Worthington wants anywhere but windsor

[nifan]

In fairness most of my mates support the ROI and I dont have a problem with it (some of my friends have been happy to come along to NI games, and one is a current block booker for a number of years now)

They identify themselves as Irish and they support the team they have supported all their life - as I do.
Didnt enjoy it when they where miles above us in the rankings - i got dogs abuse though.

AFR - you said fearon was correct when he said that NI fans see the NI team as a badge of political allegience more than a team. Well you could I suppose argue that any national team will have an aspect of that, but the implication of tony was clear as day.
As I said the same implication would be that GAA is mainly asserting your nationalism rather than being part of a sporting organization.

[Chrisowc]

For some clarity why don't you read the seventy odd page thread on OWC.  For further clarity why don't you read FIFA's rules.

Why?  Does volume imply clarity?

Seventy pages would indicate that it is a complictated topic.  Reading the thread will confim this.

Happy days.

/Jim.

Nice that you signed off with the name of a Northern Ireland fanzine.  Happy Days indeed Jim

[his holiness nb]

Reading 70 pages of OWC waffle is enough to kill a man   

[Chrisowc]

Reading 70 pages of OWC waffle is enough to kill a man   

Sure you can make a start after 4.00 when there is nobody here to talk to you

[An Fear Rua]

AFR - you said fearon was correct when he said that NI fans see the NI team as a badge of political allegience more than a team. Well you could I suppose argue that any national team will have an aspect of that, but the implication of tony was clear as day.
As I said the same implication would be that GAA is mainly asserting your nationalism rather than being part of a sporting organization.

Yep , I agree with Fearon, but not his posting style, I believe that the majority of ni fans, see their football team, representing what they see as their country, as an extension of their political beliefs. Happy to be proven wrong if thats not the case.

As for the GAA, as Sammy regularly tells us, the GAA is all about promoting a national identiy through Gaelic Games and native pastimes, dance, language and song, its clearly states it in the basic aim. Its an organisation that includes sport, its always been very open about its nationalism.

Support for ni as an entity (incl any sporting teams), is an extension of support for particular political point of view, whether conscious or unconsciously. Hence, support for ni is primarlily made up of those of who pro union/ulster nationalist/anti Irish Nationalism/against reunification. Theres no real debate to be had, its quite obvious. They are linked, in the case of OWC some will see the football as  the main driver for the support, some will see the political statement that support makes as the main driver, all will be touched by both aspects to varying degrees. Exactly the same aspects are true of the GAA, but the Gaa is pretty secure in the knowledge that its not going to be taken away from its members , IMHO not so true for ni fans, or indeed ni brands, or indeed ni, time and the people affected/afflicted will tell on that one.


Hypthotheical question(s) for you, Imagine that we achieve a UI, and FIFA sanctions that we can maintain two football teams, nothing would change in that respect(it would operate as it does now). Would the majority of these only in it for the sport ni fans be happy? after all its only a football team .

or maybe we have a CIS (Commenwealth of Independant states) team like they had at the breakup of the USSR, as opposed to an "All Ireland team", reckon anyone would go for that?

[his holiness nb]

Sure you can make a start after 4.00 when there is nobody here to talk to you

Nah Gabriel wil be tuning in from Canada then to tell me all aboot his day!

[T Fearon]

The big question is What the IFA must do to raise the support base of its team? It seesm to have dawned at least on Mr Wells (if not the other fcukwits who run the IFA, mainly bingo callers at Junior Clubs etc) that the current level of support (13,000 which may well reduce dramatically after the inevitable defeats away to Spain, Sweden and Iceland) represents an revenue stream that is insufficient to run football in the six counties. I would challenge him to think the unthinkable and divest the IFA of its ludicrous Ban on Sunday soccer, get out of the Village area as soon as possible (ie Windsor Park) and depoliticise the team by removing he exclsuively unionist monocultural trappings and hence produce a team that both communities might be able to owe allegiance to.

[nifan]

Yep , I agree with Fearon, but not his posting style, I believe that the majority of ni fans, see their football team, representing what they see as their country, as an extension of their political beliefs. Happy to be proven wrong if thats not the case.

I agree with you to a degree, and I guess its more fearons one sided view of things that is the problem.

As i said any support of a national team carries a political belief based on how you identify yourself - as i said before it doesnt actually bother me when friends support the ROI, I identify myself as N Irish and am happy to do so, as such I have a support of NI teams.
Fearons implication was certainly that as opposed to those football fans who follow other teams (the roi especially) NI fans are in it for nefarious reasons.

[nifan]

I would challenge him to think the unthinkable and divest the IFA of its ludicrous Ban on Sunday soccer, get out of the Village area as soon as possible (ie Windsor Park) and depoliticise the team by removing he exclsuively unionist monocultural trappings and hence produce a team that both communities might be able to owe allegiance to.

Can we expect to see you in your NI top supporting NI at the games then tony?

[Chrisowc]

depoliticise the team by removing he exclsuively unionist monocultural trappings and hence produce a team that both communities might be able to owe allegiance to.

Once again I ask you to show me how the Northern Ireland football team or it's supporters display 'exclusively Unionist monocultural trappings'.  .

The Northern Ireland football team itself is made up of members of both prominent communtiies in Northern Ireland.

[An Fear Rua]

The big question is What the IFA must do to raise the support base of its team? It seesm to have dawned at least on Mr Wells (if not the other fcukwits who run the IFA, mainly bingo callers at Junior Clubs etc) that the current level of support (13,000 which may well reduce dramatically after the inevitable defeats away to Spain, Sweden and Iceland) represents an revenue stream that is insufficient to run football in the six counties. I would challenge him to think the unthinkable and divest the IFA of its ludicrous Ban on Sunday soccer, get out of the Village area as soon as possible (ie Windsor Park) and depoliticise the team by removing he exclsuively unionist monocultural trappings and hence produce a team that both communities might be able to owe allegiance to.

And then what? its still going to be something a vast majority of nationalists/republicans/catholics wont support for the reasons outlined above. The only way that all members of society will get behind the same team, is when there is only one team to get behind.
Your not one bit interested in following a NI team unionist trappings or not, neither am I, difference is your using to stir shit.

Answer me this Fearon, if the IFA did all the above, and made the games exactly to your requirements what excuse would you use then? Or would ou be honest and admit that you wont go because of your a believer in Irish Nationalism?

[Tony Baloney]

Tony it's time you put a new record on. We get the point by now after years of brow-beating and letters in the papers. You don't support the NI team - last I checked no-one was forcing you to! Move on...

[T Fearon]

Fact 1. I have attended many games, both International and club, at Windsor Park in the past, and have even enjoyed some, and have even availed of hospitality in the Linfield FC Viewing lounge (free gratis of course) during an Irish Cup Final. But at no time have I felt any affinity with the team sadly.

Now I can categorically state that if the English National anthem disappears, and the union jacks and bastardised Ulster flags, and the team is positively trying to represent all communities in an apolitical manner, then it would go a long way to earning my goodwill and perhaps active support but under the status quo this will never happen

[nifan]

How can you support the ROI tony - you claim it represents Ireland, but it fails to ne apolitical - i dont see all communities of the island represented

How did you manage to go to all those games in the "village" tony

[his holiness nb]

How can you support the ROI tony - you claim it represents Ireland, but it fails to ne apolitical - i dont see all communities of the island represented

Nifan, in fairness thats hardly the fault of the ROI !
If we had our way it would be all one country, as per the goals of our main political parties.