Author Topic: Row in Mayo LGFA  (Read 35223 times)

hardstation

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Re: Row in Mayo LGFA
« Reply #75 on: August 23, 2018, 02:53:27 PM »
It’s not. Leaving a panel at any time is the player’s own free choice. Welfare is an entirely subjective point which can’t be proven or disproven. “Being on this panel is having a negative effect on me therefore for my own welfare, I am leaving.”

This is seems to be a failing between what you think should happen and what the rules that the players and the club were playing under. Any organisation can set its own rules as long as they are not illegal. These ones seem incredibly broad and cover a lot of eventualities. There’s much less to see here with the ruling than you think.
So which rule has been breached that carries the punishment of banning the club from the championship?


Jinxy

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Re: Row in Mayo LGFA
« Reply #76 on: August 23, 2018, 03:01:59 PM »
That’s silly. The players from that club then just turn up and don’t try an inch until they are dropped.
That’s a crazy rule.

The only reason I know of this was because of an situation I experienced while playing with Antrim.

I picked up a serious injury (which finished my inter-county involvement), and as a result, I missed a NFL regulation playoff match against Fermanagh. My club had a league game that evening and sent a clubman down to take me to the club game (to be part of the management team)

After the Fermanagh game was over, the county chairman, sec, and county manager cornered me in the changing room at cited rules that would get the club sanctioned, and me suspended because, the county would see it as a refusal to play for the county so I could play a club game.

That is absolutely nuts.
If you were any use you'd be playing.

Jinxy

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Re: Row in Mayo LGFA
« Reply #77 on: August 23, 2018, 03:55:58 PM »
This what Sarah Rowe said after the Cavan game.

'For all of us playing we are very very happy with the management. Very supportive, approachable, tough, tough, tough on us, of course, but that’s their job,” said Rowe.

Their job is to coach, they always give constructive criticism to us all, and it has only made us stronger and better players. I’m fully behind management, I think they’re a brilliant set-up. Unbelievable.

I talked to the girls, of course, because they’re my friends. Obviously, we’d love to have it sorted and for it not to have to come to this. I suppose there was a few texts here and there and that was really it.'


https://www.the42.ie/sarah-rowe-mayo-ladies-4130407-Jul2018/
If you were any use you'd be playing.

Franko

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Re: Row in Mayo LGFA
« Reply #78 on: August 23, 2018, 05:21:37 PM »
I’m sorry but none of that constitutes bringing the association into disrepute for me.
Players left the panel and had their own reasons for doing so. Their reasons are none of anybody’s business really. The bottom line is that they didn’t want to play for a team anymore. For me, they shouldn’t be obliged to stay.
Association into disrepute is bollix. Catch a grip.

Firstly, I agree with your sentiment.  They can't enforce a rule which obliges anyone to play for any team.  That's a totally untenable position.

But I do think there's merit in this disrepute thing. 

Ref the bit in bold... If they had said that in their statement, I don't think there would, or could be any issue.

But they didn't.  They said that it was due to player welfare issues, then (AFAIK) have not outlined what any of these issues are.  Now, if they've got evidence of these welfare issues, please present it.  The burden of proof lies with the accuser.  If not, they are spreading malicious information about how the Mayo ladies board and management are treating their players... which most certainly could be defined as bringing the games into disrepute.

How they can then sanction a club for this is another story altogether.  Unless the club issued the statement regarding these welfare issues.

From the Bunker

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Re: Row in Mayo LGFA
« Reply #79 on: August 23, 2018, 05:45:22 PM »
Yes, this is not a case of players not wanting to play. This was a case of players not playing over an issue.

thebackbar1

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Re: Row in Mayo LGFA
« Reply #80 on: August 23, 2018, 06:07:31 PM »
absolutely sickening whats happening here, again ill point out that a good number of the players are under 18 ! between mayo and carnacon.

Syferus

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Re: Row in Mayo LGFA
« Reply #81 on: August 23, 2018, 06:58:28 PM »
absolutely sickening whats happening here, again ill point out that a good number of the players are under 18 ! between mayo and carnacon.

Won’t someone think of the children??

Halfquarter

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Re: Row in Mayo LGFA
« Reply #82 on: August 23, 2018, 07:51:15 PM »
Bringing the game into disrepute by saying nothing, nuts !

RadioGAAGAA

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Re: Row in Mayo LGFA
« Reply #83 on: August 23, 2018, 08:48:55 PM »
I’m sorry but none of that constitutes bringing the association into disrepute for me.
Players left the panel and had their own reasons for doing so. Their reasons are none of anybody’s business really. The bottom line is that they didn’t want to play for a team anymore. For me, they shouldn’t be obliged to stay.
Association into disrepute is bollix. Catch a grip.

Firstly, I agree with your sentiment.  They can't enforce a rule which obliges anyone to play for any team.  That's a totally untenable position.

But I do think there's merit in this disrepute thing. 

Ref the bit in bold... If they had said that in their statement, I don't think there would, or could be any issue.

But they didn't.  They said that it was due to player welfare issues, then (AFAIK) have not outlined what any of these issues are.  Now, if they've got evidence of these welfare issues, please present it.  The burden of proof lies with the accuser.  If not, they are spreading malicious information about how the Mayo ladies board and management are treating their players... which most certainly could be defined as bringing the games into disrepute.

How they can then sanction a club for this is another story altogether.  Unless the club issued the statement regarding these welfare issues.


Even worse, the exact terms they used were:

Quote
The group who left the panel have cited ‘player welfare issues that are personal and sensitive to the players involved’ in a statement released through the Women’s Gaelic Players Association (WGPA) on Tuesday.

Player welfare, personal & sensitive.

That could be misconstrued into very dodgy territory. It doesn't take much in the way of imagination to think what the worst case scenario of that could be!

The LGFA really, really did need to come down on them like a ton of bricks. You simply cannot go and throw inferences at serious accusations into the air for folks to draw very bad (and incorrect) conclusions from.
i usse an speelchekor

Jinxy

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Re: Row in Mayo LGFA
« Reply #84 on: August 23, 2018, 08:49:59 PM »
The one thing I would say is this.
Players are volunteers and they are free to play or not play as they see fit.
To punish them for this is clearly absurd.
At the same time, it is no small thing for a number of players to say they are leaving the panel because of 'player welfare' issues.
Like it or not, that's pointing the finger of blame at management and leaving them open to all sorts of unfair speculation & accusations.
Going by Sarah Rowe's statement, the management team have the full support of the majority of the players.
The punishment is ridiculous but it seems there is a good bit of blame to go around here.
If you were any use you'd be playing.

From the Bunker

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Re: Row in Mayo LGFA
« Reply #85 on: August 23, 2018, 09:14:36 PM »
A lot of people making judgement here without the full facts, or without any facts. There is a history of trouble with the Mayo ladies team.
In 2010 nobody would manage the senior team for the Championship, nobody! You'd think there would have been one or two souls in the county that'd love to take up the opportunity. But there was no one.

Halfway through the 2010 season, Mayo ladies manager Pat Costello resigned, stating that his position was no longer tenable due to [being] constantly undermined by certain players within the panel.

So Mayo played no games in the Province that year. They were thrown straight into the back door route and Fr Michael Murphy came in as a short term solution. I have a feeling the same personnel who are the mainly involved in this are the same culprits this time. There is a click of players on the Mayo panel who have ruled the roost for a long time. It would take a tough manager to take them on, and maybe this was the tough manager.

http://www.mayonews.ie/sports/10342-new-mayo-ladies-football-manager-interviewed


Syferus

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Re: Row in Mayo LGFA
« Reply #86 on: August 23, 2018, 09:24:05 PM »
A lot of people making judgement here without the full facts, or without any facts. There is a history of trouble with the Mayo ladies team.
In 2010 nobody would manage the senior team for the Championship, nobody! You'd think there would have been one or two souls in the county that'd love to take up the opportunity. But there was no one.

Halfway through the 2010 season, Mayo ladies manager Pat Costello resigned, stating that his position was no longer tenable due to [being] constantly undermined by certain players within the panel.

So Mayo played no games in the Province that year. They were thrown straight into the back door route and Fr Michael Murphy came in as a short term solution. I have a feeling the same personnel who are the mainly involved in this are the same culprits this time. There is a click of players on the Mayo panel who have ruled the roost for a long time. It would take a tough manager to take them on, and maybe this was the tough manager.

http://www.mayonews.ie/sports/10342-new-mayo-ladies-football-manager-interviewed

I think Cora is an incredible player and athlete but I don’t think she appreciates how poorly this debacle reflects on her and her legacy.

If she just said “you know what, fine, I’ll be an impact sub for the rest of the year if needs be and I’ll retire at the end of the year” she’d get praised for her commitment to the team and be able to bask in the glow of deserved eulogies from the media and supporters alike. Instead it very much looks like she instigated a heave and took her mates with her because she was going to be dropped from the starting team, unless something very different leaks out in the meantime.

That’s a sad end to best ladies footballer of all time.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2018, 09:27:07 PM by Syferus »

tippabu

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Re: Row in Mayo LGFA
« Reply #87 on: August 23, 2018, 09:45:14 PM »
A lot of people making judgement here without the full facts, or without any facts. There is a history of trouble with the Mayo ladies team.
In 2010 nobody would manage the senior team for the Championship, nobody! You'd think there would have been one or two souls in the county that'd love to take up the opportunity. But there was no one.

Halfway through the 2010 season, Mayo ladies manager Pat Costello resigned, stating that his position was no longer tenable due to [being] constantly undermined by certain players within the panel.

So Mayo played no games in the Province that year. They were thrown straight into the back door route and Fr Michael Murphy came in as a short term solution. I have a feeling the same personnel who are the mainly involved in this are the same culprits this time. There is a click of players on the Mayo panel who have ruled the roost for a long time. It would take a tough manager to take them on, and maybe this was the tough manager.

http://www.mayonews.ie/sports/10342-new-mayo-ladies-football-manager-interviewed

I think Cora is an incredible player and athlete but I don’t think she appreciates how poorly this debacle reflects on her and her legacy.

If she just said “you know what, fine, I’ll be an impact sub for the rest of the year if needs be and I’ll retire at the end of the year” she’d get praised for her commitment to the team and be able to bask in the glow of deserved eulogies from the media and supporters alike. Instead it very much looks like she instigated a heave and took her mates with her because she was going to be dropped from the starting team, unless something very different leaks out in the meantime.

That’s a sad end to best ladies footballer of all time.

Surely theres more to it than just cora not being selected / phased out however you want to say it, why would there be a big non confidential agreement over something as small as that. Id certainly feel alot different about the situation if it is the case as you say the players pulling out over this, it would reflect terribly on them in my opinion

nrico2006

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Re: Row in Mayo LGFA
« Reply #88 on: August 23, 2018, 10:38:17 PM »
How many non Carnacon players left?
Why are these clubs getting off?
Who issued the statement?
Have they any evidence that Carnacon influenced their players? The girls could simply have made the decision together without any club involvement.
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From the Bunker

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Re: Row in Mayo LGFA
« Reply #89 on: August 23, 2018, 11:09:11 PM »
How many non Carnacon players left?
Why are these clubs getting off?
Who issued the statement?
Have they any evidence that Carnacon influenced their players? The girls could simply have made the decision together without any club involvement.

8 of the 12 were from Carnacon.

From the Mayo News

''When asked why the sanction was unique to Carnacon and their players, and not to other players from other clubs who left, Mr McDonnell said their withdrawal was somewhat different.
“Other players left of an individual nature for personal reasons. Carnacon withdrew their players – they contacted the county manager and withdrew their services. That is what it was seen by the meeting as having brought the game into disrepute. It was the action of the club rather than its players,” he said.
While there is a rule in the Ladies Gaelic Official Guide that allows county boards to impose a six month ban for any player who refuses to play for their county team, Mr McDonnell said this did not apply as ‘personal reasons’ were cited by the non-Carnacon players.''


http://www.mayonews.ie/sports/32536-carnacon-to-appeal-being-thrown-out-of-mayo-championship