Author Topic: Paddy Jackson apology  (Read 22462 times)

Milltown Row2

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Re: Paddy Jackson apology
« Reply #210 on: April 12, 2018, 10:24:30 PM »
Jesus lads, we won, let it go.
If you google "me too suicide" there have been lots of instances of it. Check out the story of Benny Fredriksson who killed himself before police found the allegations against him were false. The justice system seems unfair against victims and very few would take issue with protests for change but the online vigilante justice system is grossly unfair against the accused.

Oh dear. Now #MeToo causes sucides. Not a peep about the systematic sexual assault of women, but you hold up one or two outliers as if they’d  are indicative of anything. I really wonder how you manage to get through a world that is 50% women and still hold these inane viewpoints. Try talking to one about what they’ve experienced rather than thinking you have all the answers in your own head.

Sure you’ve only one agenda and can’t see both sides! Most off the posters have seen the anguish and torment this girl has been put through and have every sympathy for her. You sir are an ass
Anything I post is not the view of the County Board!! Nobody died in the making of this post ;-)

Asal Mor

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Re: Paddy Jackson apology
« Reply #211 on: April 12, 2018, 10:28:39 PM »
Jesus lads, we won, let it go.
If you google "me too suicide" there have been lots of instances of it. Check out the story of Benny Fredriksson who killed himself before police found the allegations against him were false. The justice system seems unfair against victims and very few would take issue with protests for change but the online vigilante justice system is grossly unfair against the accused.

Oh dear. Now #MeToo causes sucides. Not a peep about the systematic sexual assault of women, but you hold up one or two outliers as if they’d  are indicative of anything. I really wonder how you manage to get through a world that is 50% women and still hold these inane viewpoints. Try talking to one about what they’ve experienced rather than thinking you have all the answers in your own head.

Sure you’ve only one agenda and can’t see both sides! Most off the posters have seen the anguish and torment this girl has been put through and have every sympathy for her. You sir are an ass
A huge +1 there MR.

sid waddell

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Re: Paddy Jackson apology
« Reply #212 on: April 12, 2018, 10:29:07 PM »

Dara Florence’s version of what she saw in the bedroom flatly contradicted the complainant’s version.
It did no such thing.

It flatly contradicted Jackson.

If you believe Florence, you believe Jackson lied about having vaginal sex with the complainant.
I do, sid I sure do.
But I also said, that what the defence has to say is/was immaterial. It was up to the prosecution to prove its case and they didn't.
You either accept the rule of law or you don't.

(BTW, when you calm down a bit, you will find that Florence contradicted both parties.)
Where did I say I didn't accept the verdict?

What Florence said didn't contradict the complainant in terms of consent at all.

It did contradict Jackson, categorically.


sid waddell

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Re: Paddy Jackson apology
« Reply #213 on: April 12, 2018, 10:32:42 PM »

Main Street

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Re: Paddy Jackson apology
« Reply #214 on: April 12, 2018, 10:37:51 PM »

Dara Florence’s version of what she saw in the bedroom flatly contradicted the complainant’s version.
It did no such thing.

It flatly contradicted Jackson.

If you believe Florence, you believe Jackson lied about having vaginal sex with the complainant.
I do, sid I sure do.
But I also said, that what the defence has to say is/was immaterial. It was up to the prosecution to prove its case and they didn't.


(BTW, when you calm down a bit, you will find that Florence contradicted both parties.)
Indeed DF's evidence contradicted both accounts,  but a small retriever for the prosecution, when at the end of her testimony she admitted she did not actually witness consent, it was just an impression.

Quote
You either accept the rule of law or you don't.
That's too black and white.
Accept the jury's decision, yes, 100% on the evidence presented in court  but i don't accept the legal procedure, i think this belfast courtroom and legal procedure was a toxic environment. The witness for the prosecution who also happens to be the complainant gets little protection in comparison to what the accused receive. Perhaps she gets treated a little better over the course of the proceedings than a snitch at a mafia mob boss trial, but not much better. I like what Noeline Blackwell the civil rights lawyer had to say about aspects of the imbalances,  eg. that the complainant should get the benefit of  having her own legal counsel, before in preparation for the what may transpire and also during the case with full rights  to intervene on her behalf in court. And that trial should be private, normal enough stuff i'd say.
 

Milltown Row2

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Re: Paddy Jackson apology
« Reply #215 on: April 12, 2018, 10:46:03 PM »

Dara Florence’s version of what she saw in the bedroom flatly contradicted the complainant’s version.
It did no such thing.

It flatly contradicted Jackson.

If you believe Florence, you believe Jackson lied about having vaginal sex with the complainant.
I do, sid I sure do.
But I also said, that what the defence has to say is/was immaterial. It was up to the prosecution to prove its case and they didn't.


(BTW, when you calm down a bit, you will find that Florence contradicted both parties.)
Indeed DF's evidence contradicted both accounts,  but a small retriever for the prosecution, when at the end of her testimony she admitted she did not actually witness consent, it was just an impression.

Quote
You either accept the rule of law or you don't.
That's too black and white.
Accept the jury's decision, yes, 100% on the evidence presented in court  but i don't accept the legal procedure, i think this belfast courtroom and legal procedure was a toxic environment. The witness for the prosecution who also happens to be the complainant gets little protection in comparison to what the accused receive. Perhaps she gets treated a little better over the course of the proceedings than a snitch at a mafia mob boss trial, but not much better. I like what Noeline Blackwell the civil rights lawyer had to say about aspects of the imbalances,  eg. that the complainant should get the benefit of  having her own legal counsel, before in preparation for the what may transpire and also during the case with full rights  to intervene on her behalf in court. And that trial should be private, normal enough stuff i'd say.

She had plenty legal advice before the trial and the girl came across as a very intellectual young adult with great responses for the questioning. As for the snitch remark, I’m confused? Did you want her to be visible ? She was under no pressure from the court as no one could see her, and going by the #metoo group she had plenty supporting her
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moysider

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Re: Paddy Jackson apology
« Reply #216 on: April 12, 2018, 11:26:12 PM »

Dara Florence’s version of what she saw in the bedroom flatly contradicted the complainant’s version.
It did no such thing.

It flatly contradicted Jackson.

If you believe Florence, you believe Jackson lied about having vaginal sex with the complainant.
I do, sid I sure do.
But I also said, that what the defence has to say is/was immaterial. It was up to the prosecution to prove its case and they didn't.


(BTW, when you calm down a bit, you will find that Florence contradicted both parties.)
Indeed DF's evidence contradicted both accounts,  but a small retriever for the prosecution, when at the end of her testimony she admitted she did not actually witness consent, it was just an impression.

Quote
You either accept the rule of law or you don't.
That's too black and white.
Accept the jury's decision, yes, 100% on the evidence presented in court  but i don't accept the legal procedure, i think this belfast courtroom and legal procedure was a toxic environment. The witness for the prosecution who also happens to be the complainant gets little protection in comparison to what the accused receive. Perhaps she gets treated a little better over the course of the proceedings than a snitch at a mafia mob boss trial, but not much better. I like what Noeline Blackwell the civil rights lawyer had to say about aspects of the imbalances,  eg. that the complainant should get the benefit of  having her own legal counsel, before in preparation for the what may transpire and also during the case with full rights  to intervene on her behalf in court. And that trial should be private, normal enough stuff i'd say.

She had plenty legal advice before the trial and the girl came across as a very intellectual young adult with great responses for the questioning. As for the snitch remark, I’m confused? Did you want her to be visible ? She was under no pressure from the court as no one could see her, and going by the #metoo group she had plenty supporting her

That is completely inaccurate MR2. Everybody could see her. Her testimony was up on a big screen for everybody to see. Day-trippers went from as far as way as Dublin for a look. She gave her version only able to see Judge, jury and lawyers. On screen everybody could see her. How bad is that.
 The supporters of the accused dominated in the gallery as well and reports indicate that she was ridiculed all through he testimony and the layout of the courtroom appeared to have allowed that to happen without the Judge being aware of it and not clearing the court, which should have happened in those circumstances. It was 3/1 on the night and 4/1 in court.
 Not having her own legal council present is an issue too. Defence council played a blinder and bullied the judge over the admissibility of some evidence. I'm still intrigued as to whom the blood stains came from that were from a third party? How could that not be relevant?
 The girl got justice but I cant help thinking about animals that hop around the outback in Australia.

sid waddell

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Re: Paddy Jackson apology
« Reply #217 on: April 13, 2018, 12:19:26 AM »
She was named in court, too.

So her "anonymity" meant very little.

Lar Naparka

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Re: Paddy Jackson apology
« Reply #218 on: April 13, 2018, 01:35:50 AM »

Dara Florence’s version of what she saw in the bedroom flatly contradicted the complainant’s version.
It did no such thing.

It flatly contradicted Jackson.

If you believe Florence, you believe Jackson lied about having vaginal sex with the complainant.
I do, sid I sure do.
But I also said, that what the defence has to say is/was immaterial. It was up to the prosecution to prove its case and they didn't.


(BTW, when you calm down a bit, you will find that Florence contradicted both parties.)
Indeed DF's evidence contradicted both accounts,  but a small retriever for the prosecution, when at the end of her testimony she admitted she did not actually witness consent, it was just an impression.

Quote
You either accept the rule of law or you don't.
That's too black and white.
Accept the jury's decision, yes, 100% on the evidence presented in court  but i don't accept the legal procedure, i think this belfast courtroom and legal procedure was a toxic environment. The witness for the prosecution who also happens to be the complainant gets little protection in comparison to what the accused receive. Perhaps she gets treated a little better over the course of the proceedings than a snitch at a mafia mob boss trial, but not much better. I like what Noeline Blackwell the civil rights lawyer had to say about aspects of the imbalances,  eg. that the complainant should get the benefit of  having her own legal counsel, before in preparation for the what may transpire and also during the case with full rights  to intervene on her behalf in court. And that trial should be private, normal enough stuff i'd say.
I agree 100% with that. But that is a side issue for me. I am concentrating on the court's verdict. It's may or may not have resulted in a different verdict of the legal procedures were different but the opinion of the jury, after hearing all the evidence presented to them was that the prosecution had not proved its case and therefore, the defendants were innocent of the charges laid against them, in a legal sense at any rate.
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David McKeown

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Re: Paddy Jackson apology
« Reply #219 on: April 13, 2018, 03:06:46 AM »

Dara Florence’s version of what she saw in the bedroom flatly contradicted the complainant’s version.
It did no such thing.

It flatly contradicted Jackson.

If you believe Florence, you believe Jackson lied about having vaginal sex with the complainant.
I do, sid I sure do.
But I also said, that what the defence has to say is/was immaterial. It was up to the prosecution to prove its case and they didn't.


(BTW, when you calm down a bit, you will find that Florence contradicted both parties.)
Indeed DF's evidence contradicted both accounts,  but a small retriever for the prosecution, when at the end of her testimony she admitted she did not actually witness consent, it was just an impression.

Quote
You either accept the rule of law or you don't.
That's too black and white.
Accept the jury's decision, yes, 100% on the evidence presented in court  but i don't accept the legal procedure, i think this belfast courtroom and legal procedure was a toxic environment. The witness for the prosecution who also happens to be the complainant gets little protection in comparison to what the accused receive. Perhaps she gets treated a little better over the course of the proceedings than a snitch at a mafia mob boss trial, but not much better. I like what Noeline Blackwell the civil rights lawyer had to say about aspects of the imbalances,  eg. that the complainant should get the benefit of  having her own legal counsel, before in preparation for the what may transpire and also during the case with full rights  to intervene on her behalf in court. And that trial should be private, normal enough stuff i'd say.

What exactly would be the benefit of having her own legal counsel?  I'm not opposed to the idea I'm just not sure I see much benefit to it. In what way were the procedures toxic? 

As for private trials whilst I can see some benefit there are two massive drawbacks. 1. They act as very little deterrent to other would be rapists 2. For justice to be done it must be seen to be done. I dread to think how the outcome of this case would be approached on social media has it taken place behind closed doors. The allegations of corruption etc would have been rife.

Farrandeelin

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Re: Paddy Jackson apology
« Reply #220 on: April 13, 2018, 08:42:07 AM »
I don’t think the baying mob will be pleased until one of the lads throws a rope up to be honest!

You are such an ass. Always wanting to diminish the problems this trial has highlighted and uplift the ‘lads’. You are exactly the sort of fool they are protesting.

Careful now. Sid will be on here soon complaining that you called MR2 an animal any minute...
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Franko

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Re: Paddy Jackson apology
« Reply #221 on: April 13, 2018, 08:44:45 AM »
But there's no such a thing as "rape culture", or something.

Quote
A CORK SCHOOL is investigating after a list which said “the girls with the most number of ticks will get raped” was found in a boys’ bathroom.

http://www.thejournal.ie/mallow-school-rape-list-3954562-Apr2018/

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/education/cork-secondary-school-investigates-rape-list-found-in-boys-toilets-1.3460099?mode=sample&auth-failed=1&pw-origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishtimes.com%2Fnews%2Feducation%2Fcork-secondary-school-investigates-rape-list-found-in-boys-toilets-1.3460099

I know you think you think you've struck evidential gold with this one but the fact that this story is national news probably disproves your point.

If this was ingrained 'culture' as you like to point out, nobody would bat an eyelid.

AQMP

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Re: Paddy Jackson apology
« Reply #222 on: April 13, 2018, 09:03:48 AM »
She was named in court, too.

So her "anonymity" meant very little.

This is true, then from the court to Twitter and FB in a few seconds.  You don't have to dig very far to find out her name and background.  I'm sure the majority of posters here are aware of her name at the very least, you just won't find it in the papers or mentioned on TV.  I think this is an issue for the legal process to look at.

Milltown Row2

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Re: Paddy Jackson apology
« Reply #223 on: April 13, 2018, 09:23:53 AM »
She was named in court, too.

So her "anonymity" meant very little.

This is true, then from the court to Twitter and FB in a few seconds.  You don't have to dig very far to find out her name and background.  I'm sure the majority of posters here are aware of her name at the very least, you just won't find it in the papers or mentioned on TV.  I think this is an issue for the legal process to look at.

My point is her anonymity means her name isnt in the papers and on tv, her history isnt being put in the daily rags and probably a good thing for her depending on what skeletons that may or may not be in her cupboard..

Having your name dragged through the papers I'm sure can be tough, and when you have been found not guilty then even tougher... I'm surprised this girl, having already been through it and knows what to expect and with the #metoo crowd behind her doesnt go for a civil case against them..

I mean if you think that most people know who she is then why not go do that route any ways?
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David McKeown

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Re: Paddy Jackson apology
« Reply #224 on: April 13, 2018, 09:56:36 AM »
She was named in court, too.

So her "anonymity" meant very little.

This is true, then from the court to Twitter and FB in a few seconds.  You don't have to dig very far to find out her name and background.  I'm sure the majority of posters here are aware of her name at the very least, you just won't find it in the papers or mentioned on TV.  I think this is an issue for the legal process to look at.

They are. What you describe is a criminal offence and people have been At least questioned over it