Author Topic: Man Utd Thread:  (Read 3354984 times)

Cunny Funt

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3510
    • View Profile
Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #47910 on: January 07, 2020, 08:53:25 PM »
Thats the Semi final tie over after the 1st half of the 1st leg.

The United defence in recent weeks was jittery enough and starting Jones in place of the injured Maguire was always likely to be recipe for disaster, the 3rd goal has summed up United's night. City to their credit are at their clinical best tonight.


Orior

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10188
    • View Profile
Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #47911 on: January 07, 2020, 09:06:24 PM »
Thats the Semi final tie over after the 1st half of the 1st leg.

The United defence in recent weeks was jittery enough and starting Jones in place of the injured Maguire was always likely to be recipe for disaster, the 3rd goal has summed up United's night. City to their credit are at their clinical best tonight.

Is there any chance that the Dublin team could the same sort of nose dive as have Man Utd?
Cover me in chocolate and feed me to the lesbians

Cunny Funt

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3510
    • View Profile
Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #47912 on: January 07, 2020, 09:14:28 PM »
Thats the Semi final tie over after the 1st half of the 1st leg.

The United defence in recent weeks was jittery enough and starting Jones in place of the injured Maguire was always likely to be recipe for disaster, the 3rd goal has summed up United's night. City to their credit are at their clinical best tonight.

Is there any chance that the Dublin team could the same sort of nose dive as have Man Utd?
None. Dublin will remain a well run team on and off the field.

Milltown Row2

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 20897
  • It was the Ref that did it!!
    • View Profile
Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #47913 on: January 07, 2020, 09:16:17 PM »
Just listening to it on radio (thank f**k) they really need to look at themselves and question their status as professional footballers.
Anything I post is not the view of the County Board!! Nobody died in the making of this post ;-)

Cunny Funt

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3510
    • View Profile
Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #47914 on: January 07, 2020, 09:59:40 PM »
Trailer have a little cop on will you.

As for the 2nd half at least it was won 1-0 but doesn't disguise the 1st half where this tie is as good as done before the 2nd leg.

Ed Ricketts

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 83
    • View Profile
Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #47915 on: January 07, 2020, 10:44:28 PM »
City just on a different level. Fannied around in the second half with the tie won.

They have a proper manager with outstanding pedigree. Experienced and respected coaching and administrative staff, poached from top clubs. And some of the best players in the world, most brought in at big expense after proving their quality elsewhere.

United have a nothing manager with no pedigree. Rookie non-playing staff that have not demonstrated any ability to improve the club. And a mess of a squad, riddled with dud 'value' purchases and academy graduates promoted too soon.

So tonight's result is obviously no surprise. In fact, the goal back in the second half probably made it quite a decent result in the context.

United are one of the wealthiest clubs in the world. They have the financial clout to be run in the same fashion as City, yet they have stopped trying. This is outrageous.

Supporters have a voice that can pressure for change, but bizarrely many seem to have bought into some pathetic spin that this is all ok because the club needs a nebulous 'reset', or because things are so fucked that it's not even worth trying to source better quality staff to improve matters, or that things are actually grand and sure didn't they beat City once a while ago and PSG a bit before that. It boggles the mind that there isn't a more furious reaction to the situation in Old Trafford. This would never be allowed to happen in Madrid, Barcelona or Munich.

Maroon Manc

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2656
    • View Profile
Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #47916 on: January 08, 2020, 11:42:12 AM »
Another diabolical performance, thats the 3rd in the last 3 weeks. He'll do well to last the month, injuries are mounting and the likes of Rashford & Fred look shattered; United have games every 3/4 days during the month too, doesn't bode well.

Don't know what Ole has go to lose by giving Gomes a run in the team, Lingard & Pereira have continually shown all season their not good enough. Pereira makes so many mistakes during a game, I'm not convinced he's a premiership footballer never mind a United players; He's getting worse instead of better. Lingard offers next to nothing, he's appalling on the ball. They have 2 goals in 53 games between them this season and very few assists if any.

I like Ole and am desperate for him to succeed but he has no track record we can look to for hope, he needs a miracle to survive. 

NAG1

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4375
    • View Profile
Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #47917 on: January 08, 2020, 11:53:17 AM »
Another diabolical performance, thats the 3rd in the last 3 weeks. He'll do well to last the month, injuries are mounting and the likes of Rashford & Fred look shattered; United have games every 3/4 days during the month too, doesn't bode well.

Don't know what Ole has go to lose by giving Gomes a run in the team, Lingard & Pereira have continually shown all season their not good enough. Pereira makes so many mistakes during a game, I'm not convinced he's a premiership footballer never mind a United players; He's getting worse instead of better. Lingard offers next to nothing, he's appalling on the ball. They have 2 goals in 53 games between them this season and very few assists if any.

I like Ole and am desperate for him to succeed but he has no track record we can look to for hope, he needs a miracle to survive.

MM have to agree at this stage.

It looks like they are going to give him just enough rope so they dont have any back lash form the supporters. To be fair to them last night they recognised that it was a young side out and didnt give them the stick they would have coming off at half time had there been a few more of the older players.

Gomes looked bright when he came on, Fred for all his failings never drops his head and was busy enough last night always wants the ball and was encouraging the players around him.

Lingard and Andreas are too powder puff.

But it has to be recognised that any time you start with Phil Jones in the team it is never going to be good.

Young looks like he is for the exit which makes me think even more the board have given Ole the hatchet job and someone else will be coming in to do the rebuilding.

magpie seanie

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12686
    • View Profile
Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #47918 on: January 08, 2020, 12:05:28 PM »
City just on a different level. Fannied around in the second half with the tie won.

They have a proper manager with outstanding pedigree. Experienced and respected coaching and administrative staff, poached from top clubs. And some of the best players in the world, most brought in at big expense after proving their quality elsewhere.

United have a nothing manager with no pedigree. Rookie non-playing staff that have not demonstrated any ability to improve the club. And a mess of a squad, riddled with dud 'value' purchases and academy graduates promoted too soon.

So tonight's result is obviously no surprise. In fact, the goal back in the second half probably made it quite a decent result in the context.

United are one of the wealthiest clubs in the world. They have the financial clout to be run in the same fashion as City, yet they have stopped trying. This is outrageous.

Supporters have a voice that can pressure for change, but bizarrely many seem to have bought into some pathetic spin that this is all ok because the club needs a nebulous 'reset', or because things are so fucked that it's not even worth trying to source better quality staff to improve matters, or that things are actually grand and sure didn't they beat City once a while ago and PSG a bit before that. It boggles the mind that there isn't a more furious reaction to the situation in Old Trafford. This would never be allowed to happen in Madrid, Barcelona or Munich.


How could you write so much without mentioning the overwhelming main reason for all of this? The mind truly does boggle. I'll address some of it though which I found to be particularly unfair and it's in relation to the manager and his staff.....

Quote
United have a nothing manager with no pedigree. Rookie non-playing staff that have not demonstrated any ability to improve the club. And a mess of a squad, riddled with dud 'value' purchases and academy graduates promoted too soon.


Ole has bought 3 players. Maguire - injured for last night and has had a dip in form but clearly a good buy. Wan Bissaka - blotted out Raheem Sterling (again) last night and beginning to do more in an attacking sense. A resounding success of a purchase. James - thought he did ok but not one of his better games. Overall though another resounding success of a purchase. So 3 out of 3 purchases. A lot of players were let go in the summer because they had no future at the club. It's not possible to argue that any should have been kept. Probably another player or two should have been bought, I'll give you that.

It is now clear that (a) Rashford's best position is wide on the left. He got the chance through the middle and it didn't work out and I think the lad himself is now fully happy and confident, playing regularly and scoring at a rate he always threatened to but never produced. He has room for improvement and I think he will. (b) Martial's best position is now proven to be through the middle. Whether he's good enough in that position to be a really top class centre forward for a top team is debatable but he's probably the best option at the club now for that role. Doesn't get enough goals or work hard enough but there's clarity now at least. (c) Greenwood is going to be a star. He's well able for the first team but it's right to use him sparingly at his age. (d) Brandon Williams is the best left back at the club. If he wasn't so young I'd play him every week. His emergence and Shaw's continued ineptitude have clarified another situation....Shaw must go. (e) Angel Gomes did more in the time he was on last night than Lingard did in the last year. Lingard has been given the games to play his way out of the club and if anything, Gomes has been held back too long.

So for a "nothing manager" and "rookie non-playing staff" they've actually achieved quite a bit in their 12.5 months in charge. You have to appreciate the utter shambles they took over. What the don't have is squad depth. Maguire, Tuanzebe, Bailly, Rojo all injured last night so no choice but to play Jones, who was really awful. I will accept there was an error in team selection last night - Matic, even for how bad he has been, should have started ahead of either Pereira, especially with Jones starting. McTominay and Pogba also out injured it should be noted. United were down to the bare bones last night. Still in contention for top 4 and in all competitions though effectively now out of this one.

The major and overwhelming problem is the ownership. I defend the management because I can see they're trying to do the right things and absolutely 100% have the clubs best interests as well as the traditions at heart. To my mind things are much better than when they took over as there's clarity in some areas and lots of dead wood has been moved on or exposed. Unfortunately, these players have to be replaced and that's where the management are not in full control. They're reliant on the ownership and their minions.

I hate the thoughts of Saudis taking over the club with their blood money but 15 years of the Glazers sucking money out of the club has had its inevitable conclusion.

Maroon Manc

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2656
    • View Profile
Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #47919 on: January 08, 2020, 12:36:27 PM »
Another diabolical performance, thats the 3rd in the last 3 weeks. He'll do well to last the month, injuries are mounting and the likes of Rashford & Fred look shattered; United have games every 3/4 days during the month too, doesn't bode well.

Don't know what Ole has go to lose by giving Gomes a run in the team, Lingard & Pereira have continually shown all season their not good enough. Pereira makes so many mistakes during a game, I'm not convinced he's a premiership footballer never mind a United players; He's getting worse instead of better. Lingard offers next to nothing, he's appalling on the ball. They have 2 goals in 53 games between them this season and very few assists if any.

I like Ole and am desperate for him to succeed but he has no track record we can look to for hope, he needs a miracle to survive.

MM have to agree at this stage.

It looks like they are going to give him just enough rope so they dont have any back lash form the supporters. To be fair to them last night they recognised that it was a young side out and didnt give them the stick they would have coming off at half time had there been a few more of the older players.

Gomes looked bright when he came on, Fred for all his failings never drops his head and was busy enough last night always wants the ball and was encouraging the players around him.

Lingard and Andreas are too powder puff.

But it has to be recognised that any time you start with Phil Jones in the team it is never going to be good.

Young looks like he is for the exit which makes me think even more the board have given Ole the hatchet job and someone else will be coming in to do the rebuilding.

Fred is prone to the odd error but I'd put some of that down to playing with rubbish, never makes as many mistakes when he plays with McTominay; There's no doubt he's made huge improvements in his games.

Feel sorry for Jones though, we expect him to come in from the cold and play against one of the best teams in Europe. I'm more concerned about Lindelof next to him who was dreadful, Jones needs to play every week which is clearly not going to happen at OT.


NAG1

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4375
    • View Profile
Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #47920 on: January 08, 2020, 02:15:29 PM »
Another diabolical performance, thats the 3rd in the last 3 weeks. He'll do well to last the month, injuries are mounting and the likes of Rashford & Fred look shattered; United have games every 3/4 days during the month too, doesn't bode well.

Don't know what Ole has go to lose by giving Gomes a run in the team, Lingard & Pereira have continually shown all season their not good enough. Pereira makes so many mistakes during a game, I'm not convinced he's a premiership footballer never mind a United players; He's getting worse instead of better. Lingard offers next to nothing, he's appalling on the ball. They have 2 goals in 53 games between them this season and very few assists if any.

I like Ole and am desperate for him to succeed but he has no track record we can look to for hope, he needs a miracle to survive.

MM have to agree at this stage.

It looks like they are going to give him just enough rope so they dont have any back lash form the supporters. To be fair to them last night they recognised that it was a young side out and didnt give them the stick they would have coming off at half time had there been a few more of the older players.

Gomes looked bright when he came on, Fred for all his failings never drops his head and was busy enough last night always wants the ball and was encouraging the players around him.

Lingard and Andreas are too powder puff.

But it has to be recognised that any time you start with Phil Jones in the team it is never going to be good.

Young looks like he is for the exit which makes me think even more the board have given Ole the hatchet job and someone else will be coming in to do the rebuilding.

Fred is prone to the odd error but I'd put some of that down to playing with rubbish, never makes as many mistakes when he plays with McTominay; There's no doubt he's made huge improvements in his games.

Feel sorry for Jones though, we expect him to come in from the cold and play against one of the best teams in Europe. I'm more concerned about Lindelof next to him who was dreadful, Jones needs to play every week which is clearly not going to happen at OT.

Yeah that is a fair point.

Lindelof just seems to go to sleep, probably not tough enough either. When Jones does leave ends up playing more regularly he will end up doing ok.

Ed Ricketts

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 83
    • View Profile
Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #47921 on: January 08, 2020, 02:20:52 PM »
How could you write so much without mentioning the overwhelming main reason for all of this? The mind truly does boggle. I'll address some of it though which I found to be particularly unfair and it's in relation to the manager and his staff.....

Long reply Seanie, but I'm not so sure we're as far apart on this as you seem to think.

Of course everything comes back to the parasites that own the club, I thought this went without saying. Every misturn and poorly thought out strategy in the last decade stems from decisions made by these people and their executives - decisions made to maximise corporate exploitation and nothing else. If this goal ever allied with footballing success it was simply a bonus, but this has never been a priority. My question is where is the supporter outrage at this situation? 10 years ago we had green and gold scarves and threats of boycotts, but all I see now is meek acceptance of the status quo. Supporters will probably never be able to force these c***ts out, but at least make a noise and let it be known that you're unhappy about things.

Where I think we diverge is on Solskjaer and his backroom team. Like all supporters, I would've loved for a fairytale success story here but it's not going to happen. Of course they're trying their best, but the quality isn't there. The club has a manager who hasn't earned the right to manage at this level and coaches plucked from retirement or from the academy without the necessary experience and skills for the job at hand. It would be nice to share your optimism that the situation is much better than when Solskjaer first took change, but by every reasonable metric that just doesn't seem to be the case. Results have not improved, the football is still dreadful, and most of the biggest problems in the playing squad have not been addressed. It's also difficult to say with any certainty what sort of footballing philosophy Solskjaer brings to the place, what style of play is he attempting to implement - I'm sure it's something he and his staff are working on, but to date he has failed to get his players to consistently express anything encouraging. I also have my doubts about the strength of the manager's position within the club. He was given a job he didn't deserve by certain people and they will always have this leverage over him. This must make it very difficult for Solskjaer to go to the same people demanding the resources he wants and needs to improve the football team.

While the Glazers will still run the clubs to line their own pockets, I don't think they would be averse to a managerial change if supporters so demanded - and that is what should be happening. No one, probably not even the man himself, has any faith that Solskjaer will be in charge in two or three years time, so why would any prospective signing with ambition or a desire to carve out a career agree to join such an uncertain situation? What is the real reason Haaland choose to go to Dortmund? To get back to where it wants to be, and within the constraints created by the ownership, the club needs a stronger, more attractive figurehead leading the footballing side of things. Ideally, someone with a track record of creating a bit of identity about a team and with a reputation for giving talented young players an opportunity. In short, a Klopp type figure to which quality players and quality coaches will be attracted. I don't know who this might be, but United have the resources to go to all but the top ten or so clubs in the world and tell them to name their price, so there have to be options out there. There's no good reason to persist with the current failing experiment.

Geoff Tipps

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1864
    • View Profile
Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #47922 on: January 08, 2020, 02:52:49 PM »
Quote
Ole has bought 3 players. Maguire - injured for last night and has had a dip in form but clearly a good buy. Wan Bissaka - blotted out Raheem Sterling (again) last night and beginning to do more in an attacking sense. A resounding success of a purchase. James - thought he did ok but not one of his better games. Overall though another resounding success of a purchase. So 3 out of 3 purchases. A lot of players were let go in the summer because they had no future at the club. It's not possible to argue that any should have been kept. Probably another player or two should have been bought, I'll give you that.

Resounding successes?? Seriously!!?? Maguire cost a world record fee. He's barely an upgrade on Smalling. I can't see him being a mainstay of this defence if United have any
ambition of getting back to the top table. He's just too slow at this level and unless he's playing on the 18 yard line he's going to get caught out.
Wan Bissaka has been ok. He's an excellent defender but poor going forward. Again for the money that was spent you'd expect more.
James's form has fallen away but pound for pound he's been decent.

magpie seanie

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12686
    • View Profile
Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #47923 on: January 08, 2020, 02:56:02 PM »
Quote
Ole has bought 3 players. Maguire - injured for last night and has had a dip in form but clearly a good buy. Wan Bissaka - blotted out Raheem Sterling (again) last night and beginning to do more in an attacking sense. A resounding success of a purchase. James - thought he did ok but not one of his better games. Overall though another resounding success of a purchase. So 3 out of 3 purchases. A lot of players were let go in the summer because they had no future at the club. It's not possible to argue that any should have been kept. Probably another player or two should have been bought, I'll give you that.

Resounding successes?? Seriously!!?? Maguire cost a world record fee. He's barely an upgrade on Smalling. I can't see him being a mainstay of this defence if United have any
ambition of getting back to the top table. He's just too slow at this level and unless he's playing on the 18 yard line he's going to get caught out.
Wan Bissaka has been ok. He's an excellent defender but poor going forward. Again for the money that was spent you'd expect more.
James's form has fallen away but pound for pound he's been decent.


Ah here!  ::)

magpie seanie

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12686
    • View Profile
Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #47924 on: January 08, 2020, 03:03:16 PM »
How could you write so much without mentioning the overwhelming main reason for all of this? The mind truly does boggle. I'll address some of it though which I found to be particularly unfair and it's in relation to the manager and his staff.....

Long reply Seanie, but I'm not so sure we're as far apart on this as you seem to think.

Of course everything comes back to the parasites that own the club, I thought this went without saying. Every misturn and poorly thought out strategy in the last decade stems from decisions made by these people and their executives - decisions made to maximise corporate exploitation and nothing else. If this goal ever allied with footballing success it was simply a bonus, but this has never been a priority. My question is where is the supporter outrage at this situation? 10 years ago we had green and gold scarves and threats of boycotts, but all I see now is meek acceptance of the status quo. Supporters will probably never be able to force these c***ts out, but at least make a noise and let it be known that you're unhappy about things.

Where I think we diverge is on Solskjaer and his backroom team. Like all supporters, I would've loved for a fairytale success story here but it's not going to happen. Of course they're trying their best, but the quality isn't there. The club has a manager who hasn't earned the right to manage at this level and coaches plucked from retirement or from the academy without the necessary experience and skills for the job at hand. It would be nice to share your optimism that the situation is much better than when Solskjaer first took change, but by every reasonable metric that just doesn't seem to be the case. Results have not improved, the football is still dreadful, and most of the biggest problems in the playing squad have not been addressed. It's also difficult to say with any certainty what sort of footballing philosophy Solskjaer brings to the place, what style of play is he attempting to implement - I'm sure it's something he and his staff are working on, but to date he has failed to get his players to consistently express anything encouraging. I also have my doubts about the strength of the manager's position within the club. He was given a job he didn't deserve by certain people and they will always have this leverage over him. This must make it very difficult for Solskjaer to go to the same people demanding the resources he wants and needs to improve the football team.

While the Glazers will still run the clubs to line their own pockets, I don't think they would be averse to a managerial change if supporters so demanded - and that is what should be happening. No one, probably not even the man himself, has any faith that Solskjaer will be in charge in two or three years time, so why would any prospective signing with ambition or a desire to carve out a career agree to join such an uncertain situation? What is the real reason Haaland choose to go to Dortmund? To get back to where it wants to be, and within the constraints created by the ownership, the club needs a stronger, more attractive figurehead leading the footballing side of things. Ideally, someone with a track record of creating a bit of identity about a team and with a reputation for giving talented young players an opportunity. In short, a Klopp type figure to which quality players and quality coaches will be attracted. I don't know who this might be, but United have the resources to go to all but the top ten or so clubs in the world and tell them to name their price, so there have to be options out there. There's no good reason to persist with the current failing experiment.


Ole may not be the man to bring United the whole way back to the top but I'm convinced what he's doing in these early rebuilding stages are the correct steps so far. The inconsistency and lack of being competitive is difficult to endure. However, I don't think changing manager at this stage will improve things. That's probably where we differ. I'm not worried about his lack of prior managerial experience. Coaching in soccer seems to be a young mans game these days. Lots of relatively inexperienced managers doing well in the Premier League.