Author Topic: Man Utd Thread:  (Read 3594587 times)

lurganblue

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Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #49275 on: November 05, 2020, 11:55:40 AM »
I only watched the second half last night but it was quite clear that Utd hadn't a clue how to approach getting back on level terms.  They have a real lack of creativity which is amazing considering some of the players on the pitch.  I mock throwing Maguire up top but that actually created a few chances.

Jeepers Creepers

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Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #49276 on: November 05, 2020, 11:58:33 AM »
I would hazard a guess and say its all going on in the background. Unless a DOF is brought with a new manager then Utd will be p*ssing in the wind.

brokencrossbar1

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Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #49277 on: November 05, 2020, 01:00:57 PM »
Looking like they have approached Poch to step in. International breaks are always a good time to give the manager the boot so don’t be surprised if he is handed his P45 irrespective of the result against Everton. No matter who takes over there is a real job to be done though. There is talent in the squad but if you look at the 2 goals last night you seriously need to question the mentality of the players. It’s pure Benny Hill play

BennyCake

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Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #49278 on: November 05, 2020, 02:16:27 PM »
It still feels like Ole's brief was to come in and work like a long term caretaker manager.
He restored a lot of the morale in the squad, ushered out a lot of deadwood and promoted youth.
While the boardroom transfer strategy has been poor, talent wise, the current squad is now not in a bad place. There are positions that should be strengthened, but there are a lot of options there too.

At some point a more elite manager will be required to come on and take the team to the next level - play consistently, adjust tactics and formations better etc.
Ole is in a limbo at the moment. Unless he puts in a strong run of results and re-establishes Utd as title challengers, then he will remain a couple of defeats away from getting the sack.
It feels like that exit could be close right now. He might grab a few wins and buy another stay of execution, but at some point soon there will be another dip.
Also, players sense this too. I believe subconsciously the players saw that Moyes, Van Gaal and Jose were dead men walking and didn't fully perform for them towards the end.

I believe a lot of the senior players never rated Moyes from the start, and performances never were great. Van Gaal was just a tube who got rid of all but one attacker (Rooney), played the most boring football with boring/dull players. Ole is still getting rid of the crap he brought in.

Jose, I reckon rubbed players up the wrong way, played mind games and behaved like a dick, and after a while people get fed up with that shit, and eventually will down tools. And that’s what they did.

Cunny Funt

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Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #49279 on: November 05, 2020, 02:21:57 PM »
It still feels like Ole's brief was to come in and work like a long term caretaker manager.
He restored a lot of the morale in the squad, ushered out a lot of deadwood and promoted youth.
While the boardroom transfer strategy has been poor, talent wise, the current squad is now not in a bad place. There are positions that should be strengthened, but there are a lot of options there too.

At some point a more elite manager will be required to come on and take the team to the next level - play consistently, adjust tactics and formations better etc.
Ole is in a limbo at the moment. Unless he puts in a strong run of results and re-establishes Utd as title challengers, then he will remain a couple of defeats away from getting the sack.
It feels like that exit could be close right now. He might grab a few wins and buy another stay of execution, but at some point soon there will be another dip.
Also, players sense this too. I believe subconsciously the players saw that Moyes, Van Gaal and Jose were dead men walking and didn't fully perform for them towards the end.

Does those runs matter anymore?

Last night's defeat ended Uniteds longest away winning run in all competitions in their history. First defeat since January and a run that included wins against Man City, Chelsea and PSG.

Ethan Tremblay

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Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #49280 on: November 05, 2020, 02:54:48 PM »
There seems to be a lot of different managerial types that have came and went, and the there are different excuses levelled at each of them.  Ironically, the predecessor type usually dictated the need for the opposite on the next type it would seem. 

Moyes – an apparent good appointment at the time, an experienced PL manager, but not experienced enough for a top job. 

Van Gaal – proven experience at handling the biggest clubs in the world, not experienced enough for the rigors of premier league football. 

Jose – a mixture of moyes and van gall, experienced premier league winner, adept at handling a club with big ambitions, but too much of a lone wolf character, not willing to buy into the United ethos, too controversial.   

Ole – caretaker manager, needed to mend a fractured squad, most likely not to ruffle any feathers with board/players/media.  Understands the clubs values etc.  No doubt a better atmosphere arrived during his first few months in charge that got him the gig full time.   

Now here we are back to square one, Ole is not experienced enough, to naive to manage the club, so Poch is the new man. 

Poch – experienced premier league manager, had taken a team well above their station domestically and in Europe, seems likeable, wouldn’t bring an ego and seems harmonious. 

The thing is, if Poch does get the job, the same pitfalls are going to befall him as it has the rest. 

I genuinely wouldn’t know who, after Poch gets run out of Manchester, would be next in line, Simeone possibly?
I am sure we will be recycling this conversation in about two years time regardless. 
I tend to think of myself as a one man wolfpack...

BennyCake

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Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #49281 on: November 05, 2020, 04:03:51 PM »
Seems like Poch is the last resort if Ole goes.

If there wasn’t this influx of foreign managers/players in the PL, clubs would be looking at British and Irish managers like in the early to mid 90’s. The likes of Keegan, Dalglish, Howard Wilkinson, Hoddle, George Graham, Souness, Redknapp, Joe Royle, Big Ron etc were managing the top teams then. Today’s equivalent would be the likes of Bruce, Hughes, Big Sam, Hughton, Dean Smith, Southgate, Lampard etc.

You might laugh at the likes of United going for such managers these day, but maybe that’s what is partly missing. Managers who came through the club, understand the links/past, the community/people working there and supporting the club, the youth set up, etc, rather than a foreign manager who has no links to the country, never mind the area.

It’s a shame in a way, because we all grew up watching these men as players and most of them don’t stand a chance of remaining with a top division team. All pushed out by the influx of foreign managers and club financiers demanding instant success and high profits.

Will it ever end

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Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #49282 on: November 05, 2020, 04:29:19 PM »
Or ... maybe being a good player or club legend doesn't necessarily make you a good manager ... if only there was a very recent example of this to back it up???

Geoff Tipps

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Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #49283 on: November 05, 2020, 04:30:45 PM »
Seems like Poch is the last resort if Ole goes.

If there wasn’t this influx of foreign managers/players in the PL, clubs would be looking at British and Irish managers like in the early to mid 90’s. The likes of Keegan, Dalglish, Howard Wilkinson, Hoddle, George Graham, Souness, Redknapp, Joe Royle, Big Ron etc were managing the top teams then. Today’s equivalent would be the likes of Bruce, Hughes, Big Sam, Hughton, Dean Smith, Southgate, Lampard etc.

You might laugh at the likes of United going for such managers these day, but maybe that’s what is partly missing. Managers who came through the club, understand the links/past, the community/people working there and supporting the club, the youth set up, etc, rather than a foreign manager who has no links to the country, never mind the area.

It’s a shame in a way, because we all grew up watching these men as players and most of them don’t stand a chance of remaining with a top division team. All pushed out by the influx of foreign managers and club financiers demanding instant success and high profits.

Surely he's top of the list if Ole goes!?

BennyCake

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Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #49284 on: November 05, 2020, 05:00:36 PM »
Or ... maybe being a good player or club legend doesn't necessarily make you a good manager ... if only there was a very recent example of this to back it up???

Yes but if you didn’t have all the foreign managers in the PL, you’re left with a lot of managers like those above. One of them would be winning the league, FA Cup etc. Someone like Mark Hughes or Steve Bruce could be at United winning all around them, or Big Sam doing likewise at Liverpool or Arsenal.

But we’ll never know because of those pesky foreigners

Captain Obvious

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Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #49285 on: November 05, 2020, 05:19:34 PM »
Or ... maybe being a good player or club legend doesn't necessarily make you a good manager ... if only there was a very recent example of this to back it up???

Yes but if you didn’t have all the foreign managers in the PL, you’re left with a lot of managers like those above. One of them would be winning the league, FA Cup etc. Someone like Mark Hughes or Steve Bruce could be at United winning all around them, or Big Sam doing likewise at Liverpool or Arsenal.

But we’ll never know because of those pesky foreigners

Serious or on the wind up? .

laoislad

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Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #49286 on: November 05, 2020, 05:21:38 PM »
Give it Giggsy? Oh wait......
Champions 2020

BennyCake

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Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #49287 on: November 05, 2020, 05:49:10 PM »
Or ... maybe being a good player or club legend doesn't necessarily make you a good manager ... if only there was a very recent example of this to back it up???

Yes but if you didn’t have all the foreign managers in the PL, you’re left with a lot of managers like those above. One of them would be winning the league, FA Cup etc. Someone like Mark Hughes or Steve Bruce could be at United winning all around them, or Big Sam doing likewise at Liverpool or Arsenal.

But we’ll never know because of those pesky foreigners

Serious or on the wind up? .

Well, take the British or Irish managers managing the highest placed teams: Rodgers, Lampard, Smith, Bruce, Hodgson, Moyes, Potter, Parker, Wilder, Dyche. Throw in Southgate, Giggs, Clarke. After that you have the likes of Hughton, Pulis, Monk, Michael O’Neill etc.

Take the foreign managers away, that’s who’d be winning the trophies.

Geoff Tipps

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Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #49288 on: November 05, 2020, 07:46:22 PM »
Or ... maybe being a good player or club legend doesn't necessarily make you a good manager ... if only there was a very recent example of this to back it up???

Yes but if you didn’t have all the foreign managers in the PL, you’re left with a lot of managers like those above. One of them would be winning the league, FA Cup etc. Someone like Mark Hughes or Steve Bruce could be at United winning all around them, or Big Sam doing likewise at Liverpool or Arsenal.

But we’ll never know because of those pesky foreigners

Serious or on the wind up? .

Well, take the British or Irish managers managing the highest placed teams: Rodgers, Lampard, Smith, Bruce, Hodgson, Moyes, Potter, Parker, Wilder, Dyche. Throw in Southgate, Giggs, Clarke. After that you have the likes of Hughton, Pulis, Monk, Michael O’Neill etc.

Take the foreign managers away, that’s who’d be winning the trophies.

If you took Dublin, Kerry and Donegal out of the last 10 years Mayo world have won 6 All Ireland's!! What's your point?? There's a reason the big clubs hire foreign managers. It's because they're generally the best in the business.

BennyCake

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Re: Man Utd Thread:
« Reply #49289 on: November 05, 2020, 09:09:47 PM »
Or ... maybe being a good player or club legend doesn't necessarily make you a good manager ... if only there was a very recent example of this to back it up???

Yes but if you didn’t have all the foreign managers in the PL, you’re left with a lot of managers like those above. One of them would be winning the league, FA Cup etc. Someone like Mark Hughes or Steve Bruce could be at United winning all around them, or Big Sam doing likewise at Liverpool or Arsenal.

But we’ll never know because of those pesky foreigners

Serious or on the wind up? .

Well, take the British or Irish managers managing the highest placed teams: Rodgers, Lampard, Smith, Bruce, Hodgson, Moyes, Potter, Parker, Wilder, Dyche. Throw in Southgate, Giggs, Clarke. After that you have the likes of Hughton, Pulis, Monk, Michael O’Neill etc.

Take the foreign managers away, that’s who’d be winning the trophies.

If you took Dublin, Kerry and Donegal out of the last 10 years Mayo world have won 6 All Ireland's!! What's your point?? There's a reason the big clubs hire foreign managers. It's because they're generally the best in the business.

Yes, money.

The big clubs werent hiring the top foreign coaches pre-mid 90’s, as there was more money in Italy, Spain etc.

My point was, that if the foreign managers weren’t in the PL, the local managers would be the ones winning and competing for the league/FA Cup etc. The same way Keegan, Dalglish, Big Ron, Royle, Evans, Graham, Wilkinson etc were in the 90’s.