Author Topic: Can we help out a local soccer club?  (Read 1861 times)

thewobbler

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4443
    • View Profile
    • Balllyholland Harps GAC
Re: Can we help out a local soccer club?
« Reply #15 on: September 14, 2020, 06:51:01 PM »
Itchy the rules arenít always a bollocks.

Theyíre there to protect us from ourselves. Get a fly by night committee in and if they arenít held accountable to a constitution, then things could get get out of hand very quickly.

Plenty of our rules change every year, including some seismic ones, to reflect changes in our culture.

But I canít see that particular one ever being reversed. Our ancestors worked too hard to provide us the facilities we have now, to make GAA the cornerstone of every rural community in Ireland, to flippantly hand then over to everyone.

StephenC

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 530
    • View Profile
Re: Can we help out a local soccer club?
« Reply #16 on: September 14, 2020, 10:07:48 PM »
The committee certainly want to help out, and I'm happy that the membership will support. There are good relationships in the area and several kids play with both the soccer and GAA teams. But the nervousness is about insurance. Based on the responses here I don't see how we can go ahead and still be confident that we are protecting the people involved in the event of a serious accident.

We'll be meeting with them again later in the week and we can talk through ideas. Thanks for the help folks.  :(

Last Man

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 825
  • You wont like it when i get angry
    • View Profile
Re: Can we help out a local soccer club?
« Reply #17 on: September 15, 2020, 10:33:45 AM »
Could be wrong about the location but I have a memeory of there being a soccer pitch at the end of Borris Ileighs main pitch, that was close to 10 years ago mind.  It gave their lads something to do in the winter at that time.

thewobbler

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4443
    • View Profile
    • Balllyholland Harps GAC
Re: Can we help out a local soccer club?
« Reply #18 on: September 15, 2020, 11:12:32 AM »
The committee certainly want to help out, and I'm happy that the membership will support. There are good relationships in the area and several kids play with both the soccer and GAA teams. But the nervousness is about insurance. Based on the responses here I don't see how we can go ahead and still be confident that we are protecting the people involved in the event of a serious accident.

We'll be meeting with them again later in the week and we can talk through ideas. Thanks for the help folks.  :(

Honestly, if your committee are considering ignoring their own constitution, they shouldnít be in their roles.


Rossfan

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 16915
  • Ballaghaderreen CO ROSCOMMON
    • View Profile
    • Roscommon County Board official website
Re: Can we help out a local soccer club?
« Reply #19 on: September 15, 2020, 11:46:38 AM »
Nothing like a hardline Nordie to set ye bucks straight. ::)
Still Connacht Champions

thewobbler

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4443
    • View Profile
    • Balllyholland Harps GAC
Re: Can we help out a local soccer club?
« Reply #20 on: September 15, 2020, 12:01:30 PM »
Nothing like a hardline Nordie to set ye bucks straight. ::)

Nothing hard line about it.

If a committee isnít held accountable to its constitution, then things like this can happen:

- All soccer club members join GAA club.
- Soccer committee then stand for election at GAA AGM.
- A foothold is gained.
- Over the course of time (which might be days, months, years... or maybe never), this foothold is exploited regularly in soccerís favour.

Iím not telling you where this scenario ends up. But eventually the constitution is re-engaged, and there are clubs that have folded and split over lesser issues.

óó

Soccer is not the enemy. Personally I love the game. But it has extraordinary advantages over Gaelic Games due to its simplicity, itís worldwide appeal and media presence, the professional route, and in certain ways, just how easy it is to change clubs.

Gaelic Games has its own advantages. For example, itís a more appealing game for more physical people. But its single greatest advantage is that its grounds, games and culture are the cornerstone of almost every rural community in Ireland. This is because we own the land and we look after it specifically to maintain that advantage. This is something that shouldnít be eroded because a few lads out west like soccer a lot. Thatís not a good enough excuse in my book.


mouview

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1662
    • View Profile
Re: Can we help out a local soccer club?
« Reply #21 on: September 15, 2020, 12:27:48 PM »
Are you sure the club grounds are vested in the GAA. If not, then it has no jurisdiction over them. Then, insurance coverage may also be a factor.

Rossfan

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 16915
  • Ballaghaderreen CO ROSCOMMON
    • View Profile
    • Roscommon County Board official website
Re: Can we help out a local soccer club?
« Reply #22 on: September 15, 2020, 12:40:20 PM »
Does Wobb want a ban on members of soccer clubs becoming members of the GAA??
Still Connacht Champions

StephenC

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 530
    • View Profile
Re: Can we help out a local soccer club?
« Reply #23 on: September 15, 2020, 01:50:51 PM »
Nothing like a hardline Nordie to set ye bucks straight. ::)

Nothing hard line about it.

If a committee isnít held accountable to its constitution, then things like this can happen:

- All soccer club members join GAA club.
- Soccer committee then stand for election at GAA AGM.
- A foothold is gained.
- Over the course of time (which might be days, months, years... or maybe never), this foothold is exploited regularly in soccerís favour.

Iím not telling you where this scenario ends up. But eventually the constitution is re-engaged, and there are clubs that have folded and split over lesser issues.

óó

Soccer is not the enemy. Personally I love the game. But it has extraordinary advantages over Gaelic Games due to its simplicity, itís worldwide appeal and media presence, the professional route, and in certain ways, just how easy it is to change clubs.

Gaelic Games has its own advantages. For example, itís a more appealing game for more physical people. But its single greatest advantage is that its grounds, games and culture are the cornerstone of almost every rural community in Ireland. This is because we own the land and we look after it specifically to maintain that advantage. This is something that shouldnít be eroded because a few lads out west like soccer a lot. Thatís not a good enough excuse in my book.

Not sure what type of committees and people you have been involved with, but it certainly differs to mine. The sort of multi-year, strategic takeover of a GAA club by a group of cunning soccer-types that you are describing is fun to think about, but not that I realistic I feel.

Anyway, right now it looks like we are stuck.

thewobbler

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4443
    • View Profile
    • Balllyholland Harps GAC
Re: Can we help out a local soccer club?
« Reply #24 on: September 15, 2020, 02:00:41 PM »
I think youíre maybe missing my point.

Itís a scenario much less likely to unfold as long as committees are bound to a constitution.

If committees though can just do what they like, it creates opportunities for Non-GAA interests to be satisfied.

ó-

Ros thereís no need to twist my words and make me sound anti-soccer. My own club is full of members who are also members of soccer clubs, including my children, and not so long ago me. I would encourage any Gaelic Footballer to play soccer, and vice versa.

If you donít want to see the dangers in GAA clubs breaking their constitutions, thatís okay. Fire away. But donít make me out as something Iím not.



StephenC

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 530
    • View Profile
Re: Can we help out a local soccer club?
« Reply #25 on: September 15, 2020, 02:13:14 PM »
Are you sure the club grounds are vested in the GAA. If not, then it has no jurisdiction over them. Then, insurance coverage may also be a factor.

Yeah, it's a GAA ground.

Downtothewire

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 37
    • View Profile
Re: Can we help out a local soccer club?
« Reply #26 on: September 15, 2020, 04:08:06 PM »
I think youíre maybe missing my point.

Itís a scenario much less likely to unfold as long as committees are bound to a constitution.

If committees though can just do what they like, it creates opportunities for Non-GAA interests to be satisfied.

ó-

Ros thereís no need to twist my words and make me sound anti-soccer. My own club is full of members who are also members of soccer clubs, including my children, and not so long ago me. I would encourage any Gaelic Footballer to play soccer, Hurling and vice versa.

If you donít want to see the dangers in GAA clubs breaking their constitutions, thatís okay. Fire away. But donít make me out as something Iím not.

Corrected that for you

Itchy

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4987
    • View Profile
Re: Can we help out a local soccer club?
« Reply #27 on: September 15, 2020, 04:53:33 PM »
My GAA club used to take a very negative view of soccer, a few dinosaurs on both sides didnt help. Recently the same people who are coaches and volunteers in GAA club are the same people in the soccer club. Relations are good now. We work around each others for training, we understand  the load on some kids better that play both sports. Earlier in the year when the GAA banned all training on their grounds, the soccer club (who were in their off season) offered us use of their ground for a few weeks and we paid them a rate. We've never been asked by them for our grounds but if we did I feel we would work something as almost every player on their team is also a member of the GAA club.

I asked a question earlier, I suppose Wobbler you have taken a hard line so maybe you could give your thoughts on it. If a GAA training session ends with the lads playing a game of soccer for a bit of craic are they still insured and has the constitution of the GAA been broken? I recall many moons ago that exact thing used to happen in GAA centric Cavan and there was no soccer club within 20 miles of us.

thewobbler

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4443
    • View Profile
    • Balllyholland Harps GAC
Re: Can we help out a local soccer club?
« Reply #28 on: September 15, 2020, 06:40:50 PM »
My GAA club used to take a very negative view of soccer, a few dinosaurs on both sides didnt help. Recently the same people who are coaches and volunteers in GAA club are the same people in the soccer club. Relations are good now. We work around each others for training, we understand  the load on some kids better that play both sports. Earlier in the year when the GAA banned all training on their grounds, the soccer club (who were in their off season) offered us use of their ground for a few weeks and we paid them a rate. We've never been asked by them for our grounds but if we did I feel we would work something as almost every player on their team is also a member of the GAA club.

I asked a question earlier, I suppose Wobbler you have taken a hard line so maybe you could give your thoughts on it. If a GAA training session ends with the lads playing a game of soccer for a bit of craic are they still insured and has the constitution of the GAA been broken? I recall many moons ago that exact thing used to happen in GAA centric Cavan and there was no soccer club within 20 miles of us.


Of course theyíre insured. Theyíre playing members of a GAA club, training for Gaelic Games.

Thatís why this isnít just about insurance Itchy, for your next question will be ďwell what if it was only the soccer club players who stayed behind?Ē quickly followed by ďand what if there just happened to be no actual GAA training or if it was called off at the last minute?Ē.

Itís about the Associationís rules and club constitution. You might find it acceptable to pay lip service to such things. But I guarantee you that even if the active members of your club have a healthy relationship with local soccer, that thereís dozens of your members would be vehemently against pitch sharing, and hundreds who would be worried about it. So if your committee were to go on a solo run on this one, without the blessing of members and trustees, itís the kind of action that could cause a chasm.

And then do you know what would happen? Your trustees would be called in, your  clubís constitution would be dug up, and soccer would be kindly told not to ask again.

This isnít rocket science. Constitutions largely exist to stop clubs eating themselves by accident.



hardstation

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26354
  • On a cold and misty morning on the Anagaire bridge
    • View Profile
    • gaaboard.com
Re: Can we help out a local soccer club?
« Reply #29 on: September 15, 2020, 06:52:55 PM »
Although clubs & committees make decisions that fly in the face of the GAAís rules & club constitutions all the time to the point where not only is it the norm, it is expected and even demanded. Paying people to manage teams.