Man Utd Thread:

[From the Bunker]

A good article.

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/columnists/ken-early/why-united-dont-need-rvp-204726.html

Why United don't need RvP

By Ken Early

Monday, August 20, 2012

We are not like other clubs who can spend fortunes on proven goods.

We invest in players who will be with the club a long time, who will create the character of the club and the excitement for our fans. We are good at that and we are going to continue that way."

So Alex Ferguson told reporters at Manchester United's Player of the Year dinner in May. By then, Ferguson had already been chasing the signing of Robin van Persie for a couple of months.

It has been said that the signing of the Arsenal captain sends a message that Manchester United have the resources to compete with clubs like Manchester City for the top players. Actually, it suggests the opposite.

Before signing van Persie, United could pretend that the reason they hadn't signed an established star since Dimitar Berbatov was that to do so would go against their philosophy of success through investment in youth. Van Persie's arrival confirms that Ferguson has no problem in principle with signing "proven goods". The only reason he doesn't do it more often is that he can't afford to, thanks to the financial constraints imposed by the "great" Glazer regime.

If that was always rather obvious, it's not so obvious why Ferguson decided to commit a huge chunk of his resources to strengthen the one area of his team that seemed least in need of strengthening. Manchester United scored 89 goals in the league last season, their highest total in any campaign since 1999/2000, when they won the title by almost 20 points.

United's attack last season was so good that Dimitar Berbatov became redundant, Michael Owen was effectively retired and even Javier Hernandez struggled to get in the team. With Wayne Rooney prompting and Danny Welbeck doing the running, supported by Ashley Young, Nani and the ceaselessly productive Antonio Valencia, it looked like Ferguson had built a balanced attacking unit that could potentially remain in place for years.

Shinji Kagawa had already arrived to ensure United would not be short of options across the attacking line and it seemed Ferguson's thoughts would be turning towards how to restructure his midfield, where there is no quality cover for Paul Scholes and Michael Carrick, and defence, where Rio Ferdinand and Patrice Evra are no longer the forces they were.

Instead United have committed over €70m over four years to add van Persie to the attack. He is one of the best players in the league, but they don't need him. Rationally the transfer makes no sense. It looks as though irrational factors forced the issue. After the disappointment of last season, Ferguson felt he had to do something dramatic to change the mood, to reverse the creeping sense of decline.

At his unveiling, van Persie spoke of a little boy within him who was screaming for Manchester United. It was appropriate that he did so, because his signing appeals primarily to the little boys and girls in the hearts of all United fans. For every grown-up worried about whether signing a 29 year-old with a dubious injury record to reinforce an attack that doesn't need reinforcing represents the wisest way to allocate limited resources, there will be an inner child thrilled by the prospect of seeing van Persie play in the same team as Wayne Rooney.

As for van Persie, perhaps he will one day explain precisely how he came to conclude his differences with Arsene Wenger and Ivan Gazidis were irreconcilable. All we have had so far are vague hints. In July, he revealed he would not renew his Arsenal contract with a statement that included the lines: "This was a meeting about the club's future strategy and their policy... unfortunately in this meeting it has again become clear to me that we in many aspects disagree on the way Arsenal FC should move forward." It sounds as though the little boy who persuaded van Persie to join United was not invited to the meeting with Wenger and Gazidis.

Van Persie's July statement also claimed that "financial terms or a contract have not been discussed [at the meeting], since that is not my priority at all," but Arsene Wenger hinted over the weekend that van Persie had demanded £250,000 a week to remain at Arsenal. In the days following the transfer to United, a February 2011 interview with van Persie became a minor internet sensation.

"I don't have the inclination to go anywhere," he had said. "This is the best team for me to be in. The bottom line is that I want to win trophies with Arsenal, not with anybody else. I'm sure I could win things at another team in another country, but would it feel like our trophy, my trophy? I'm not sure it would."

How can you go from "This is the best team for me to be in" to "we in many aspects disagree on the way Arsenal FC should move forward" in the space of just 18 months? The answer has to do with a line a little earlier in that 2011 interview: "I think some people had forgotten me a little bit. I could sense that when I scored my hat-trick against Wigan."

Right now, it's hard to imagine a football world in which people had forgotten about van Persie a little bit. Yet in February 2011, van Persie had only recently returned from one of the long injury lay-offs which had characterised his Arsenal career. He had scored on average just over eight league goals a season. At the turn of 2011, something happened: he stopped getting injured, started scoring nearly a goal a game, and became the biggest star in the team. The change in his relationship with Arsenal is down to the change in his personal status. That stuff about 'doing it the Arsenal way' is all very well for a foot soldier, labouring on the margins of a struggling side. Superstars can afford to be more demanding.

[wildrover]

I believe RVP to be a superb signing...likewise Kagawa...Utd now have genuinely one of the best attacking units in world football with great options for the variety of environments/systems that they will encounter during the course of the season...

Journalists, pundits and 'experts' will continue to spew out sensationalist crap for as long as 'From the Bunker' continues to sponge it up...but ultimately they know as much or as little as we (Joe Public) do about the policies behind Ferguson's signings (whether he genuinely is severely financially handicapped, or whether he sees much greater value in gradually introducing young players into the first team on the strength of club loyalty etc.) We are not party to what goes on in the boardroom of old trafford.

Ultimately time will tell....

[onefaircounty]

I believe RVP to be a superb signing...likewise Kagawa...Utd now have genuinely one of the best attacking units in world football with great options for the variety of environments/systems that they will encounter during the course of the season...

Journalists, pundits and 'experts' will continue to spew out sensationalist crap for as long as 'From the Bunker' continues to sponge it up...but ultimately they know as much or as little as we (Joe Public) do about the policies behind Ferguson's signings (whether he genuinely is severely financially handicapped, or whether he sees much greater value in gradually introducing young players into the first team on the strength of club loyalty etc.) We are not party to what goes on in the boardroom of old trafford.

Ultimately time will tell....

But some of these journalists, pundits and experts are.

[wildrover]

I believe RVP to be a superb signing...likewise Kagawa...Utd now have genuinely one of the best attacking units in world football with great options for the variety of environments/systems that they will encounter during the course of the season...

Journalists, pundits and 'experts' will continue to spew out sensationalist crap for as long as 'From the Bunker' continues to sponge it up...but ultimately they know as much or as little as we (Joe Public) do about the policies behind Ferguson's signings (whether he genuinely is severely financially handicapped, or whether he sees much greater value in gradually introducing young players into the first team on the strength of club loyalty etc.) We are not party to what goes on in the boardroom of old trafford.

Ultimately time will tell....

But some of these journalists, pundits and experts are.

Really?...Who?...Ken Early?...John Aldridge?...Tony Cascarino?...AN OTHER?

I would hazard a guess that these guys who predictably and regularly forecast the collapse of the Man Utd empire bi-monthly in their newspaper columns are about as well informed about the inside going-ons at Old Trafford as you or I.

They tap into the A.B.U culture and expoit it.

I thought that article by Ken Early was atrocious...poorly written and full of contradictions. He did cleverly disguise his own interpretations and opinions as if they were facts but overall not much to get excited by.

[From the Bunker]

I believe RVP to be a superb signing...likewise Kagawa...Utd now have genuinely one of the best attacking units in world football with great options for the variety of environments/systems that they will encounter during the course of the season...

Journalists, pundits and 'experts' will continue to spew out sensationalist crap for as long as 'From the Bunker' continues to sponge it up...but ultimately they know as much or as little as we (Joe Public) do about the policies behind Ferguson's signings (whether he genuinely is severely financially handicapped, or whether he sees much greater value in gradually introducing young players into the first team on the strength of club loyalty etc.) We are not party to what goes on in the boardroom of old trafford.

Ultimately time will tell....

Ah, Journalists are only giving their angle on it. The god ones will put a spin to get you thinking. It's a speculation and all part of the entertainment of football. Van persie was bought for take that one chance you get in Europe, Also to free up Rooney for midfield.

[Orangemac]

Earley is a bit of a spoofer but as an outsider I think Utd should have looked to strengthen midfield.Scholes and Cleverley are both at wrong age.

Utd couldn't get close to Barca in 2010 (who could?) and slipped further behind last year. They need someone in the mould of Xavi, Scweinsteiger,Alonso etc who can control a game.

Moutinho would have been a great fit for Utd. Looked a class act in the Euros.

[The Worker]

Why didn't fergie pursue modric?

[ballinaman]

Looks like move for Hector Herrera is gathering momentum.

I was underwhelmed by him in the Olympics but United scouts see something.....hopefully.

So thats RVP(striker), Henriquez (striker).Kagawa(attacking midfielder), Powell (midfielder) Buttner (Left back) and maybe Herrera (centre mid)

Pretty much every position that needed to be looked at.

[EC Unique]

Why didn't fergie pursue modric?

As far as I see he wants to go to Spain and nowhere else. I would love to see him at Utd but if he does not want to come what can you do?

[wildrover]

Earley is a bit of a spoofer but as an outsider I think Utd should have looked to strengthen midfield.Scholes and Cleverley are both at wrong age.

Utd couldn't get close to Barca in 2010 (who could?) and slipped further behind last year. They need someone in the mould of Xavi, Scweinsteiger,Alonso etc who can control a game.

Moutinho would have been a great fit for Utd. Looked a class act in the Euros.

Agreed 100%. I was v.excited when utd were linked with Moutinho after the Euros.

Utd's central midfield is essentially a pick from giggs, scholes, cleverly, carrick, anderson, fletcher?...pretty anaemic really...giggs and scholes simply cannot last a full 90 minutes in the high tempo games any longer. I have high hopes for Cleverly and I think he could really establish himself this year, but Carrick is hugely frustrating and Anderson is a complete and utter tube. Fletcher may not play again...

In the Premier League they will hold their own in midfield, bar the might of Yaya & Co for city. In Europe they may hope someone else does their dirty work and knock out the spanish giants...

I fully expect their attack to fire on all cylinders however...Rooney, Van Persie, Nani, Valencia, Young, Welbeck, Hernandez, Berbatov...it would appear they are top-heavy and so attack might well be the best form of defence at the minute...this alone could make for an exciting season....

[The Worker]

Why didn't fergie pursue modric?

As far as I see he wants to go to Spain and nowhere else. I would love to see him at Utd but if he does not want to come what can you do?

How do you know this unless you make an approach?

[EC Unique]

Why didn't fergie pursue modric?

As far as I see he wants to go to Spain and nowhere else. I would love to see him at Utd but if he does not want to come what can you do?

How do you know this unless you make an approach?

They may well have been one!

[laoislad]

Why didn't fergie pursue modric?

As far as I see he wants to go to Spain and nowhere else. I would love to see him at Utd but if he does not want to come what can you do?

How do you know this unless you make an approach?

Come on The Worker, if Fergie really wanted him he would have got him.

[Captain Obvious]

Once United signed Kagawa any interest in Modric would be waned.

[The Worker]

Why didn't fergie pursue modric?

As far as I see he wants to go to Spain and nowhere else. I would love to see him at Utd but if he does not want to come what can you do?

Forgot this d'oh!
How do you know this unless you make an approach?

Come on The Worker, if Fergie really wanted him he would have got him.