Poll

Would you be in favour of an alternative championship for Div 3 and 4 with winners and runners up rejoining the other championship.

Yes
90 (53.9%)
No
68 (40.7%)
Undecided
9 (5.4%)

Total Members Voted: 167

Author Topic: Would you be in favour of a second tier?  (Read 17176 times)

Rossfan

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Re: Would you be in favour of a second tier?
« Reply #360 on: October 26, 2018, 01:20:21 PM »
And only knock out games!!
I'd say 10 would have folded at this stage.
2018- 2 Cupeens won, 2 to go.

lenny

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Re: Would you be in favour of a second tier?
« Reply #361 on: October 26, 2018, 01:23:51 PM »
Imagine if every vlub in your county could only participate in the SFC.......

That's what the current intercounty scene is

Ah but they just need to get off their arses and work harder. I can just see Ardmore taking on slaughtneil in Derry.

Blowitupref

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Re: Would you be in favour of a second tier?
« Reply #362 on: October 26, 2018, 01:50:02 PM »
Carlow's only notable scalp was Kildare in the Leinster in May 2018.
Their other scalps were against other basement or under achievers.
They may have got "off their arses" but getting promoted from D4 is the easy part.
Anyway well see what the CC come up with in November.

Wasn't that easy for them lets be fair.

Only 4 years ago they finished last in Div 4 and when you are that low you aren't expected to take any scalps.
Is the ref going to finally blow his whistle?... No, he's going to blow his nose

Esmarelda

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Re: Would you be in favour of a second tier?
« Reply #363 on: October 26, 2018, 04:33:43 PM »
So it looks like a B Championship. I've always thought that the players from the lower tier's opinion is the most important so so be it.

I find it very strange that two of the worst teams in the country are looking forward to a championship where (presumably) they'll be up against teams from the top half of Division 3. But let's wait and see what's put forward.

Rossfan

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Re: Would you be in favour of a second tier?
« Reply #364 on: October 26, 2018, 05:11:36 PM »
If they only took my proposal of Senior, Intermediate and Junior........
2018- 2 Cupeens won, 2 to go.

Cunny Funt

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Re: Would you be in favour of a second tier?
« Reply #365 on: October 31, 2018, 03:26:02 PM »
Carlow All-Star nominee Paul Broderick has reiterated his opposition to the introduction of a second-tier football championship.

Reacting to the results of the recent GPA survey which revealed ‘60pc of football members now supporting a change’, Tinryland clubman Broderick refused to budge on his stance on the issue.

“If you asked me would I like to play in a second-tier championship, the answer would be no,” he told the Irish Independent. “But if you asked me do I think we're going to win the All-Ireland in the 'A', the answer is no as well.

“No disrespect to the teams who'd be playing, we're one of those who would be playing in a second tier, but they're not going to garner the same respect and enthusiasm from the public in Carlow.

“It's hard to know without trialling something like this, but it was trialled before and it didn't work. For whatever reasons, I'm not sure. At the moment I wouldn't be in favour of it. Not the way it's currently put forward anyway.”

JoG2

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Re: Would you be in favour of a second tier?
« Reply #366 on: October 31, 2018, 03:46:22 PM »
Pete McGrath


“Obviously I’d need to see the blueprint whenever it comes out. They have to be smart about this.

“We all know there’d be a stigma attached to teams who are able to play only in a second or third tier.

“If the GAA model it in such a way that, initially, every team is in the same competition: i.e., their provincial championship, which leads on to qualifiers and, ultimately, the Sam Maguire, then that would be OK.

“Then, at a certain point, if a county doesn’t win its initial game or its second game, they play in a second tier competition – to me that would appear more democratic.”

Having departed Fermanagh after expressions of dressing room unrest, McGrath knows that keeping the players happy is key to any success:

“There would still be players who, whenever their county drops out of the main competition, would say ‘I’m not committing to anything else, I’ve more to do with my time’.

“I don’t know what the reaction would be, but we all know that mind-set is there. I was surprised to read that figure of 60 per cent [in favour of a change] because prior to that any players asked had said ‘no’.

“Even those from smaller counties were adamant that they don’t want to play in anything that’s regarded as ‘second tier’ or however it’s described.

“That also means 40 per cent weren’t keen on change, and you have to look at that too.”

Rossfan

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Re: Would you be in favour of a second tier?
« Reply #367 on: October 31, 2018, 04:21:14 PM »
Pete McGrath




“If the GAA model it in such a way that, initially, every team is in the same competition: i.e., their provincial championship, which leads on to qualifiers and, ultimately, the Sam Maguire, then that would be OK.

“Then, at a certain point, if a county doesn’t win its initial game or its second game, they play in a second tier competition – to me that would appear more democratic.”



They already had that Pete  - Tommy Murphy Cup ;)
2018- 2 Cupeens won, 2 to go.

twohands!!!

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Re: Would you be in favour of a second tier?
« Reply #368 on: October 31, 2018, 10:37:51 PM »
Carlow All-Star nominee Paul Broderick has reiterated his opposition to the introduction of a second-tier football championship.

Reacting to the results of the recent GPA survey which revealed ‘60pc of football members now supporting a change’, Tinryland clubman Broderick refused to budge on his stance on the issue.

“If you asked me would I like to play in a second-tier championship, the answer would be no,” he told the Irish Independent. “But if you asked me do I think we're going to win the All-Ireland in the 'A', the answer is no as well.

“No disrespect to the teams who'd be playing, we're one of those who would be playing in a second tier, but they're not going to garner the same respect and enthusiasm from the public in Carlow.

“It's hard to know without trialling something like this, but it was trialled before and it didn't work. For whatever reasons, I'm not sure. At the moment I wouldn't be in favour of it. Not the way it's currently put forward anyway.”

With respect I think Broderick is probably  placing a bit too much emphasis on Carlow's results in 2018 in terms of the wins over Louth and Kildare.
It's worth remembering that Louth played 10 games between league and championship and won 1 - against London; while Kildare played 15 and won 4 - Derry, Longford, Mayo and Fermanagh)
So while they had two wins against top 16 opposition, both of those teams had poor (if not miserable) seasons, with a combined record of played 25 won 5.
These stats are even a bit deceptive in that the loss to Carlow was a nadir for Kildare and they won their 4 games after this and Louth won their 1 game after this, so the record of the two teams Carlow beat was played 14 lost 14 for the year when Carlow played them.

2017 is a perfect example of why Carlow should be playing in a 2nd Tier competition - they lucked out in terms of the draw and had 3 competitive games against Division 4 opposition, which they won, but when they played Division 1 sides they lost convincingly.

Teams Carlow have beaten in the championship from 2009 onwards (2008 was the last year of the Tommy Murphy Cup)
2018   Louth - relegated from Division 2
2018   Kildare - relegated from Division 1
2017   Wexford - promoted from Division 4
2017   London - bottom of Division 4
2017   Leitrim - 5th in Division 4
2016   Wicklow - 5th in Division 4
2014   Waterford - 5th in Division 4
2011   Louth - promoted from Division 3

Teams Carlow have lost to in the championship from 2009 onwards
2018   Laois
2018   Tyrone
2017   Dublin
2017   Monaghan
2016   Louth
2016   Cavan
2015   Laois
2015   Longford
2014   Meath
2014   Clare
2013   Westmeath
2013   Laois
2012   Meath
2012   Laois
2011   Wexford
2011   Antrim
2010   Wicklow
2010   Derry
2009   Louth
2009   Donegal






Cunny Funt

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Re: Would you be in favour of a second tier?
« Reply #369 on: October 31, 2018, 11:00:27 PM »

2017 is a perfect example of why Carlow should be playing in a 2nd Tier competition - they lucked out in terms of the draw and had 3 competitive games against Division 4 opposition, which they won, but when they played Division 1 sides they lost convincingly.
Lost convincingly in the end but you shouldn't forget what happened during those games which was competitive displays and a few Div 2 teams haven't managed to do that against those teams.

Dublin 0-10 Carlow 0-6 after 50mins then Brendan Murphy was sent off
Carlow 1-6 Monaghan 0-10 after 65 mins then a goal from Fintan Kelly



The point Broderick was making is he and his team mates would prefer to test themselves against top sides where the interest and enthusiasm from the public is high than playing in a 2nd tier championship.