Author Topic: 11th night bonfires  (Read 33661 times)

Kilkevan

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Re: 11th night bonfires
« Reply #60 on: July 06, 2017, 07:31:40 PM »
There is nothing wrong with bonfires, if done properly. Guy Fawkes Night in the UK is a fantastic family event which kids love, or at least the official events are. What all these events have in common though is security. The bonfires are of a certain height, not near any buildings or anything else which can burn easily and there is usually some sort of cordon around the fire to stop people going too close. Some sort of fire safety crew is present as well if I recall correctly.

The bonfires in the North, discounting how gravely offensive many of them are, are not secure. Massive bonfires are dangerous anywhere but in housing estates they're insane. What will put an end to them, or at least bring in legislation to control them, is there is obviously going to be a tragedy at some point. Every year they build them bigger and in more stupid places. Eventually something is going to go badly wrong.

armaghniac

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Re: 11th night bonfires
« Reply #61 on: July 06, 2017, 08:09:29 PM »
There is nothing wrong with bonfires, if done properly. Guy Fawkes Night in the UK is a fantastic family event which kids love, or at least the official events are. What all these events have in common though is security. The bonfires are of a certain height, not near any buildings or anything else which can burn easily and there is usually some sort of cordon around the fire to stop people going too close. Some sort of fire safety crew is present as well if I recall correctly.

Guy Fawkes Night, formerly known as Pope Day. is also an essentially anti Catholic event celebrating an event in a form of civil war. People ignore some of what it is about, but it is not a proper thing to be celebrating. A lot of English will sneer at the 11th July, while being basically cut from the same cloth themselves.
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BennyCake

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Re: 11th night bonfires
« Reply #62 on: July 06, 2017, 08:45:58 PM »
I'd imagine most English who celebrate 5 November have no idea it is anti-Catholic.

Íseal agus crua isteach a

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Re: 11th night bonfires
« Reply #63 on: July 07, 2017, 02:29:26 AM »
When I think of these orangemen I  just automatically think of a family tree with no branches. The end product, a Jim Allister type. You know the one's Im talking about, you see them out marching on the 12th with the two big toes facing each other.
« Last Edit: July 07, 2017, 02:33:58 AM by Íseal agus crua isteach a »

T Fearon

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Re: 11th night bonfires
« Reply #64 on: July 07, 2017, 06:17:51 AM »
While generally I think it would be better if the OO didn't exist,I think they are unfairly maligned on this thread.The parading tradition and culture has been there for decades and as even SF will tell you,the vast majority of parades are non contentious.I don't believe the average Orangeman hates Catholics or looks down his nose at them.I know a lot of members,even do business with a member,and without exception the ones I know are friendly and courteous.

Neither do I believe the majority who attend parades do so to be triumphalist or gloat.For most it's just a family day out.

The OO needs to withdraw completely from the political arena and concentrate solely on religious matters.

MoChara

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Re: 11th night bonfires
« Reply #65 on: July 07, 2017, 08:38:29 AM »
While generally I think it would be better if the OO didn't exist,I think they are unfairly maligned on this thread.The parading tradition and culture has been there for decades and as even SF will tell you,the vast majority of parades are non contentious.I don't believe the average Orangeman hates Catholics or looks down his nose at them.I know a lot of members,even do business with a member,and without exception the ones I know are friendly and courteous.

Neither do I believe the majority who attend parades do so to be triumphalist or gloat.For most it's just a family day out.

The OO needs to withdraw completely from the political arena and concentrate solely on religious matters.

Doing business with a member is only a sign that the green pound spends as good as the orange.

I don't believe as individuals they are all knuckle dragging bigots either to be honest but they are involved in knuckle dragging bigotry.

Applesisapples

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Re: 11th night bonfires
« Reply #66 on: July 07, 2017, 08:53:58 AM »
I am also of the opinion that the Orange Order would be all but irrelevant now had SF's policy of protesting not revived an organisation whose membership had dwindled seriously in the early 90s.
Best thing to do with parades and bonfires is ignore them
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Orior

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Re: 11th night bonfires
« Reply #67 on: July 07, 2017, 09:00:40 AM »
While generally I think it would be better if the OO didn't exist,I think they are unfairly maligned on this thread.The parading tradition and culture has been there for decades and as even SF will tell you,the vast majority of parades are non contentious.I don't believe the average Orangeman hates Catholics or looks down his nose at them.I know a lot of members,even do business with a member,and without exception the ones I know are friendly and courteous.

Neither do I believe the majority who attend parades do so to be triumphalist or gloat.For most it's just a family day out.

The OO needs to withdraw completely from the political arena and concentrate solely on religious matters.

Objection M'Lord. A quick search of the Newspaper archives shows that riots at Orange Parades happened on a regular basis in the 18th and 19th centuries in the North, as well as places like Canada. Indeed, there was trouble associated with the parades by the other side too:

http://www.poyntzpass.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/ST-PATRICKS-DAY-1869.pdf
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Kilkevan

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Re: 11th night bonfires
« Reply #68 on: July 07, 2017, 09:14:37 AM »
There is nothing wrong with bonfires, if done properly. Guy Fawkes Night in the UK is a fantastic family event which kids love, or at least the official events are. What all these events have in common though is security. The bonfires are of a certain height, not near any buildings or anything else which can burn easily and there is usually some sort of cordon around the fire to stop people going too close. Some sort of fire safety crew is present as well if I recall correctly.

Guy Fawkes Night, formerly known as Pope Day. is also an essentially anti Catholic event celebrating an event in a form of civil war. People ignore some of what it is about, but it is not a proper thing to be celebrating. A lot of English will sneer at the 11th July, while being basically cut from the same cloth themselves.

That's ridiculous. Whilst it is undoubtedly true Guy Fawkes Night carried anti-Catholic sentiment in certain areas 150 years ago that has been completely eradicated. I grew up in Wales, was Catholic then though have no religious affiliation as an adult, both my parents are still strong Catholics and we all celebrated 5th November. Fireworks and bonfires, children love it. Simply because something had negative overtones in the past doesn't mean it can't mature into something positive which Guy Fawkes Night undoubtedly has. Saying Bonfire Night, which is what most people certainly in the area of Wales I grew up call it, is anti-Catholic is as silly as saying Bastille Day is a celebration of cutting people's heads off. Frankly your comment about English people in general was racist and bigoted.

punt kick

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Re: 11th night bonfires
« Reply #69 on: July 07, 2017, 09:32:57 AM »
Albeit 100% true.

The Subbie

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Re: 11th night bonfires
« Reply #70 on: July 07, 2017, 10:28:35 AM »
While generally I think it would be better if the OO didn't exist,I think they are unfairly maligned on this thread.The parading tradition and culture has been there for decades and as even SF will tell you,the vast majority of parades are non contentious.I don't believe the average Orangeman hates Catholics or looks down his nose at them.I know a lot of members,even do business with a member,and without exception the ones I know are friendly and courteous.

Neither do I believe the majority who attend parades do so to be triumphalist or gloat.For most it's just a family day out.

The OO needs to withdraw completely from the political arena and concentrate solely on religious matters.

Dr Subbie suspects a serious dose of Stockholm syndrome.
Please go and lie down in a dark room and don't be speaking to any orange men for the next 5 or 6 weeks.

Taylor

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Re: 11th night bonfires
« Reply #71 on: July 07, 2017, 10:30:35 AM »
While generally I think it would be better if the OO didn't exist,I think they are unfairly maligned on this thread.The parading tradition and culture has been there for decades and as even SF will tell you,the vast majority of parades are non contentious.I don't believe the average Orangeman hates Catholics or looks down his nose at them.I know a lot of members,even do business with a member,and without exception the ones I know are friendly and courteous.

Neither do I believe the majority who attend parades do so to be triumphalist or gloat.For most it's just a family day out.

The OO needs to withdraw completely from the political arena and concentrate solely on religious matters.

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balladmaker

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Re: 11th night bonfires
« Reply #72 on: July 07, 2017, 01:36:17 PM »
Quote
Every year they build them bigger and in more stupid places. Eventually something is going to go badly wrong.

Has anyone seen the Sandy Row bonfire just off Great Victoria Street, right beside the Holiday Inn whose oil tank is right in the firing line?  I can't see how the Holiday Inn is going to escape untouched, surely the heat must at least damage their windows, if not worse.  These bonfire builders have no regard for property or safety, they've also no control of the embers that will land on the roof of neighbouring houses and businesses etc.  It wouldn't be accepted anywhere else but in the north, a ridiculous situation that the authorities seem to have no control over ... apart from storing pallets on their behalf.

Dire Ear

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Re: 11th night bonfires
« Reply #73 on: July 07, 2017, 01:51:42 PM »