What now for Armagh?

[mackers]

Hank, I really like the look of your team from the half back line up and agree with the fact they need to be given time to bed in over the league campaign next year. Either Aaron Kernan or Charlie Vernon have to be given a half forward slot as we have a shortage in this line and a surplus of good half backs. Your full back line is suspect, I don't think Francie will be back if Joe goes so we'll have to plan without him, so I would slot Kieran Toner and Ciaran McKeever in the full back line. Amazed that they weren't on in the first place!!!

[orangeman]

Armagh will bring in a few new faces from under 21s etc - a few will retire and Armagh will carry on - they won't become a bad team overnight - but one thing for sure - they need to find a scoring forward or two and concentrate less on defence.

[GPA not OK]

Orangeman,
They concentrate on defence because Joe knows that they aren't scoring more than 9 times in a game.

It's been like this throughout the league. In the league they played 7 games and scored 5-62.

That's less than an average of 10 scores per game. They stayed up because they only conceded two goals. Incidentally one of them was a clanger from McKinney just like Hearty's against Donegal.

from - http://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/gaa_results_footballleague.html

10 scores against Kildare
10 scores against Louth
8 against Galway
9 scores against Derry
10 scores against Down
8 scores against Laois
12 scores against Westmeath

Incidentally, in the two drawn games and the Ulster Final last year all they could muster was about 10 scores.

Eamonn Coleman once said that to win most Championship games you need to score about 12 times. I think he was dead right.

[tevez]

The average age is 24, 25. I would have no problem with McKinney coming in for hearty, as he is a very good goalkeeper. Francie Bellew will not play for Armagh again, his injury was very bad, and he will be lucky if he plays for cross again.
On Liam O'hare, one thing Armagh need in the half forward line is pace, and there is noone in Armagh that has as much oace as O'Hare. Look at the difference he has made to Cullyhanna this year. He has won McCrory with St Pats (Man of the match in final ahead of Clarke and Cavanagh) he has been captain of st mary's sigerson team. He deserves chance.
Other players that should be brought into squad should be McKenna, Paul Kernan Gareth Smith, Paul Courtney and Kevin O'Rourke

[pintsofguinness]

Are you Liam O'hare tevez? 

[Mike Sheehy]

Why are all the Kerry posters being so nice

yerra tis in our nature to be nice to the down trodden, but MikeSheehy2 will probably change that later on when he logs on!!!

All this niceness is making us feel soft and somehow dirty, Sheehy where are you when your county needs you?

The minimum you can do for an opponent is to allow them dignity in the immediate aftermath of defeat. Thats something that has been lost in the last few years where every defeat is treated as an indication of some fatal flaw in that Countys character or some inherent superiority in the victors genes.

Dont get me wrong. Armaghs defeat will figure in this neverending slagging about who is better, top 3, best team in Ulster, Kerrys "easy" ride etc, etc but now is just not the time.

[tevez]

I am not Liam O'Hare , but he should get a chance. What do the rest of you think?

[Armaghtothebone]

Despite what some of the posters on here not lucky enough to be from Armagh believe,not all Armagh fans think the GAA was invented in 2002!
Whatever else the future holds for us I genuinely hope it doesnt hold a return to the days before the 2 Brians.It's not that long ago that our summers consisted of one game in the championship.Given how far the likes of Down/Cavan/Offaly have fallen I dread to think that we might go the same way.
As someone who watches a fair few games throughout the year I have to say i do have one worry as far as we are concerned.Where are the new forwards? The men to stand up and replace Oisisn,John Mac,Paddy,Diarmuid? If they are about they've been keeping a very low profile.On this years U21 panel only young Forker stood out as a real dangerous forward.
Here's praying that there's a whole squad of talented forwards out there just waiting for their chance
   

[johnpower]

agree with you Armaghtothe bone. Forker really stood out for the u21 . Ronan Clarke is still young enough .Gradual change maybe the way to go .Yet it will to be hard to find Leaders like McGeanny and McGrane

[ONeill]

I think what really sticks in the throats of Kernan, McGeeney etc is the second All-Ireland dream. One of the boys on RTE on Sunday night said that it annoys them to the point of distraction. Those lads have a decision to make now, although I'm sure it's the same one they've faced since 2004 - either to have yet another shot or be happy with what they've achieved. I'm sure it's mighty hard to walk away, especially as they've been trying for 5 years for that second one and been close on 2 occasions. Kerry, Tyrone, Meath and Galway have all become at least 2-time winners in the last decade or so - Armagh is the only one that sticks out.

Kernan has made such an issue of the second one (alright, maybe he said it once!) that I think he'd find it hard to sleep at night unless he stepped down as manager but still had an input.

[TacadoirArdMhacha]

As most posters have indicated, there's a good chance that Sunday's defeat will herald the end of an era as such. I've always thought that Joe was the man for the job but at this stage, perhaps some new ideas wouldn't do any harm. I suppose the worst part is the reality that that second All Ireland probably won't now happen for this team. Most likely we'll go down as the best team of the last 30 years only to win 1 All Ireland but I dont think thats what anybody wanted.

The liklehood is that mcNulty, McGrane, McGeeney and Marsden will call it quits. On Sunday I really thought that the legs went for McGrane. There were a couple of occasions when Derry came out of midfield at pace and McGrane simply wasn't able to keep with them. It was sorta sad to see from somebody whose been one of the top 3, if not the best, midfielder in the country for the past decade. I think to some extent these lads have given all to Armagh that they possibly can and we should be grateful for all their effort.

Certainly we have a good crop of young players coming through, but I have feeling they are generally good players rather than great players and that the standard slipping off the radar was higher than what's coming in. Hopefuly I'm wrong but although I don't foresee us failing to be competitive in Ulster in the next few years, I think expectations will need to lowered a bit.

On Liam O'Hare, he's an excellent club footballer, no one whose seen him play regularly can deny that and I've no doubt that he's a more talented footballer than many on the current squad. He deserve a chance to play 3 or 4 league matches at Centre Half forward or at least int he half forward line. If he performs as he can, Armagh will have a great asset, if not, at least there can be no complaints.

[orangeman]

Against Donegal, albeit  after a slow start, Mc Grane put on an exhibition, I thought !

[Armamike]

Next year needs to be about building for the future, and putting the onus on bringing on the younger players.  Having said that, to lose all of McGeeney, McConville, Marsden, Bellew, McGrane, McConville and McNulty in one go would leave a big hole in terms of experience - and finding another 7 or so new squad members won't be easy. The problem for Armagh now is that these players have been the spine of the team and have been automatic starters for so long.  Ideally i'd like to see some of these players stay on and be involved but not necessarily as automatic starters or for the full 70 mins. The likes of McGrane could come on and still do a job at midfield, the way Kevin Walsh used to for Galway. It's hard to say whether any of these players would have the appetite to come back for another year and be happy with any benchtime though.

[orangeman]

I don;t think Mc Grane or any of those you mentioned would take too kindly to being asked to come on and do a job for 10 - 20 mins - they should retire gracefully rather than suffer that  -

[armaghniac]

I don;t think Mc Grane or any of those you mentioned would take too kindly to being asked to come on and do a job for 10 - 20 mins - they should retire gracefully rather than suffer that

Peter Canavan wasn't too proud to do this, and people thought better of him for it. Those partial contributions may still be difference between Tyrone winning and losing. That said there is a vast commitment to training etc required and the lads might just want to hang up their boots, which they should do with our thanks.