Author Topic: Defensive football  (Read 2741 times)

befair

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Defensive football
« on: July 20, 2020, 04:54:05 PM »
This is depressing. Was talking to a ref, who has officiated at two recent games. As no spectators allowed, depending on his reports. Both were low-scoring, and both, he says, had the same old defensive tactics, 15 men behind the ball, short, uncontested kick-outs, endless hand-passing around the 45 meter line. So despite all the rule changes designed to disincentivise the defensive game the coaches haven't changed.
Time for something more dramatic? Maybe a move to 13-a-side, (which would also allow a more level playing field for smaller clubs/counties)

mrdeeds

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Re: Defensive football
« Reply #1 on: July 20, 2020, 05:03:53 PM »
League game in Cavan yesterday division 1.

Lacken 3 16
Gowna 7 7


GetOverTheBar

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Re: Defensive football
« Reply #2 on: July 20, 2020, 05:05:05 PM »
Since most club coaches try and rip off whatever counties are doing by and large the following year. It puts some of them in a tough spot when they have to innovate themselves first.

Itchy

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Re: Defensive football
« Reply #3 on: July 20, 2020, 05:10:18 PM »
League game in Cavan yesterday division 1.

Lacken 3 16
Gowna 7 7

I am not sure if it is good that the county team goalie lets in 7 goals :o But I believe he score 1-something too. Crazy scoreline!

Eire90

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Re: Defensive football
« Reply #4 on: July 23, 2020, 02:20:36 PM »
How bout  a shot clock or 30 seconds to cross your half

thewobbler

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Re: Defensive football
« Reply #5 on: July 23, 2020, 02:32:21 PM »
This is depressing. Was talking to a ref, who has officiated at two recent games. As no spectators allowed, depending on his reports. Both were low-scoring, and both, he says, had the same old defensive tactics, 15 men behind the ball, short, uncontested kick-outs, endless hand-passing around the 45 meter line. So despite all the rule changes designed to disincentivise the defensive game the coaches haven't changed.
Time for something more dramatic? Maybe a move to 13-a-side, (which would also allow a more level playing field for smaller clubs/counties)

The problem rugby has grown into the past 15 years, is that at anything approving a higher level, unless you’re carrying 3 stone of muscle, you will be run over and exposed. It has become an almost technical-skill free game at international level; instead it’s all about mental composure ie do not make a mistake.

Anyhow, the basic point being that you cannot aspire to a future in rugby unless you’re willing and able to devote more exceptional time to your physique.

The 13 a side game you talk of would bring similar issues. More athletic players - at every level - would be rewarded with almost 15% more space to run into. The need for them to be skilful becomes less important, the need for everyone else to become fitter and (somehow) quicker becomes paramount.

So unless you’re born with proper natural athleticism, there would be no future for you in the game.

——

Award a foul from dead centre, should anyone pass the back backwards over either 45. By being able to reduce the available pitch area by 33% then 66%, it gives the defending team a reward for pushing out and forcing their opponents up the field. Currently this doesn’t exist. Step out now, and you’ll be pulled like a yo-yo around the field, until a no-risk attacking pass is available.

general_lee

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Re: Defensive football
« Reply #6 on: July 23, 2020, 05:52:11 PM »
Yes we need more rule changes. Out of curiosity when’s the last time any you lot kicked a ball?

rosnarun

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Re: Defensive football
« Reply #7 on: July 29, 2020, 05:49:59 PM »
Yes we need more rule changes. Out of curiosity when’s the last time any you lot kicked a ball?
A modern coach would never let you kick a ball
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macker15

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Re: Defensive football
« Reply #8 on: March 02, 2021, 01:12:30 PM »
Yes we need more rule changes. Out of curiosity when’s the last time any you lot kicked a ball?

Would agree with this but teams keeping 15 bodies win, lose or draw is the problem.

Angelo

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Re: Defensive football
« Reply #9 on: March 03, 2021, 01:18:45 PM »
This is depressing. Was talking to a ref, who has officiated at two recent games. As no spectators allowed, depending on his reports. Both were low-scoring, and both, he says, had the same old defensive tactics, 15 men behind the ball, short, uncontested kick-outs, endless hand-passing around the 45 meter line. So despite all the rule changes designed to disincentivise the defensive game the coaches haven't changed.
Time for something more dramatic? Maybe a move to 13-a-side, (which would also allow a more level playing field for smaller clubs/counties)

The problem rugby has grown into the past 15 years, is that at anything approving a higher level, unless you’re carrying 3 stone of muscle, you will be run over and exposed. It has become an almost technical-skill free game at international level; instead it’s all about mental composure ie do not make a mistake.

Anyhow, the basic point being that you cannot aspire to a future in rugby unless you’re willing and able to devote more exceptional time to your physique.

The 13 a side game you talk of would bring similar issues. More athletic players - at every level - would be rewarded with almost 15% more space to run into. The need for them to be skilful becomes less important, the need for everyone else to become fitter and (somehow) quicker becomes paramount.

So unless you’re born with proper natural athleticism, there would be no future for you in the game.

——

Award a foul from dead centre, should anyone pass the back backwards over either 45. By being able to reduce the available pitch area by 33% then 66%, it gives the defending team a reward for pushing out and forcing their opponents up the field. Currently this doesn’t exist. Step out now, and you’ll be pulled like a yo-yo around the field, until a no-risk attacking pass is available.

100%

I look at the game now and from a Tyrone perspective you have guys like O'Neill, Brennan, McCurry, Bradley - guys with exceptional talent and ability but are only ever going to get to a certain point in their career these days.

It's all about the physique and athleticism, the days of the slight and skillful inside forward are long gone and there's a reason why the game has gone defensive and why teams do pack players behind the ball. If you don't do that then you have farcical games than end something like 12-08 to 3-04.

The All Ireland semi final between Tipp and Mayo was a joke this year. Both teams playing kamikaze football and goal chances every few minutes. Naturally in that kind of a contest the better team is going to win comfortably.

In every sport teams should play to win and for some teams that may require them to adopt a defensive approach, if that works for them then fair play.

People who suggest 13 a side as a viable approach to improving the game are extremely dangerous to the sport and clearly haven't the first idea.
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GetOverTheBar

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Re: Defensive football
« Reply #10 on: March 03, 2021, 03:21:34 PM »
With the lockdown and ban on training, I don't think we are going to see any innovative, attacking teams come to the fore this season anyway at county level. It's just going to be easier for coaches to sell the packed defence and blame the pandemic.

Stuck for time or ideas? 5 or 6 man half back line will do.

In fairness this year, I know most fellas at the top level are tipping away but there simply is no substitute for full on collective training. It's going to be another war of attrition with similar type games. Playing defensively you expend less energy, less chance of injuries, less wear and tear. I think we should steady up and hope for a few off the cuff novel clashes really.

We can only hope Cavan keep doing what they are doing, Cork continue their upward curve and that there are a few clashes where style just goes out the window. Tyrone might try something new, but I would imagine it'll be fresh packaging on same product.

Generally I'm not against defensive football as a 'needs must'. I understand why some people look to implement such styles in games or even during the opening of their tenure, depending on circumstances but it's the jokers at club level that you see doing the rounds at the clubs, same stuff....wingbacks on the wee board narrowed in beside 6 and the wing forwards quickly following down to there the 5 and 7 moved. I'm sure you've all come across "that type". Them paid a fortune too. But the ethos of the game is and always will be, whoever scores more win the game.


Rossfan

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Re: Defensive football
« Reply #11 on: March 03, 2021, 03:29:24 PM »
Get rid of feckn handball.
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Eire90

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Re: Defensive football
« Reply #12 on: March 03, 2021, 07:05:15 PM »
its up to the attacking team to counter it

macker15

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Re: Defensive football
« Reply #13 on: March 20, 2021, 12:13:24 PM »
Get rid of feckn handball.

The hand pass along with off the  ball running  is best decoy to open blank defence .

Rossfan

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