Author Topic: Jim Gavin - The Greatest Manager in GAA history  (Read 2493 times)

Hound

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Re: Jim Gavin - The Greatest Manager in GAA history
« Reply #15 on: September 15, 2019, 07:31:00 AM »
I donít think itís a criticism of Gavin. His point just tells us that itís hard to know how good you are when you manage a team streets ahead of everyone.
I thought bringing Connolly back was poor. He wasnít near the level as far as I could see while other lads who have been there all year never got a sniff of action.
He can get away with these things where others wouldnít.

Having said that, while they keep winning, you canít fault him.
The reason Connolly was brought back was a lack of depth at half forward. Weíve loads of lads who can play in the FF line, but very little at half forward and midfield. Subs breakdown yesterday was 1 mid, 1 HF, 5 FF.

BarryBreensBandage

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Re: Jim Gavin - The Greatest Manager in GAA history
« Reply #16 on: September 15, 2019, 12:04:38 PM »
Yeah I think he is up there with the greats.

His job is like no other in gaelic management, past or present, if you take into account the money, players at his disposal, keeping near professional players happy, keeping the production line going (latest example, Murchan), and what is expected from the largest county population in the country.

Looking at the scenes after the match, there was a gra there between him and the players that would suggest great respect between the two.

For me, it is all about the manager in any team. A bit like an intellectual teacher with a class full of pupils, you could have the best manager in the country looking after a team of good players, but if the team don't get or buy in to what the manager and his team are trying to do, and both will gain nothing out of it.

I don't think anyone will ever hear the goings-on, fall-outs etc. that have happened in that Dublin team over the past few years, which were bound to have happened.
And by looking at the likes of Bernard Brogan celebrating as much as the next man tonight, it doesn't seem to affect the squad either - they have got their 5 in a row.

And that has to be down to Gavin and his management team.

I would be interested to hear the esteem that BrokenCrossbar and the Crossmaglen lads hold Joe Kernan in, because they were exactly the same in being serial winners.

Exactly the opposite more like. Cross won their AIs in the face of adversity. Gavin won his with the benefit of financial support most professional teams never see.

 Gavin might be a good manager but there's little doubt Mickey Harte or Joe Kernan could easily have equalled or even bettered his record given the chance. Not sure Gavin would have won 3 X AIs with Tyrone tho!

Alright, i will put it another way, would that particular Dublin team win five in a row with someone else managing them?
"Some people say I am indecisive..... maybe I am, maybe I'm not".

Hound

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Re: Jim Gavin - The Greatest Manager in GAA history
« Reply #17 on: September 15, 2019, 02:42:35 PM »
Yeah I think he is up there with the greats.

His job is like no other in gaelic management, past or present, if you take into account the money, players at his disposal, keeping near professional players happy, keeping the production line going (latest example, Murchan), and what is expected from the largest county population in the country.

Looking at the scenes after the match, there was a gra there between him and the players that would suggest great respect between the two.

For me, it is all about the manager in any team. A bit like an intellectual teacher with a class full of pupils, you could have the best manager in the country looking after a team of good players, but if the team don't get or buy in to what the manager and his team are trying to do, and both will gain nothing out of it.

I don't think anyone will ever hear the goings-on, fall-outs etc. that have happened in that Dublin team over the past few years, which were bound to have happened.
And by looking at the likes of Bernard Brogan celebrating as much as the next man tonight, it doesn't seem to affect the squad either - they have got their 5 in a row.

And that has to be down to Gavin and his management team.

I would be interested to hear the esteem that BrokenCrossbar and the Crossmaglen lads hold Joe Kernan in, because they were exactly the same in being serial winners.

Exactly the opposite more like. Cross won their AIs in the face of adversity. Gavin won his with the benefit of financial support most professional teams never see.

 Gavin might be a good manager but there's little doubt Mickey Harte or Joe Kernan could easily have equalled or even bettered his record given the chance. Not sure Gavin would have won 3 X AIs with Tyrone tho!

Alright, i will put it another way, would that particular Dublin team win five in a row with someone else managing them?
Or if Jim had managed Mayo for the last 7 years, how many AIs would they have won?
At least 2 Iíd say

under the bar

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Re: Jim Gavin - The Greatest Manager in GAA history
« Reply #18 on: September 15, 2019, 02:49:17 PM »
Yeah I think he is up there with the greats.

His job is like no other in gaelic management, past or present, if you take into account the money, players at his disposal, keeping near professional players happy, keeping the production line going (latest example, Murchan), and what is expected from the largest county population in the country.

Looking at the scenes after the match, there was a gra there between him and the players that would suggest great respect between the two.

For me, it is all about the manager in any team. A bit like an intellectual teacher with a class full of pupils, you could have the best manager in the country looking after a team of good players, but if the team don't get or buy in to what the manager and his team are trying to do, and both will gain nothing out of it.

I don't think anyone will ever hear the goings-on, fall-outs etc. that have happened in that Dublin team over the past few years, which were bound to have happened.
And by looking at the likes of Bernard Brogan celebrating as much as the next man tonight, it doesn't seem to affect the squad either - they have got their 5 in a row.

And that has to be down to Gavin and his management team.

I would be interested to hear the esteem that BrokenCrossbar and the Crossmaglen lads hold Joe Kernan in, because they were exactly the same in being serial winners.

Exactly the opposite more like. Cross won their AIs in the face of adversity. Gavin won his with the benefit of financial support most professional teams never see.

 Gavin might be a good manager but there's little doubt Mickey Harte or Joe Kernan could easily have equalled or even bettered his record given the chance. Not sure Gavin would have won 3 X AIs with Tyrone tho!

Alright, i will put it another way, would that particular Dublin team win five in a row with someone else managing them?

Of course

BarryBreensBandage

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Re: Jim Gavin - The Greatest Manager in GAA history
« Reply #19 on: September 15, 2019, 10:28:57 PM »
Yeah I think he is up there with the greats.

His job is like no other in gaelic management, past or present, if you take into account the money, players at his disposal, keeping near professional players happy, keeping the production line going (latest example, Murchan), and what is expected from the largest county population in the country.

Looking at the scenes after the match, there was a gra there between him and the players that would suggest great respect between the two.

For me, it is all about the manager in any team. A bit like an intellectual teacher with a class full of pupils, you could have the best manager in the country looking after a team of good players, but if the team don't get or buy in to what the manager and his team are trying to do, and both will gain nothing out of it.

I don't think anyone will ever hear the goings-on, fall-outs etc. that have happened in that Dublin team over the past few years, which were bound to have happened.
And by looking at the likes of Bernard Brogan celebrating as much as the next man tonight, it doesn't seem to affect the squad either - they have got their 5 in a row.

And that has to be down to Gavin and his management team.

I would be interested to hear the esteem that BrokenCrossbar and the Crossmaglen lads hold Joe Kernan in, because they were exactly the same in being serial winners.

Exactly the opposite more like. Cross won their AIs in the face of adversity. Gavin won his with the benefit of financial support most professional teams never see.

 Gavin might be a good manager but there's little doubt Mickey Harte or Joe Kernan could easily have equalled or even bettered his record given the chance. Not sure Gavin would have won 3 X AIs with Tyrone tho!

Alright, i will put it another way, would that particular Dublin team win five in a row with someone else managing them?

Of course

Fair Enough  ???
"Some people say I am indecisive..... maybe I am, maybe I'm not".

brokencrossbar1

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Re: Jim Gavin - The Greatest Manager in GAA history
« Reply #20 on: September 16, 2019, 09:21:12 PM »
Very difficult to compare managers. For instance although Dublin won 5 in a row there were 8 players who started at the weekend didnít start 5 years ago. They are the beat squad there has ever been but would their best 15 on Sunday beat the best 15 that Kerry had during their runs? I genuinely donít know. In terms of Gavin being the greatest manager I am not sure. He is the greatest organizer of a vast array of talent but he has a machine of people under him. The likes of Micko and Coady would be very much the dominant figures and the driving force. Gavin is more of a Ďfacilitator Ď....and excellent one but I think that the coaching structures are such that the players are the ones who really dictate things as theyíre so well coached for years that their game intelligence and decision making is at a different level than other teams. Would he achieve what he did at another county?  Perhaps but that is and unanswerable.

Barry Breenís bandages....JK was a very lucky manager at the outset as he had a bunch of winners. You know what we were like from a very young age and we were born winners. We also had a great game intelligence and that was from playing together from we were children. 12-13 of us stayed together from u10 to senior....8 of us were starters on the first AI winning team. JK saw that, blended us in with the older boys and made us believe we were the best. The big thing he did though was organize us and that is what Gavin does so well with Dublin. He is the supreme organizer and that is why they were able to reset and see what needed to be done for the replay and why they would always win it.

Rossfan

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Re: Jim Gavin - The Greatest Manager in GAA history
« Reply #21 on: September 16, 2019, 11:45:31 PM »
Don't forget his coaching staff, training staff, logistics staff..........
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Blowitupref

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Re: Jim Gavin - The Greatest Manager in GAA history
« Reply #22 on: September 17, 2019, 12:16:47 AM »
Very difficult to compare managers. For instance although Dublin won 5 in a row there were 8 players who started at the weekend didnít start 5 years ago. They are the beat squad there has ever been but would their best 15 on Sunday beat the best 15 that Kerry had during their runs? I genuinely donít know. In terms of Gavin being the greatest manager I am not sure. He is the greatest organizer of a vast array of talent but he has a machine of people under him. The likes of Micko and Coady would be very much the dominant figures and the driving force. Gavin is more of a Ďfacilitator Ď....and excellent one but I think that the coaching structures are such that the players are the ones who really dictate things as theyíre so well coached for years that their game intelligence and decision making is at a different level than other teams. Would he achieve what he did at another county?  Perhaps but that is and unanswerable.

Barry Breenís bandages....JK was a very lucky manager at the outset as he had a bunch of winners. You know what we were like from a very young age and we were born winners. We also had a great game intelligence and that was from playing together from we were children. 12-13 of us stayed together from u10 to senior....8 of us were starters on the first AI winning team. JK saw that, blended us in with the older boys and made us believe we were the best. The big thing he did though was organize us and that is what Gavin does so well with Dublin. He is the supreme organizer and that is why they were able to reset and see what needed to be done for the replay and why they would always win it.

And 6 of those 8 players (D Byrne,E Murchan,N Scully,B Howard,P Mannion,C O'Callaghan) didn't even play in the 2015 final.  Kerry in comparison i think still had 13 of 1978 starting team still starting in 1982 and the only sub they made in 82 was to bring on Pat Spillane at half time.

Saying all that Jim Gavin is certainly up there with the greatest ever managers.
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Hound

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Re: Jim Gavin - The Greatest Manager in GAA history
« Reply #23 on: September 17, 2019, 09:01:49 AM »
Anyone remember the circumstances of Micko leaving Kerry.
Did he give plenty of notice or was it sudden?
Left after a winning or losing year?

marty34

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Re: Jim Gavin - The Greatest Manager in GAA history
« Reply #24 on: September 17, 2019, 09:09:58 AM »
Without doubt, Brian Cody is the greatest GAA manager ever - no question.

Owenmoresider

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Re: Jim Gavin - The Greatest Manager in GAA history
« Reply #25 on: September 17, 2019, 09:36:18 AM »
Anyone remember the circumstances of Micko leaving Kerry.
Did he give plenty of notice or was it sudden?
Left after a winning or losing year?
Left in 89 after three successive Munster final defeats.

TheGreatest

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Re: Jim Gavin - The Greatest Manager in GAA history
« Reply #26 on: September 17, 2019, 10:56:37 AM »
I donít think itís a criticism of Gavin. His point just tells us that itís hard to know how good you are when you manage a team streets ahead of everyone.
I thought bringing Connolly back was poor. He wasnít near the level as far as I could see while other lads who have been there all year never got a sniff of action.
He can get away with these things where others wouldnít.

Having said that, while they keep winning, you canít fault him.
The reason Connolly was brought back was a lack of depth at half forward. Weíve loads of lads who can play in the FF line, but very little at half forward and midfield. Subs breakdown yesterday was 1 mid, 1 HF, 5 FF.

Not so sure that was the reason Connolly was brought back in, read Darcy Q&A in the Examiner today for insight.

Rawhide

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Re: Jim Gavin - The Greatest Manager in GAA history
« Reply #27 on: September 17, 2019, 12:32:11 PM »
I notice not one of you have considered that Gavin was the tactician that showed us all how to break down the mass blanket defence whilst winning five in a row. Identifying it, coaching it and then executing it saved the game for us all. That's in itself we should all be grateful of and puts him up in that greatest category
cccc is a true supporter lol

Hound

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Re: Jim Gavin - The Greatest Manager in GAA history
« Reply #28 on: September 17, 2019, 12:52:44 PM »
I donít think itís a criticism of Gavin. His point just tells us that itís hard to know how good you are when you manage a team streets ahead of everyone.
I thought bringing Connolly back was poor. He wasnít near the level as far as I could see while other lads who have been there all year never got a sniff of action.
He can get away with these things where others wouldnít.

Having said that, while they keep winning, you canít fault him.
The reason Connolly was brought back was a lack of depth at half forward. Weíve loads of lads who can play in the FF line, but very little at half forward and midfield. Subs breakdown yesterday was 1 mid, 1 HF, 5 FF.

Not so sure that was the reason Connolly was brought back in, read Darcy Q&A in the Examiner today for insight.
Great article

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/gaa/theyre-a-really-special-group-youd-bring-your-kids-to-watch-them-play-951128.html

dublin7

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Re: Jim Gavin - The Greatest Manager in GAA history
« Reply #29 on: September 17, 2019, 11:51:32 PM »
I notice not one of you have considered that Gavin was the tactician that showed us all how to break down the mass blanket defence whilst winning five in a row. Identifying it, coaching it and then executing it saved the game for us all. That's in itself we should all be grateful of and puts him up in that greatest category

Well said. Everyone seems to be ignoring how he has improved players over the years as well. In 2017 it was a joy to watch them finally destroy the blanket defense against Tyrone and they put on an exhibition that today. Gavin has not only coached them how to play attacking football, but encouraged players to think for themselves and the team is full of leaders now all over the pitch. Youngsters like Brian Howard showing leadership like a seasoned veteran.  Bernard Brogan looked one of the happiest players on the pitch sat night even though he didnít even make it off the bench

Compare that to the robotic approach Mickey Harte has instilled into Tyrone football were everyone has to buy into their defensive approach and the poor fans who have to watch it every year