Armagh v Derry - Ulster Final, 14th May, 2023 @ 4pm

[yellowcard]

It was a fantastic occasion yesterday and was tension filled with very little between the sides. The penalty shoot out added to the whole drama I thought and was a much better shoot out than the Galway match last year which had a bit of a sense of anti climax about it after an absorbing match. Yesterday the  match itself was fairly turgid for long spells due to its overly structured nature but it got a bit better as the game wore on and due to the scoreline being on a knife edge. Tough way to lose but Armagh gave everything out on the pitch but there will be a lot of retrospective analysis in the next few days when we look back at it. Soupy not starting the match and Morgan being left on McGuigan being the major decisions but I suppose the winner writes the script and the margins are very fine. It just feels like a huge opportunity was lost but we have enough time to re-gather and still have a good cut at the AI series.     

[Armagh18]

Is touching the keeper in the square at all not a foul?

Campbell when you look at it was very clever to get that foul but either team would have been at that.

You can tackle the ball but can't shoulder.. Free out if shouldered

From rule book
When he is within the small rectangle, the goalkeeper may not be charged but he may be challenged for possession of the ball, and his puck, kick or pass may be blocked. Incidental contact with the goalkeeper while playing the ball is permitted.

From me
I've no idea what a charge is (if is not a shoulder) and i'd guess noone does

Never seen a time when a keeper has been tackled inside and not been given a free tbh

[screenexile]

Tbh I don't think you'd find a ref in the country who wouldn't give Campbell's free and I think it was a free but he did make the most of it lol. (Not a slight anyone does that).

I thought Lynch was standing in the square when he was put out by a shoulder though may be remembering incorrectly.

Tbh draw near enough fair result.

100% I thought Campbells was a free McFaul was tackling with his near hand and was OK but Murray was behind Campbell and he tackled with the wrong hand so I had no issue with it even  if he did go down a bit easy.

[tyrone08]

Ah here, Campbell getting "shoved in the back" stretches the limits of credulity. He was lightly tackled from either side. You could maybe just about find a foul with it if you tried hard enough but he certainly went down easily. Lynch was definitely shouldered inside the box for the 45 but then should have been done for over carrying before the throw ball.

The trip on McGuigan I didn't think was that big a deal to be honest. Looked as if his hand more brushed against his leg in an attempt to trip. Certainly didn't have a good grip of him or clobber his leg a la Peter Stringer. Morgan still being on McGuigan at that stage possibly the biggest indictment of Armagh management on the day.

11 min 55 seconds. Clear 2 hands in his back
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LLLv8ABONac&pp=ygUlYXJtYWdoIHZzIGRlcnJ5IGZ1bGwgbWF0Y2ggZXh0cmEgdGltZQ%3D%3D

[tyrone08]

I catched the supposed foul on the keeper there again on YouTube. Armagh players doesn't even shoulder him as I first thought. Keeper runs into his chest and then turns around and steps over the white line

[square_ball]

McPartlan starting on Rodgers was a poor call by McGeeney as well.

[JimStynes]

It was a fantastic occasion yesterday and was tension filled with very little between the sides. The penalty shoot out added to the whole drama I thought and was a much better shoot out than the Galway match last year which had a bit of a sense of anti climax about it after an absorbing match. Yesterday the  match itself was fairly turgid for long spells due to its overly structured nature but it got a bit better as the game wore on and due to the scoreline being on a knife edge. Tough way to lose but Armagh gave everything out on the pitch but there will be a lot of retrospective analysis in the next few days when we look back at it. Soupy not starting the match and Morgan being left on McGuigan being the major decisions but I suppose the winner writes the script and the margins are very fine. It just feels like a huge opportunity was lost but we have enough time to re-gather and still have a good cut at the AI series.   

I like Soupy coming in when the game opens up a bit but he maybe should have been brought in sooner. Grugan should have kicked the winner and that should have been that. I thought it was too far out but when I watched it back on TV last night it was more than kickable. He was maybe just punctured at that stage of the match.

[jmcgdoire]

Ah here, Campbell getting "shoved in the back" stretches the limits of credulity. He was lightly tackled from either side. You could maybe just about find a foul with it if you tried hard enough but he certainly went down easily. Lynch was definitely shouldered inside the box for the 45 but then should have been done for over carrying before the throw ball.

The trip on McGuigan I didn't think was that big a deal to be honest. Looked as if his hand more brushed against his leg in an attempt to trip. Certainly didn't have a good grip of him or clobber his leg a la Peter Stringer. Morgan still being on McGuigan at that stage possibly the biggest indictment of Armagh management on the day.

11 min 55 seconds. Clear 2 hands in his back
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LLLv8ABONac&pp=ygUlYXJtYWdoIHZzIGRlcnJ5IGZ1bGwgbWF0Y2ggZXh0cmEgdGltZQ%3D%3D

12:27 Murray touches his back. No pressure at all but this is this is a foul by the book. Campbell went down awful easy (as any man would). Its frustrating but have to agree with Gough who I thought was very good yesterday

[imtommygunn]

Is touching the keeper in the square at all not a foul?

Campbell when you look at it was very clever to get that foul but either team would have been at that.

You can tackle the ball but can't shoulder.. Free out if shouldered

From rule book
When he is within the small rectangle, the goalkeeper may not be charged but he may be challenged for possession of the ball, and his puck, kick or pass may be blocked. Incidental contact with the goalkeeper while playing the ball is permitted.

From me
I've no idea what a charge is (if is not a shoulder) and i'd guess noone does

Never seen a time when a keeper has been tackled inside and not been given a free tbh

Happens regularly.

Also I have no idea what a charge is.... is it a shoulder charge? If not then it's a foul anywhere on the pitch surely...

[Armamike]

Nothing between the sides and sickening to lose out on penalties again.  The way both sides approached the game in the first half I found terrible to watch, taking turns to build their way up the pitch and keep ball.  Was dreading we were going to get this the whole game. It's part of the GAA dna to get stuck in and it's hard to watch teams sit off and concede possession, especially when a team like Derry are so good at keeping the ball and moving it around. Galway the same. 

Derry ones will probably feel they had chances to win in normal time but can't escape the feeling that we blew it.  Had the game in our hands to win at 2 key times and couldn't do it.  Rory's kick had to go over, by hook or by crook, if that meant taking more steps to get an advantage. Maybe it's being harsh but that's the killer instinct we don't seem to have. In extra time, winning 2 going into the last couple of minutes.  Do what it takes to get over the line.  Someone show for the ball for the short kickout, win it long it or break it, go down with cramp. Whatever it takes, just get over the line.

[lurganblue]

A bit of a contradiction... I thought Derry were the better side on the day, but really Armagh should have won it.  Our first half shooting was horrendous. Grugan's mark was scoreable imo.  Jarly óg needed to be more ruthless bearing down on goal to kill the game (maybe i'm being harsh there?), 2 points up with minutes to play. I think a top top team gets over the line.

I felt completely flat going into the penalties.

[Mario]

A bit of a contradiction... I thought Derry were the better side on the day, but really Armagh should have won it.  Our first half shooting was horrendous. Grugan's mark was scoreable imo.  Jarly óg needed to be more ruthless bearing down on goal to kill the game (maybe i'm being harsh there?), 2 points up with minutes to play. I think a top top team gets over the line.

I felt completely flat going into the penalties.

Probably agree with this. In normal time we led nearly the whole game but couldn't get 3 points ahead. Rogers fisted effort off the post would have done that and probably won us the game which was very frustrating at the time. The minute he got black carded and Armagh went into extra time with an extra man, the momentum, and a favourable breeze i thought we had no chance.

All the Armagh fans around me were quite happy for Jarly og to fist that over at the time - hindsight is a wonderful thing. Grugans mark wasn't easy shooting into those goals. I thought Armagh's shooting was pretty good especially against the breeze they pinged over a few beauties.

[Mr.miskick]

 First time poster and disappointed Armagh fan. Just a few thoughts on yesterdays game. Derry are excellent in possession of the ball and rarely get turned over. Their support play and running from angles is terrific and they seem to be able to find ways to be patient and eventually cut through a blanket defense to get a score. Armagh allowing them the short kick-out was unwise. They are not a team you want to invite on to you. Armagh were  much more effective when they pressed up on the Derry Kick-out but it took them a long time to cop on to this. Morgan's selection on Derry's most dangerous forward seemed a bit strange. I believe this was Morgan's first start in a competitive game in a very long time. Odd to get selected for the final on their best player who goes on to be man of the match. Armagh's inability to find an orange jersey from their own kick-out when they are under a press and possession is vital is a reoccurring problem and is one of the main reasons why they lose so many tight matches. Indiscipline and becoming overly emotional is also holding Armagh back from closing out tight games. Their key men go in full blooded and over-hyped when the pressure is at it's peak usually resulting in fouls and cards and free kicks being moved forward. This is a time in games for calm heads and cuteness not hotheads. A lot of these issues have been holding this team back from taking the next step for a long time and do not seem to be improving. Hopefully can be worked on and improved upon for the next stage of games but I am not so sure.

[yellowcard]

It was a fantastic occasion yesterday and was tension filled with very little between the sides. The penalty shoot out added to the whole drama I thought and was a much better shoot out than the Galway match last year which had a bit of a sense of anti climax about it after an absorbing match. Yesterday the  match itself was fairly turgid for long spells due to its overly structured nature but it got a bit better as the game wore on and due to the scoreline being on a knife edge. Tough way to lose but Armagh gave everything out on the pitch but there will be a lot of retrospective analysis in the next few days when we look back at it. Soupy not starting the match and Morgan being left on McGuigan being the major decisions but I suppose the winner writes the script and the margins are very fine. It just feels like a huge opportunity was lost but we have enough time to re-gather and still have a good cut at the AI series.   

I like Soupy coming in when the game opens up a bit but he maybe should have been brought in sooner. Grugan should have kicked the winner and that should have been that. I thought it was too far out but when I watched it back on TV last night it was more than kickable. He was maybe just punctured at that stage of the match.

I think we signalled our intent by replacing a midfielder and a forward with 2 defenders before throw in allowing the early part of the game to be played on Derrys terms. Playing soupy midfield on Rogers would have given Derry more to think about and he injected some much needed impetus into Armagh when he came on. I'd never buy the theory that you save one of your best players for the latter part of the game, we did that last season with Campbell early in the championship until he was playing so well that there was no option left but to start him. It seems like we have gone back to this train of thought again for some reason.

With the Grugan free I think it was a combination of a very stiff breeze and the fact that he looked knackered. I never felt confident when he was standing over it as his shooting range would be much closer in than a Shane McGuigan or Rian O'Neill.   

[jmcgdoire]

https://youtu.be/LLLv8ABONac

Watching this half of extra time back four things jumped out at me.

1. Campbel lwas inspirational
2. Toner has the most unconventional freekick routine
3. Paul Cassidy had no business shooting from over his head with a minute left up by a point
4. Derry should have been fouling the Armagh men much sooner or their last attack

Cant to say either team deserved to win because really neither team deserved to lose.