Author Topic: Penalty for denying a clear goal scoring opportunity  (Read 1721 times)

Laois Rising

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Penalty for denying a clear goal scoring opportunity
« on: November 17, 2020, 01:40:43 PM »
Is it time that the GAA bring in a rule whereby a penalty is awarded (along with a black card), regardless of where the foul takes place, if the referee believes that a clear goal scoring opportunity has been blatantly denied. The Galway v Mayo game another example to add to the ever growing list of these kind of fouls that are ultimately going rewarded. Other sports e.g. hockey have this type of ruling and it works very effectively.

Football has become professional in the nature of how it is played therefore we need appropriate rules to tackle the professional fouling that has entered the game.

pbat

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Re: Penalty for denying a clear goal scoring opportunity
« Reply #1 on: November 17, 2020, 01:50:06 PM »
I would change the black to a straight red with a four week ( or two games) ban.

J70

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Re: Penalty for denying a clear goal scoring opportunity
« Reply #2 on: November 17, 2020, 01:54:59 PM »
Straight red and a penalty.

It would soon stop then.

Black card when a point or two up with a few minutes left is about the equivalent of a gentle slap on the wrist.

grounded

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Re: Penalty for denying a clear goal scoring opportunity
« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2020, 02:01:30 PM »
I would change the black to a straight red with a four week ( or two games) ban.

Yep should at least be a straight red and award a penalty. But would be a tough call for a referee to make.

The black card could really be removed all together and those infractions lumped in with yellow cards. With a yellow card giving you 10 mins on the line.

BennyCake

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Re: Penalty for denying a clear goal scoring opportunity
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2020, 03:13:39 PM »
We all know when a blatant Black card offence takes place eg Mayo v Galway, Sean Cavanagh etc, but there’s so many players black carded that aren’t black card offences.

I do agree with a penalty for a blatant black card offence, but there’d still be as many inconsistencies as there are already.

J70

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Re: Penalty for denying a clear goal scoring opportunity
« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2020, 03:21:50 PM »
We all know when a blatant Black card offence takes place eg Mayo v Galway, Sean Cavanagh etc, but there’s so many players black carded that aren’t black card offences.

I do agree with a penalty for a blatant black card offence, but there’d still be as many inconsistencies as there are already.

There'll always be inconsistencies, but the incentive to just slice down or rugby tackle an opponent clean through on goal needs to be taken away.

Do it to someone to prevent a team breaking so you can get your numbers back - give them a 14 yard free in front of the posts or something.

The system is loaded in favour of the defending team and how cynical they want to be. Take that away.

LeoMc

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Re: Penalty for denying a clear goal scoring opportunity
« Reply #6 on: November 17, 2020, 03:27:23 PM »
Rugby has it right. France v Ireland Penalty try and 10 minutes in the bin.

GetOverTheBar

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Re: Penalty for denying a clear goal scoring opportunity
« Reply #7 on: November 17, 2020, 03:34:15 PM »
Rugby has it right. France v Ireland Penalty try and 10 minutes in the bin.

Pretty much this alright, a penalty being awarded for a trip, pull or illegal tackle of any kind from behind or purposely late to the side to stop a clear goal scoring opportunity.

Angelo

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Re: Penalty for denying a clear goal scoring opportunity
« Reply #8 on: November 17, 2020, 03:56:08 PM »
Straight red and a penalty.

It would soon stop then.

Black card when a point or two up with a few minutes left is about the equivalent of a gentle slap on the wrist.

Fair punishment but would you trust referees to enforce it correctly? A red card and penalty are huge match turning events, I'd have serious concerns about referees judgement to get massive game changing decisions right.

For me there should be a different punishment in the last 10 minutes of the game compared to the first 60. With a sin bin players is generally not going to make that foul in a tight game before the 60th minute leaving his team down a man for a considerable amount of the game.

Down should have buried the game against Cavan when Reilly was in the sinbin, Mooney had a glorious goal chance that I think would have put Down 13 points up coming close to HT.

J70

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Re: Penalty for denying a clear goal scoring opportunity
« Reply #9 on: November 17, 2020, 04:09:43 PM »
Straight red and a penalty.

It would soon stop then.

Black card when a point or two up with a few minutes left is about the equivalent of a gentle slap on the wrist.

Fair punishment but would you trust referees to enforce it correctly? A red card and penalty are huge match turning events, I'd have serious concerns about referees judgement to get massive game changing decisions right.

For me there should be a different punishment in the last 10 minutes of the game compared to the first 60. With a sin bin players is generally not going to make that foul in a tight game before the 60th minute leaving his team down a man for a considerable amount of the game.

Down should have buried the game against Cavan when Reilly was in the sinbin, Mooney had a glorious goal chance that I think would have put Down 13 points up coming close to HT.

There are lots of things that are huge match-turning events. Sometimes refs get them wrong. There's no avoiding that. They get only one real-time, varying-quality, look at something after all.

However, hacking down someone who is clean through on goal instead of trying to fairly tackle them, knowing that you'll only "suffer" the penalty of a black card, is also a match-turning event. Yes, with the red card/penalty punishment you'll have a team now and again feeling hard done by, but at least that would be through an honest refereeing mistake. As things stand you have teams feeling hard done by  due to unsporting cynicism, basically cheating, being indulged, even encouraged, by the rules of the sport itself.
« Last Edit: November 17, 2020, 04:11:21 PM by J70 »

Rossfan

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Re: Penalty for denying a clear goal scoring opportunity
« Reply #10 on: November 17, 2020, 04:16:06 PM »
Foul play shouldn't pay.
Unfortunately in Gaelic football it does pay and even more so in Hurley stuff.
Still Connacht Champions

Angelo

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Re: Penalty for denying a clear goal scoring opportunity
« Reply #11 on: November 17, 2020, 04:34:54 PM »
Straight red and a penalty.

It would soon stop then.

Black card when a point or two up with a few minutes left is about the equivalent of a gentle slap on the wrist.

Fair punishment but would you trust referees to enforce it correctly? A red card and penalty are huge match turning events, I'd have serious concerns about referees judgement to get massive game changing decisions right.

For me there should be a different punishment in the last 10 minutes of the game compared to the first 60. With a sin bin players is generally not going to make that foul in a tight game before the 60th minute leaving his team down a man for a considerable amount of the game.

Down should have buried the game against Cavan when Reilly was in the sinbin, Mooney had a glorious goal chance that I think would have put Down 13 points up coming close to HT.

There are lots of things that are huge match-turning events. Sometimes refs get them wrong. There's no avoiding that. They get only one real-time, varying-quality, look at something after all.

However, hacking down someone who is clean through on goal instead of trying to fairly tackle them, knowing that you'll only "suffer" the penalty of a black card, is also a match-turning event. Yes, with the red card/penalty punishment you'll have a team now and again feeling hard done by, but at least that would be through an honest refereeing mistake. As things stand you have teams feeling hard done by  due to unsporting cynicism, basically cheating, being indulged, even encouraged, by the rules of the sport itself.

But in the current rule I don't think many players would do what McLaughlin did in the first 60 minutes of a game with 2 points between the teams.

It only becomes a factor in the last 5 or 6 minutes of a game.

What happen when a player is through on goal has a defender behind him who is trying to tackle him and ends up putting his hand in to win the ball, the forward then pulls the defenders hand in, falls over and drags the defender with him.

The ref could end up sending a player off, awarding a penalty and have a team play the rest of the match for 14 men and its so easy to get wrong, particularly when referees are not of a good standard.

McLaughlin does not make that foul before the 60th minute. It does not pay to make that foul before then.

Blowitupref

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Re: Penalty for denying a clear goal scoring opportunity
« Reply #12 on: November 17, 2020, 05:15:07 PM »
A red card and misses the next game should be the punishment. Black cards are well past their sell by date at this stage. Red and yellow cards is enough for already confused and poor quality refs.
Is the ref going to finally blow his whistle?... No, he's going to blow his nose

Armagh18

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Re: Penalty for denying a clear goal scoring opportunity
« Reply #13 on: November 17, 2020, 05:35:54 PM »
No chance. There’s more than enough rules in the game. Plus would you really trust refs with making that call?

J70

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Re: Penalty for denying a clear goal scoring opportunity
« Reply #14 on: November 17, 2020, 05:36:00 PM »
Straight red and a penalty.

It would soon stop then.

Black card when a point or two up with a few minutes left is about the equivalent of a gentle slap on the wrist.

Fair punishment but would you trust referees to enforce it correctly? A red card and penalty are huge match turning events, I'd have serious concerns about referees judgement to get massive game changing decisions right.

For me there should be a different punishment in the last 10 minutes of the game compared to the first 60. With a sin bin players is generally not going to make that foul in a tight game before the 60th minute leaving his team down a man for a considerable amount of the game.

Down should have buried the game against Cavan when Reilly was in the sinbin, Mooney had a glorious goal chance that I think would have put Down 13 points up coming close to HT.

There are lots of things that are huge match-turning events. Sometimes refs get them wrong. There's no avoiding that. They get only one real-time, varying-quality, look at something after all.

However, hacking down someone who is clean through on goal instead of trying to fairly tackle them, knowing that you'll only "suffer" the penalty of a black card, is also a match-turning event. Yes, with the red card/penalty punishment you'll have a team now and again feeling hard done by, but at least that would be through an honest refereeing mistake. As things stand you have teams feeling hard done by  due to unsporting cynicism, basically cheating, being indulged, even encouraged, by the rules of the sport itself.

But in the current rule I don't think many players would do what McLaughlin did in the first 60 minutes of a game with 2 points between the teams.

It only becomes a factor in the last 5 or 6 minutes of a game.

What happen when a player is through on goal has a defender behind him who is trying to tackle him and ends up putting his hand in to win the ball, the forward then pulls the defenders hand in, falls over and drags the defender with him.

The ref could end up sending a player off, awarding a penalty and have a team play the rest of the match for 14 men and its so easy to get wrong, particularly when referees are not of a good standard.

McLaughlin does not make that foul before the 60th minute. It does not pay to make that foul before then.

I get all of that, and those are details which would obviously have to be discussed and debated, although I'm not that concerned about forwards trying to pull someone down on themselves. Its happens now and again, but I seriously doubt any forward clean through on goal is going to instead stop and try to stage a foul instead of going for glory.

My biggest concern is that we have big games coming up over the next month, and you can absolutely guarantee that if its tight, and a player does get free ahead of the defense, he is going to be unceremoniously taken out. There is no chance he gets through for a shot if anyone can get near him.

That cannot be allowed to stand in our game.