly or wrongly) is another great trait.

Putting down professional footballers for opting to play for N.I while hiding behind a keyboard is cheap, at least David has balls and a levelled point of view from a background promoting the sport locally to give an opinion on it.
Absolutely agree , everybody is a product of their environment, including DUPers. I respect and understand anyoneís desire to be British or NIish. Unfortunately those in power in this state , have not afforded those of us with an Irish identity the same respect.
At what stage did I put down professional footballers opting to play for NI? , I personally know footballers who do, respect their decision , and Iíd be the first to congratulate them for any successes on the international team. On other topics I have vigorously defended the right of Rory McIlroy to feel NIish and Carl Frampton is my favourite sportsman. However I have no affinity to NI, I feel it is an ignominious state that has been a failure, primarily because it was concocted on a sectarian basis. Having lived most of my life in NI, I work within that system and tbh equality, respect , health ,education and jobs are my political priorities as opposed to the constitutional arrangements. And despite years of failure, if someone even at this late stage can guarantee those areas will be prioritised in an NI context, Iíd continue to work within the system as Iíve always done. But where is the evidence that unionists as a group are going to prioritise these issues, as opposed to pay them lip service and either support the DUP directly or hide behind that DUP self-centred intransigence , because it keeps their precious ďunionĒ intact. Interestingly their blind desire to be exclusively seen as British is not winning them many friends in the UK, as ironically most people in Britain view them as Irish crackpots.

Milltown Row2

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Re: Official Irish Football Association Thread (Northern Ireland)
« Reply #1223 on: March 30, 2019, 10:14:53 AM »
There are two power brokers in this state, both of them have not bothered to represent their voters. The DUP have come to power out of fear. Their voters have bought into that fear of losing N.I and will continue to vote them in regardless.

SF would have been like the PUP when they started politically, not many voters but since the peace process they are now the main political nationalist/republican party, youre still at least 2 generations away from where middle road prods would even consider looking at the benefits of a UI vote.

Everyone knows how corrupt the DUP are but what are the alternatives for loyalists/Unionists? If they have a choice between allowing the DUP to continue with the shambles of Stormont and voting a party dead set against a UI then itís a no brainier. And I canít see any change in that in my life time sadly
Anything I post is not the view of the County Board!! Nobody died in the making of this post ;-)

Insane Bolt

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Re: Official Irish Football Association Thread (Northern Ireland)
« Reply #1224 on: March 30, 2019, 10:55:47 AM »
Thankfully there is only one Frank Mitchell....and Windsor Park can keep him😜

imtommygunn

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Re: Official Irish Football Association Thread (Northern Ireland)
« Reply #1225 on: March 30, 2019, 12:14:56 PM »
There are two power brokers in this state, both of them have not bothered to represent their voters. The DUP have come to power out of fear. Their voters have bought into that fear of losing N.I and will continue to vote them in regardless.

SF would have been like the PUP when they started politically, not many voters but since the peace process they are now the main political nationalist/republican party, youre still at least 2 generations away from where middle road prods would even consider looking at the benefits of a UI vote.

Everyone knows how corrupt the DUP are but what are the alternatives for loyalists/Unionists? If they have a choice between allowing the DUP to continue with the shambles of Stormont and voting a party dead set against a UI then itís a no brainier. And I canít see any change in that in my life time sadly

Alliance are a real alternative as ultimately they are a unionist party. Uup a bit like sdlp in that they donít seem particularly relevant any more. A lack of nationalist alternatives to sf a bigger issue imo.

BennyCake

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Re: Official Irish Football Association Thread (Northern Ireland)
« Reply #1226 on: March 30, 2019, 12:27:47 PM »
There are two power brokers in this state, both of them have not bothered to represent their voters. The DUP have come to power out of fear. Their voters have bought into that fear of losing N.I and will continue to vote them in regardless.

SF would have been like the PUP when they started politically, not many voters but since the peace process they are now the main political nationalist/republican party, youre still at least 2 generations away from where middle road prods would even consider looking at the benefits of a UI vote.

Everyone knows how corrupt the DUP are but what are the alternatives for loyalists/Unionists? If they have a choice between allowing the DUP to continue with the shambles of Stormont and voting a party dead set against a UI then itís a no brainier. And I canít see any change in that in my life time sadly

Alliance are a real alternative as ultimately they are a unionist party. Uup a bit like sdlp in that they donít seem particularly relevant any more. A lack of nationalist alternatives to sf a bigger issue imo.

To me, SF have nothing to offer anybody so maybe a nationalist alternative would be not to vote.

What about Francie Brollyís new party?

marty34

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Re: Official Irish Football Association Thread (Northern Ireland)
« Reply #1227 on: March 30, 2019, 12:51:49 PM »
There are two power brokers in this state, both of them have not bothered to represent their voters. The DUP have come to power out of fear. Their voters have bought into that fear of losing N.I and will continue to vote them in regardless.

SF would have been like the PUP when they started politically, not many voters but since the peace process they are now the main political nationalist/republican party, youre still at least 2 generations away from where middle road prods would even consider looking at the benefits of a UI vote.

Everyone knows how corrupt the DUP are but what are the alternatives for loyalists/Unionists? If they have a choice between allowing the DUP to continue with the shambles of Stormont and voting a party dead set against a UI then itís a no brainier. And I canít see any change in that in my life time sadly

I don't buy into this narrative that 'after a fee generations', things will settle down' etc. The unionists, since its inception, has hated anything Irish - gaa games, culture and language etc.

They will NEVER (Paisly like) counterance  re-united Ireland.

As Doods said last night - they'd rather stay in the EU than 'weaken' the union.  It's all about the union.  Anybody who thinks they'll suddenly come around to thinking about a re-united Ireland, in any circumstamces, is very naive.

JPGJOHNNYG

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Re: Official Irish Football Association Thread (Northern Ireland)
« Reply #1228 on: March 30, 2019, 01:03:34 PM »
There are two power brokers in this state, both of them have not bothered to represent their voters. The DUP have come to power out of fear. Their voters have bought into that fear of losing N.I and will continue to vote them in regardless.

SF would have been like the PUP when they started politically, not many voters but since the peace process they are now the main political nationalist/republican party, youre still at least 2 generations away from where middle road prods would even consider looking at the benefits of a UI vote.

Everyone knows how corrupt the DUP are but what are the alternatives for loyalists/Unionists? If they have a choice between allowing the DUP to continue with the shambles of Stormont and voting a party dead set against a UI then itís a no brainier. And I canít see any change in that in my life time sadly

Alliance are a real alternative as ultimately they are a unionist party. Uup a bit like sdlp in that they donít seem particularly relevant any more. A lack of nationalist alternatives to sf a bigger issue imo.

To me, SF have nothing to offer anybody so maybe a nationalist alternative would be not to vote.

What about Francie Brollyís new party?

Not voting wont achieve anything. Pick a party even if it is the least bad one or no-hoppers but dont not vote

marty34

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Re: Official Irish Football Association Thread (Northern Ireland)
« Reply #1229 on: March 30, 2019, 01:17:28 PM »
There are two power brokers in this state, both of them have not bothered to represent their voters. The DUP have come to power out of fear. Their voters have bought into that fear of losing N.I and will continue to vote them in regardless.

SF would have been like the PUP when they started politically, not many voters but since the peace process they are now the main political nationalist/republican party, youre still at least 2 generations away from where middle road prods would even consider looking at the benefits of a UI vote.

Everyone knows how corrupt the DUP are but what are the alternatives for loyalists/Unionists? If they have a choice between allowing the DUP to continue with the shambles of Stormont and voting a party dead set against a UI then itís a no brainier. And I canít see any change in that in my life time sadly

Alliance are a real alternative as ultimately they are a unionist party. Uup a bit like sdlp in that they donít seem particularly relevant any more. A lack of nationalist alternatives to sf a bigger issue imo.

To me, SF have nothing to offer anybody so maybe a nationalist alternative would be not to vote.

What about Francie Brollyís new party?

What's a 'nationalist alternative'?