Author Topic: Another PR disaster  (Read 6839 times)

skeog

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Re: Another PR disaster
« Reply #30 on: April 24, 2019, 06:25:27 PM »
Rosnarun go back to your cave.

Rossfan

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Re: Another PR disaster
« Reply #31 on: April 24, 2019, 06:26:53 PM »
Correct Rosnarun..
When the Rule 're County Grounds came up at Congress no one proposed an amendment that Club grounds be included.
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Dougal Maguire

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Re: Another PR disaster
« Reply #32 on: April 24, 2019, 06:38:01 PM »
The insurance issue is a red herring.
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thewobbler

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Re: Another PR disaster
« Reply #33 on: April 24, 2019, 07:10:31 PM »
The insurance issue is a red herring.

How is it a red herring?

Public Liability insurance is centrally pooled and centrally agreed. It would make no sense for the GAA to extend this central policy to include soccer matches, given that they’re prohibited on GAA grounds. As such this Donegal club have absolutely flouted the GAA’s insurance policy. That’s no different to you lending a 15 year old someone else’s car. Not your car. Someone else’s car.

I suspect you wouldn’t do that.

I also suspect that there’s many many more individual would claim from the “faceless” GAA in event of an injury, than from a neighbour, or from a charity.

The risk is real. The GAA didn’t create the claim culture of modern Ireland, but has every right to tread carefully.

Red herring my f**king arse.

Dougal Maguire

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Re: Another PR disaster
« Reply #34 on: April 24, 2019, 07:56:46 PM »
I’m saying it’s a red herring insofar as that’s not the reason the event was prohibited and you know that as well as I do.
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Baile Brigín 2

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Re: Another PR disaster
« Reply #35 on: April 24, 2019, 09:15:39 PM »
I understand all the insurance comments but that is still not the issue here.  Even if they got full insurance the soccer game could still not be played on a gaa club pitch as our outdated rules prohibit it.  Let’s be honest, the reason for the rule was not insurance concerns back then.  The GAA does many positive and good things but situations like this only give gaa haters ammunition to bash the “grab all association” as they so eloquently describe it.

Soccer is not the enemy, outdated rules and rulers are imo...
at this stage its quiet simple . a constituent member of an organization knowingly flouted the rules of the organization.
that cannot go unpunished
statements about charity and soccer etc just confuse the issue

I have no doubt the club are in now way 'confused' about the money they raised for a noble cause.

Too many in the GAA have lost sight of what we are meant to be be and have become obsessed with rules and regulations.

How many of that clubs players will still be there in 2 months?

trailer

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Re: Another PR disaster
« Reply #36 on: April 24, 2019, 10:20:40 PM »
So is the GAA that autocratic that a Club needs to seek permission to run events for its local community? What about this social capital role that the GAA plays and we see referenced in every funding application? I think this insurance business is a complete red herring. Club public liability insurance can’t be that tight surely?

If we hire our hall out to a local Irish Dancing school we take a copy of their public liability cover in advance. Same with a Pilates class.

The GAA has tightened up on these extra cirricular activities in a big way.

WRT this particular tournament. why did the organisers play it as a soccer match if this lad was a former member and GAA coach?

Surely it would have made more sense to have a gaelic football tournament or am I missing something?


+1 Was just about to post this.

If people think the rule is out of date or goes against the spirit of the GAA they should motion to have it changed. It's really that simple. The GAA is a democracy.

Any answer to this quite pertinent question?

Lar Naparka

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Re: Another PR disaster
« Reply #37 on: April 24, 2019, 11:22:11 PM »
I’m saying it’s a red herring insofar as that’s not the reason the event was prohibited and you know that as well as I do.
+1
There is no other logical reason. We are not getting the full story here.
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armaghniac

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Re: Another PR disaster
« Reply #38 on: April 24, 2019, 11:38:13 PM »
Insurance is a huge issue in Ireland. If the GAA does not behave in a straight way with insurance companies then they can charge what they like and everyone in the GAA will suffer because of these outlaws.
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thewobbler

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Re: Another PR disaster
« Reply #39 on: April 25, 2019, 12:03:12 AM »
I’d be interested to learn how the “angry populists” would like to handle these situations.

Should we really relinquish the blanket rule that GAA grounds are for Gaelic Games only? I mean what could possibly be gained from such a rule change? The GAA has continued to thrive throughout soccer’s mass explosion as a result of the EPL and Satellite TV. Mainly because it is grounded in being a community sport. Central, well-maintained facilities in every village in Ireland, run by the community for the community. That’s the GAA’s USP.

So if not that, then what it is you actually want? That any facility can be used in the name of charity? Or should we appoint a committee to oversee if charities are the “right sort of charities”, and not some scam by local soccer heads... or perhaps a fundraiser for Saoradh? Maybe we can let Twitter decide, as there’s no dinosaurs hang out over there.

And then if you get what you want. What next? Should we get rid of the #onelifeoneclub philosophy? Surely that one is from a dinosaur age too? Sure isn’t there thousands of lads have turned their back on the GAA because of it? And we can’t be doing that in 2019.

Then what next? Sure maybe we look at smaller pitches. Not only would they cost less to maintain, but they’ll be more suited to our local soccer teams too. And once we’ve gone that far, wouldn’t be great if we could experiment with some of the GAA players - let’s say 10 on each team - not being able to use their hands? That would bring us more in line with soccer, and sure it has a worldwide appeal, so can’t be doing it wrong. Then we can start paying the players too. Great.

—-

I’m a huge fan of association football by the way. But condemning the GAA as anti-community is so wrong on so many levels that it’s borderline blasphemy. It is the ultimate community organisation. And its rules and regulations are the cornerstone of how it got here.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2019, 12:07:15 AM by thewobbler »

Baile Brigín 2

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Re: Another PR disaster
« Reply #40 on: April 25, 2019, 01:47:32 AM »
I’d be interested to learn how the “angry populists” would like to handle these situations.

Should we really relinquish the blanket rule that GAA grounds are for Gaelic Games only? I mean what could possibly be gained from such a rule change? The GAA has continued to thrive throughout soccer’s mass explosion as a result of the EPL and Satellite TV. Mainly because it is grounded in being a community sport. Central, well-maintained facilities in every village in Ireland, run by the community for the community. That’s the GAA’s USP.

So if not that, then what it is you actually want? That any facility can be used in the name of charity? Or should we appoint a committee to oversee if charities are the “right sort of charities”, and not some scam by local soccer heads... or perhaps a fundraiser for Saoradh? Maybe we can let Twitter decide, as there’s no dinosaurs hang out over there.

And then if you get what you want. What next? Should we get rid of the #onelifeoneclub philosophy? Surely that one is from a dinosaur age too? Sure isn’t there thousands of lads have turned their back on the GAA because of it? And we can’t be doing that in 2019.

Then what next? Sure maybe we look at smaller pitches. Not only would they cost less to maintain, but they’ll be more suited to our local soccer teams too. And once we’ve gone that far, wouldn’t be great if we could experiment with some of the GAA players - let’s say 10 on each team - not being able to use their hands? That would bring us more in line with soccer, and sure it has a worldwide appeal, so can’t be doing it wrong. Then we can start paying the players too. Great.

—-

I’m a huge fan of association football by the way. But condemning the GAA as anti-community is so wrong on so many levels that it’s borderline blasphemy. It is the ultimate community organisation. And its rules and regulations are the cornerstone of how it got here.

Run by the community for the community is a great line, but they got punished for doing exactly that, being part of the community and running a charitable event for a Gael.

The rules relating to banning foreign games were put in place to ensure the GAA embedded as those sports had generations on them. Its now 2019 and many clubs need the revenue that renting the astro would bring. An astro they funded and maintain. It would also be nice for clubs to decide what community events they can support without jobsworths spiking them for 2 months.

sligoman2

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Re: Another PR disaster
« Reply #41 on: April 25, 2019, 01:59:34 AM »
the “right sort of charities”?

Surely the right sort of charity is helping out a former player and official in his hour of need.  This is what the club has done and this was the right thing to do.

You can continue with the scare tactics, but at some point common sense has to prevail, this is not the 1960's.  Clubs need to be given some leeway on what they can and can't do.  This kind of press shines a poor light on the GAA and as I said before, there are many people out there who are taking delight in all the bad press this is getting.

Again, I agree that any event should have insurance, but that is not the crux of this as we all know.
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6th sam

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Re: Another PR disaster
« Reply #42 on: April 25, 2019, 02:51:09 AM »
I’d be interested to learn how the “angry populists” would like to handle these situations.

Should we really relinquish the blanket rule that GAA grounds are for Gaelic Games only? I mean what could possibly be gained from such a rule change? The GAA has continued to thrive throughout soccer’s mass explosion as a result of the EPL and Satellite TV. Mainly because it is grounded in being a community sport. Central, well-maintained facilities in every village in Ireland, run by the community for the community. That’s the GAA’s USP.

So if not that, then what it is you actually want? That any facility can be used in the name of charity? Or should we appoint a committee to oversee if charities are the “right sort of charities”, and not some scam by local soccer heads... or perhaps a fundraiser for Saoradh? Maybe we can let Twitter decide, as there’s no dinosaurs hang out over there.

And then if you get what you want. What next? Should we get rid of the #onelifeoneclub philosophy? Surely that one is from a dinosaur age too? Sure isn’t there thousands of lads have turned their back on the GAA because of it? And we can’t be doing that in 2019.

Then what next? Sure maybe we look at smaller pitches. Not only would they cost less to maintain, but they’ll be more suited to our local soccer teams too. And once we’ve gone that far, wouldn’t be great if we could experiment with some of the GAA players - let’s say 10 on each team - not being able to use their hands? That would bring us more in line with soccer, and sure it has a worldwide appeal, so can’t be doing it wrong. Then we can start paying the players too. Great.

—-

I’m a huge fan of association football by the way. But condemning the GAA as anti-community is so wrong on so many levels that it’s borderline blasphemy. It is the ultimate community organisation. And its rules and regulations are the cornerstone of how it got here.

Run by the community for the community is a great line, but they got punished for doing exactly that, being part of the community and running a charitable event for a Gael.

The rules relating to banning foreign games were put in place to ensure the GAA embedded as those sports had generations on them. Its now 2019 and many clubs need the revenue that renting the astro would bring. An astro they funded and maintain. It would also be nice for clubs to decide what community events they can support without jobsworths spiking them for 2 months.
Regardless of the ins and outs of this case, ultimately my empathy is with the those in greatest need in this case.
It seems to me that the club and the county board should have handled this case more sensitively , given circumstances so traumatic , few of us can comprehend. A sensible approach could probably have got this one “over the line”. I only hope that the controversy whilst having a negative PR for the GAA will serve to highlight and bolster the cause for this Man and his family.
That said, there are clear cut rules and a clear process to change them. But There is also a clear hypocrisy in the corporate GAA’s restricting any relaxation of the rules for Croke Park and county boards, but not clubs.
Though the insurance arguments are valid, they are not insurmountable.
However Wobbler is right imho regarding the GAA having a responsibility to protect the best community organisation in the world . Soccer is a direct rival for our players and whilst cooperation between the sports is mostly for the benefit of both sports, there are valid reasons why GAA must be guarded about diluting principles which have served it well.
The controversy and bad PR surrounding this will delight those with an unhealthy resentment, poor understanding and lack of respect for the GAA.
We are a sporting organisation like no other, and our ethos and several of our regulations are the reason why we punch well above our weight.
It disappoints me that this is another controversy which could have been avoided with good sense and goodwill from all parties.


Baile Brigín 2

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Re: Another PR disaster
« Reply #43 on: April 25, 2019, 03:19:58 AM »
I’d be interested to learn how the “angry populists” would like to handle these situations.

Should we really relinquish the blanket rule that GAA grounds are for Gaelic Games only? I mean what could possibly be gained from such a rule change? The GAA has continued to thrive throughout soccer’s mass explosion as a result of the EPL and Satellite TV. Mainly because it is grounded in being a community sport. Central, well-maintained facilities in every village in Ireland, run by the community for the community. That’s the GAA’s USP.

So if not that, then what it is you actually want? That any facility can be used in the name of charity? Or should we appoint a committee to oversee if charities are the “right sort of charities”, and not some scam by local soccer heads... or perhaps a fundraiser for Saoradh? Maybe we can let Twitter decide, as there’s no dinosaurs hang out over there.

And then if you get what you want. What next? Should we get rid of the #onelifeoneclub philosophy? Surely that one is from a dinosaur age too? Sure isn’t there thousands of lads have turned their back on the GAA because of it? And we can’t be doing that in 2019.

Then what next? Sure maybe we look at smaller pitches. Not only would they cost less to maintain, but they’ll be more suited to our local soccer teams too. And once we’ve gone that far, wouldn’t be great if we could experiment with some of the GAA players - let’s say 10 on each team - not being able to use their hands? That would bring us more in line with soccer, and sure it has a worldwide appeal, so can’t be doing it wrong. Then we can start paying the players too. Great.

—-

I’m a huge fan of association football by the way. But condemning the GAA as anti-community is so wrong on so many levels that it’s borderline blasphemy. It is the ultimate community organisation. And its rules and regulations are the cornerstone of how it got here.

Run by the community for the community is a great line, but they got punished for doing exactly that, being part of the community and running a charitable event for a Gael.

The rules relating to banning foreign games were put in place to ensure the GAA embedded as those sports had generations on them. Its now 2019 and many clubs need the revenue that renting the astro would bring. An astro they funded and maintain. It would also be nice for clubs to decide what community events they can support without jobsworths spiking them for 2 months.
Regardless of the ins and outs of this case, ultimately my empathy is with the those in greatest need in this case.
It seems to me that the club and the county board should have handled this case more sensitively , given circumstances so traumatic , few of us can comprehend. A sensible approach could probably have got this one “over the line”. I only hope that the controversy whilst having a negative PR for the GAA will serve to highlight and bolster the cause for this Man and his family.
That said, there are clear cut rules and a clear process to change them. But There is also a clear hypocrisy in the corporate GAA’s restricting any relaxation of the rules for Croke Park and county boards, but not clubs.
Though the insurance arguments are valid, they are not insurmountable.
However Wobbler is right imho regarding the GAA having a responsibility to protect the best community organisation in the world . Soccer is a direct rival for our players and whilst cooperation between the sports is mostly for the benefit of both sports, there are valid reasons why GAA must be guarded about diluting principles which have served it well.
The controversy and bad PR surrounding this will delight those with an unhealthy resentment, poor understanding and lack of respect for the GAA.
We are a sporting organisation like no other, and our ethos and several of our regulations are the reason why we punch well above our weight.
It disappoints me that this is another controversy which could have been avoided with good sense and goodwill from all parties.

You appear to be suffering from a severe case of 'splinterinthearseitis' from all that fence sitting.

Well done on stopping soccer in its tracks by hammering a club for helping a GAA man out  There is a club full of fellas with two months of arse scratching ahead. Wonder where they might go?

Those principles made sense at the time they were brought in. They are a clear handicap to the clubs now. If this was held in a county ground, there would be no issue. Its another slap in the face to a club game that has no support.

trailer

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Re: Another PR disaster
« Reply #44 on: April 25, 2019, 06:48:49 AM »
I’d be interested to learn how the “angry populists” would like to handle these situations.

Should we really relinquish the blanket rule that GAA grounds are for Gaelic Games only? I mean what could possibly be gained from such a rule change? The GAA has continued to thrive throughout soccer’s mass explosion as a result of the EPL and Satellite TV. Mainly because it is grounded in being a community sport. Central, well-maintained facilities in every village in Ireland, run by the community for the community. That’s the GAA’s USP.

So if not that, then what it is you actually want? That any facility can be used in the name of charity? Or should we appoint a committee to oversee if charities are the “right sort of charities”, and not some scam by local soccer heads... or perhaps a fundraiser for Saoradh? Maybe we can let Twitter decide, as there’s no dinosaurs hang out over there.

And then if you get what you want. What next? Should we get rid of the #onelifeoneclub philosophy? Surely that one is from a dinosaur age too? Sure isn’t there thousands of lads have turned their back on the GAA because of it? And we can’t be doing that in 2019.

Then what next? Sure maybe we look at smaller pitches. Not only would they cost less to maintain, but they’ll be more suited to our local soccer teams too. And once we’ve gone that far, wouldn’t be great if we could experiment with some of the GAA players - let’s say 10 on each team - not being able to use their hands? That would bring us more in line with soccer, and sure it has a worldwide appeal, so can’t be doing it wrong. Then we can start paying the players too. Great.

—-

I’m a huge fan of association football by the way. But condemning the GAA as anti-community is so wrong on so many levels that it’s borderline blasphemy. It is the ultimate community organisation. And its rules and regulations are the cornerstone of how it got here.

Run by the community for the community is a great line, but they got punished for doing exactly that, being part of the community and running a charitable event for a Gael.

The rules relating to banning foreign games were put in place to ensure the GAA embedded as those sports had generations on them. Its now 2019 and many clubs need the revenue that renting the astro would bring. An astro they funded and maintain. It would also be nice for clubs to decide what community events they can support without jobsworths spiking them for 2 months.
Regardless of the ins and outs of this case, ultimately my empathy is with the those in greatest need in this case.
It seems to me that the club and the county board should have handled this case more sensitively , given circumstances so traumatic , few of us can comprehend. A sensible approach could probably have got this one “over the line”. I only hope that the controversy whilst having a negative PR for the GAA will serve to highlight and bolster the cause for this Man and his family.
That said, there are clear cut rules and a clear process to change them. But There is also a clear hypocrisy in the corporate GAA’s restricting any relaxation of the rules for Croke Park and county boards, but not clubs.
Though the insurance arguments are valid, they are not insurmountable.
However Wobbler is right imho regarding the GAA having a responsibility to protect the best community organisation in the world . Soccer is a direct rival for our players and whilst cooperation between the sports is mostly for the benefit of both sports, there are valid reasons why GAA must be guarded about diluting principles which have served it well.
The controversy and bad PR surrounding this will delight those with an unhealthy resentment, poor understanding and lack of respect for the GAA.
We are a sporting organisation like no other, and our ethos and several of our regulations are the reason why we punch well above our weight.
It disappoints me that this is another controversy which could have been avoided with good sense and goodwill from all parties.

You appear to be suffering from a severe case of 'splinterinthearseitis' from all that fence sitting.

Well done on stopping soccer in its tracks by hammering a club for helping a GAA man out  There is a club full of fellas with two months of arse scratching ahead. Wonder where they might go?

Those principles made sense at the time they were brought in. They are a clear handicap to the clubs now. If this was held in a county ground, there would be no issue. Its another slap in the face to a club game that has no support.

Don’t like the rule? Then change it. If you’re a member of a GAA club you can do it. Masquerading as a GAA member won’t work though. You actually have to be a paid up member of a club. Feel free to update us.