Author Topic: Catholics voting DUP  (Read 7238 times)

BennyCake

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Re: Catholics voting DUP
« Reply #45 on: June 08, 2018, 04:43:30 PM »
Every time I hear 'British Isles' mentioned, I correct it with 'British & Irish Isles'. It's a lazy description. Does Tory Island belong to Britain? Aran Islands? No and no. So, enough of your British Isles crap.

J70

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Re: Catholics voting DUP
« Reply #46 on: June 08, 2018, 04:44:21 PM »
Nothing said about the DUP voters who might not agree with the party on this issue and sent a wee letter to Ian Paisley Jnr or Arlene Foster to say they are going to vote Sinn Fein or the SDLP now? It's not always one-way traffic, as I know a former Unionist voter who decided to change his views on constitutional issues and vote Sinn Fein now.

"In the BBC survey, 29% of those with a Protestant background defined themselves as Irish, but only 4% of those with a Catholic background identified as British."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-44398502

Identity crisis 101 = asking someone born and brought up anywhere on the island of Ireland how British they feel. Makes about as much sense as asking the same cohort how French do they feel. Britain is the union between England Scotland and Wales, no-one born on the island of Ireland is British. Some may consider themselves UK-ish, and more power to them (metaphorically).

The fact the BBC are putting this out there... Tories chipping away at the "identity" of the statelet? Wouldn't put it past them, they have no affinity for the UK-ish aside from when it is politically pragmatic.

Seriously?

Youíre hanging your hat on an irrelevant labeling technicality? UK ethnicity, NOT British, that should grab a bit of attention and be taken seriously all right!

Ireland is part of the British Isles BTW in the sciences and geography. ;)

How is it irrelevant that the people obsessed with being seen as more British than the British aren't actually British. Stockholm syndrome 101. Add to that their forefathers/representatives oversaw a programme of state sponsored sectarian oppression against the native population in order to progress a land-grab/pogrom.

There's no need to hang a hat anywhere and don't be put off by technicalities, lets just agree I'm right on this, unless you can show me otherwise. Congratulations to science and geography, same group of cowboys responsible for naming the Irish Sea?

Put it like this, the British see the UK-ish as Irish and would be shot of the whole lot of them and the gerrymandered statelet in the morning if they could, the UK-ish and Irish are shit on the shoe of the British ruling class, to think otherwise is to underestimate their absolute lack of conscience. They are well on their way to dumping the UK-ish through nefarious political means.

But sure lookit, we'll co-opt them into a new state for all and get on with it.

So you ARE actually serious with this ďargumentĒ!

Itís irrelevant in that your ridiculous, if inconsequential, nit pick doesnít mean a thing in the real world. We all know what is meant by their classing themselves as British. If you want to debate that itís an invalid label, knock yourself out, but I seriously doubt many people give a bollocks.

Put it this way, what would classifying themselves as UK- ish change?

Itís certainly not going to change their ethnic identity or national affiliation.

Keyser soze

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Re: Catholics voting DUP
« Reply #47 on: June 08, 2018, 04:47:27 PM »
Britain is comprised of England and Wales., Great Britain is England, Wales and Scotland.

J70

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Re: Catholics voting DUP
« Reply #48 on: June 08, 2018, 04:48:11 PM »
Every time I hear 'British Isles' mentioned, I correct it with 'British & Irish Isles'. It's a lazy description. Does Tory Island belong to Britain? Aran Islands? No and no. So, enough of your British Isles crap.

Itís not MY crap.

Iím simply stating a fact.

Although I am guilty of not really giving a shit if the discussion was about the biogeography of the British Isles or the geological evolution of the British Isles.

Itís not a political forum.

J70

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Re: Catholics voting DUP
« Reply #49 on: June 08, 2018, 04:55:35 PM »
I would add to the previous that Irish natural science issues are generally dealt with on a whole island basis and I donít recall ever hearing complaints from those of a unionist persuasion. Political boundaries are irrelevant in that context.

BennyCake

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Re: Catholics voting DUP
« Reply #50 on: June 08, 2018, 05:22:24 PM »
Every time I hear 'British Isles' mentioned, I correct it with 'British & Irish Isles'. It's a lazy description. Does Tory Island belong to Britain? Aran Islands? No and no. So, enough of your British Isles crap.

Itís not MY crap.

Iím simply stating a fact.

Although I am guilty of not really giving a shit if the discussion was about the biogeography of the British Isles or the geological evolution of the British Isles.

Itís not a political forum.

I was getting at Britain rather than you ;)
« Last Edit: June 08, 2018, 05:24:01 PM by BennyCake »

tiempo

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Re: Catholics voting DUP
« Reply #51 on: June 08, 2018, 07:42:15 PM »
Nothing said about the DUP voters who might not agree with the party on this issue and sent a wee letter to Ian Paisley Jnr or Arlene Foster to say they are going to vote Sinn Fein or the SDLP now? It's not always one-way traffic, as I know a former Unionist voter who decided to change his views on constitutional issues and vote Sinn Fein now.

"In the BBC survey, 29% of those with a Protestant background defined themselves as Irish, but only 4% of those with a Catholic background identified as British."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-44398502

Identity crisis 101 = asking someone born and brought up anywhere on the island of Ireland how British they feel. Makes about as much sense as asking the same cohort how French do they feel. Britain is the union between England Scotland and Wales, no-one born on the island of Ireland is British. Some may consider themselves UK-ish, and more power to them (metaphorically).

The fact the BBC are putting this out there... Tories chipping away at the "identity" of the statelet? Wouldn't put it past them, they have no affinity for the UK-ish aside from when it is politically pragmatic.

Seriously?

Youíre hanging your hat on an irrelevant labeling technicality? UK ethnicity, NOT British, that should grab a bit of attention and be taken seriously all right!

Ireland is part of the British Isles BTW in the sciences and geography. ;)

How is it irrelevant that the people obsessed with being seen as more British than the British aren't actually British. Stockholm syndrome 101. Add to that their forefathers/representatives oversaw a programme of state sponsored sectarian oppression against the native population in order to progress a land-grab/pogrom.

There's no need to hang a hat anywhere and don't be put off by technicalities, lets just agree I'm right on this, unless you can show me otherwise. Congratulations to science and geography, same group of cowboys responsible for naming the Irish Sea?

Put it like this, the British see the UK-ish as Irish and would be shot of the whole lot of them and the gerrymandered statelet in the morning if they could, the UK-ish and Irish are shit on the shoe of the British ruling class, to think otherwise is to underestimate their absolute lack of conscience. They are well on their way to dumping the UK-ish through nefarious political means.

But sure lookit, we'll co-opt them into a new state for all and get on with it.

So you ARE actually serious with this ďargumentĒ!

Itís irrelevant in that your ridiculous, if inconsequential, nit pick doesnít mean a thing in the real world. We all know what is meant by their classing themselves as British. If you want to debate that itís an invalid label, knock yourself out, but I seriously doubt many people give a bollocks.

Put it this way, what would classifying themselves as UK- ish change?

Itís certainly not going to change their ethnic identity or national affiliation.

I'm not in a position of needing to aruge, no-one born on the island of Ireland is British, fact, and i know you understand that. Better still when partition is ended Britain will still exist but the UK won't.

Just look at the lobbying by northern Unionist politicians to have the olympic team name changed from Team GB to Team UK, they know full well the narrow confines of technicalities in which they exist. And was the team name changed? Of course not because no-one in the British ruling class cares about the gerrymandered statelet.

dec

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Re: Catholics voting DUP
« Reply #52 on: June 08, 2018, 08:15:05 PM »
CONSTITUTIONAL ISSUES
1. The participants endorse the commitment made by the British and Irish
Governments that, in a new British-Irish Agreement replacing the Anglo-
Irish Agreement, they will: 

...

(vi) recognise the birthright of all the people of Northern Ireland to
identify themselves and be accepted as Irish or British, or both, as they
may so choose, and accordingly confirm that their right to hold both
British and Irish citizenship is accepted by both Governments and would
not be affected by any future change in the status of Northern Ireland. 

J70

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Re: Catholics voting DUP
« Reply #53 on: June 09, 2018, 02:02:17 AM »
Nothing said about the DUP voters who might not agree with the party on this issue and sent a wee letter to Ian Paisley Jnr or Arlene Foster to say they are going to vote Sinn Fein or the SDLP now? It's not always one-way traffic, as I know a former Unionist voter who decided to change his views on constitutional issues and vote Sinn Fein now.

"In the BBC survey, 29% of those with a Protestant background defined themselves as Irish, but only 4% of those with a Catholic background identified as British."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-44398502

Identity crisis 101 = asking someone born and brought up anywhere on the island of Ireland how British they feel. Makes about as much sense as asking the same cohort how French do they feel. Britain is the union between England Scotland and Wales, no-one born on the island of Ireland is British. Some may consider themselves UK-ish, and more power to them (metaphorically).

The fact the BBC are putting this out there... Tories chipping away at the "identity" of the statelet? Wouldn't put it past them, they have no affinity for the UK-ish aside from when it is politically pragmatic.

Seriously?

Youíre hanging your hat on an irrelevant labeling technicality? UK ethnicity, NOT British, that should grab a bit of attention and be taken seriously all right!

Ireland is part of the British Isles BTW in the sciences and geography. ;)

How is it irrelevant that the people obsessed with being seen as more British than the British aren't actually British. Stockholm syndrome 101. Add to that their forefathers/representatives oversaw a programme of state sponsored sectarian oppression against the native population in order to progress a land-grab/pogrom.

There's no need to hang a hat anywhere and don't be put off by technicalities, lets just agree I'm right on this, unless you can show me otherwise. Congratulations to science and geography, same group of cowboys responsible for naming the Irish Sea?

Put it like this, the British see the UK-ish as Irish and would be shot of the whole lot of them and the gerrymandered statelet in the morning if they could, the UK-ish and Irish are shit on the shoe of the British ruling class, to think otherwise is to underestimate their absolute lack of conscience. They are well on their way to dumping the UK-ish through nefarious political means.

But sure lookit, we'll co-opt them into a new state for all and get on with it.

So you ARE actually serious with this ďargumentĒ!

Itís irrelevant in that your ridiculous, if inconsequential, nit pick doesnít mean a thing in the real world. We all know what is meant by their classing themselves as British. If you want to debate that itís an invalid label, knock yourself out, but I seriously doubt many people give a bollocks.

Put it this way, what would classifying themselves as UK- ish change?

Itís certainly not going to change their ethnic identity or national affiliation.

I'm not in a position of needing to aruge, no-one born on the island of Ireland is British, fact, and i know you understand that. Better still when partition is ended Britain will still exist but the UK won't.

Just look at the lobbying by northern Unionist politicians to have the olympic team name changed from Team GB to Team UK, they know full well the narrow confines of technicalities in which they exist. And was the team name changed? Of course not because no-one in the British ruling class cares about the gerrymandered statelet.

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/british

https://www.gov.uk/types-of-british-nationality

But I ask again, what difference does it make, in the real world, outside of whatever semantic hold this apparently has on you, whether or not a unionist goes by the label British or UKish?
« Last Edit: June 09, 2018, 02:15:20 AM by J70 »

Rossfan

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Re: Catholics voting DUP
« Reply #54 on: June 09, 2018, 12:53:36 PM »
I'd say Tiempo will have an unmercifully fit if he lives to see the tyoe of All Ireland State we'll end up with😁😂
2018- 2 Cupeens won, 2 to go.

pbat

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Re: Catholics voting DUP
« Reply #55 on: August 17, 2018, 07:17:49 PM »
The DUP's reaching out in July hasn't lasted. Arlene on holiday next week and no one else heading down to me the pope. Every other party and church can get someone to attend.

They will all be sitting watching when Paisley met the pope instead.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JlbmIMbKZa4

GJL

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Re: Catholics voting DUP
« Reply #56 on: August 17, 2018, 08:40:22 PM »
The DUP's reaching out in July hasn't lasted. Arlene on holiday next week and no one else heading down to me the pope. Every other party and church can get someone to attend.

They will all be sitting watching when Paisley met the pope instead.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JlbmIMbKZa4

All about keeping the votes.

armaghniac

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Re: Catholics voting DUP
« Reply #57 on: August 17, 2018, 11:10:48 PM »
The DUP's reaching out in July hasn't lasted. Arlene on holiday next week and no one else heading down to me the pope. Every other party and church can get someone to attend.

They will all be sitting watching when Paisley met the pope instead.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JlbmIMbKZa4

All about keeping the votes.

This kind of carry on would  lose as many votes as it would  keep.
if at first you don't succeed, then goto Plan B

Itchy

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Re: Catholics voting DUP
« Reply #58 on: August 17, 2018, 11:18:04 PM »
Any one going to the see the pope wants a kick in the hole and should take a serious look at themselves based on latest revelations and stop looking to be offended by DUP Neanderthals

Applesisapples

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Re: Catholics voting DUP
« Reply #59 on: August 18, 2018, 08:59:58 AM »
Any one going to the see the pope wants a kick in the hole and should take a serious look at themselves based on latest revelations and stop looking to be offended by DUP Neanderthals
As an a la carte once or twice a year catholic, seeing the pope has no real appeal to me. but many catholics feel differently. I will credit this pope with trying to force the church to face up to the scandals and trying to do the right thing, very often in the face of opposition from more conservative elements. The DUP and UUP leaders have shown their true colours in not meeting the Pope, and it is not surprising if disappointing. For me the Pope must meet the survivors of abuse and I know he has issued apologies before, but now is the time for action in driving further reform, opening up the church to all including a greater role for women, and a harder line on scandal hit prelates.