Author Topic: Money, Dublin and the GAA  (Read 126297 times)

Maroon Manc

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #60 on: October 06, 2016, 11:07:30 AM »
So one county accounts for over 50% of the GDO funding but the rest of us who think this is unfair are just ignorant.  ;D

Croí na hÉireann

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #61 on: October 06, 2016, 11:47:19 AM »
I really don’t know how many young kids are playing Gaelic football in Dublin but a report (and I’m tired of referring to it) came out in the early 90s.
Central Council had been worries by the high dropout rate of kids in the Dublin area and to compare that with other counties. ( That’s no well put I know but its meaning should be clear enough.)
“Lack of penetration” was the buzz term then.
There was a huge number of very young kids playing at the lowest (youngest) level but the numbers decreased dramatically as the youngsters moved up through the ranks. CC felt that the earlier a kid dropped out, the less the chances f him or her taking part in club activity of any sort. In effect they were being lost to the GAA.
The committee (including Eugene McGee and Colm O’Rourke) reported back that there were five Dublin clubs who each could field more juvenile players that any one of five different counties.
Accepting that there is always a natural fall out rate as kids grow older, the report concluded that the problem was exacerbated in Dublin because superclubs tend to discard players as the number of teams fielded decrease as kids grow older.
Smaller clubs don’t have this problem to the same degree as they don’t start off with the same number of u10s or other very young age groups.
Many kids are forced to drop out against their will and as a result many who leave  bear a resentment to their former clubs. 
As usual, the report was not acted upon but  the problems as outlined have become very much worse.
From my experience, these GPO's that are with most Dublin clubs spend most of their time in primary schools trying to win the battle for youngsters v soccer and rugby. They'll take a regular PE class during school time and teach basic skills to junior/senior infants and encourage them to join the club.

My lad has been with the local GAA club for 6 years has received 2 training sessions at the club from the GPO in that time. (I know they do help arrange the Cul Camp / Summer Camp thingy for 2 different weeks in the summer, but my lad won't go to them.)
 
From my club's point of view there is a debate each year about whether the cost of the GPO is worth it. (I thought it was the same for any club, that if you put up 50% of the cost, central coffers would fund the rest?). As you can imagine there is plenty of giving out about someone getting paid versus the rest of us volunteers. We've had 3 different GPOs in my time, the first was absolutely useless, the second a complete headcase. The third seems a bit better, although I haven't seen much of him and he's never been at a training session or match involving my son's team.

The GPOs in Dublin are in the main with the larger clubs and that in itself means they have multiple primary schools to get around to. In the clubs themselves, they mainly concentrate on running the coaching courses in the club, the camps during the summer and overseeing the nurseries on Saturday mornings. I've seen them help out with fitness tests with the various teams in the clubs too and they can be lent on to coach one of the senior teams if they are fresh in the door. They usually have other employment/studies on the go as well.
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Maroon Manc

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #62 on: October 06, 2016, 12:07:46 PM »
I think the GDO's and how they work just isn't working. Looking from the outside it just seems an attempt at the GAA to get kids interested in the sport and keep them away from other sports in Dublin.  I don't think its much as an advantage to Dublin as many are making out; The money would be better spent elsewhere.

We have a GDO over here, he's a brilliant coach and great at his job but I think we'd all benefit a lot more if the money was given directly to the clubs.

ballinaman

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #63 on: October 06, 2016, 12:15:57 PM »


westbound

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #64 on: October 06, 2016, 12:32:42 PM »
That's a good graphic ballinaman.

There is also another (probably more relevant) graphic of the breakdown of spending per registered player (or club member - I can't quite remember which).
Can you put up that one too?

Thanks

The Aristocrat

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #65 on: October 06, 2016, 12:34:37 PM »
A picture of Ireland with some numbers on it, wow, show me signed off audited accounts and expenses and wages for all councils and county boards, then we can have a discussion.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2016, 12:36:34 PM by The Aristocrat »

Farrandeelin

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #66 on: October 06, 2016, 12:40:16 PM »
A picture of Ireland with some numbers on it, wow, show me signed off audited accounts and expenses and wages for all councils and county boards, then we can have a discussion.
Read the top of the graph. More than numbers there.
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The Aristocrat

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #67 on: October 06, 2016, 12:47:08 PM »
A picture of Ireland with some numbers on it, wow, show me signed off audited accounts and expenses and wages for all councils and county boards, then we can have a discussion.
Read the top of the graph. More than numbers there.

I did, what official signed off accounts did this come from. There is no letterhead or logo at the top. And its just a basic graph that shows Dublin got more, of course Dublin gets the most funding, there is a thing called a capital city and within this city usually contains a large population, schools, clubs, etc.

Lets discuss the mismanagement of finances of county boards over the last 20 years? Might start a new thread on it and include why no plan or vision put forward ever by some county boards.!!
« Last Edit: October 06, 2016, 12:49:23 PM by The Aristocrat »

mup

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #68 on: October 06, 2016, 01:11:18 PM »
A picture of Ireland with some numbers on it, wow, show me signed off audited accounts and expenses and wages for all councils and county boards, then we can have a discussion.

Are you going to provide me with a link to Kieran McGeeneys payments or not while in Kildare because I would really like to know?

Or are you being found out like you were on another thread?

ballinaman

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #69 on: October 06, 2016, 01:31:56 PM »















Lar Naparka

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #70 on: October 06, 2016, 03:05:55 PM »
Ewan McKenna is bang on the button!
The fact that for every €2.63 spent on youth development in Mayo from central funds, Dublin gets €11.73 should be cause enough for unease. This massive imbalance of resources cannot be sustained long term. Galway fares out even worse than Mayo. Indeed all along the western seaboard the counties that need the most receive the least.
For me, McKenna did not go far enough.
The advantages of having superclubs so big that they have more juvenile players than, Roscommon, Sligo, Fermanagh, Leitrim or Cavan ( and that was more than 20 years ago) are obvious enough.
But there are massive downsides also and eventually it will be become apparent to all, bar the circle-the-wagon school of logic, that what the CC is doing will be counter productive.

For example, a large club that will have no difficulty in attracting u8s or 9s will have to let the majority of them go by the time they are old enough to player minor.
There many be 8 or 9 grades of competition at younger levels but the number decreases as youngsters move up through the age levels.
ASFAIK, there are only two grades at minor level; u18A and u8B. (I am not aware of any u18c grade but I may well be wrong on that.
So,  the GAA/Dublin County Board policy is to attract kids at an early age, provide them with the best facilities and coaching available and  then turf them out on a gradual basis as they get older.
I think it’s a no-brainer to say that the earlier a juvenile is forced to drop out of GAA  activities, the less likely he is to retain an attachment with club he had been involved with.
If, say, there were four medium-sized clubs in an area, there could be at least four times as many u18s engaged in competitive football as there would be in a single super sized one.
Put anyway you like, whatever the present policy of youth development may be, it benefits nobody.
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tonto1888

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #71 on: October 06, 2016, 03:29:08 PM »
the capital grants one, is that how much moneyu each county has received in capital grants? ie Tyrone has received over twice what Armagh has?

westbound

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #72 on: October 06, 2016, 04:24:22 PM »
Thanks Ballinaman.

IMO the most important piece of information is the € per registered gaa player.

In the years 2010 - 2014 Dublin got €274.7 per registered player.
The next nearest to that is Fermanagh with €68.7.

That means in the 4 years, Dublin got AT LEAST 4 TIMES MORE PER PLAYER than any other county.

Mayo, Tyrone and Kerry all got around the €20 per player mark. That is approximately one twelfth of what Dublin received per player!
They are doing well to be getting anywhere even close to competitive with Dublin at that rate!

Jinxy

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #73 on: October 06, 2016, 06:27:08 PM »
Ewan McKenna is bang on the button!
The fact that for every €2.63 spent on youth development in Mayo from central funds, Dublin gets €11.73 should be cause enough for unease. This massive imbalance of resources cannot be sustained long term. Galway fares out even worse than Mayo. Indeed all along the western seaboard the counties that need the most receive the least.
For me, McKenna did not go far enough.
The advantages of having superclubs so big that they have more juvenile players than, Roscommon, Sligo, Fermanagh, Leitrim or Cavan ( and that was more than 20 years ago) are obvious enough.
But there are massive downsides also and eventually it will be become apparent to all, bar the circle-the-wagon school of logic, that what the CC is doing will be counter productive.

For example, a large club that will have no difficulty in attracting u8s or 9s will have to let the majority of them go by the time they are old enough to player minor.
There many be 8 or 9 grades of competition at younger levels but the number decreases as youngsters move up through the age levels.
ASFAIK, there are only two grades at minor level; u18A and u8B. (I am not aware of any u18c grade but I may well be wrong on that.
So,  the GAA/Dublin County Board policy is to attract kids at an early age, provide them with the best facilities and coaching available and  then turf them out on a gradual basis as they get older.
I think it’s a no-brainer to say that the earlier a juvenile is forced to drop out of GAA  activities, the less likely he is to retain an attachment with club he had been involved with.
If, say, there were four medium-sized clubs in an area, there could be at least four times as many u18s engaged in competitive football as there would be in a single super sized one.
Put anyway you like, whatever the present policy of youth development may be, it benefits nobody.

Time to split Ballyboden in two.
If you were any use you'd be playing.

Croí na hÉireann

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #74 on: October 07, 2016, 11:38:39 AM »
Ewan McKenna is bang on the button!
The fact that for every €2.63 spent on youth development in Mayo from central funds, Dublin gets €11.73 should be cause enough for unease. This massive imbalance of resources cannot be sustained long term. Galway fares out even worse than Mayo. Indeed all along the western seaboard the counties that need the most receive the least.
For me, McKenna did not go far enough.
The advantages of having superclubs so big that they have more juvenile players than, Roscommon, Sligo, Fermanagh, Leitrim or Cavan ( and that was more than 20 years ago) are obvious enough.
But there are massive downsides also and eventually it will be become apparent to all, bar the circle-the-wagon school of logic, that what the CC is doing will be counter productive.

For example, a large club that will have no difficulty in attracting u8s or 9s will have to let the majority of them go by the time they are old enough to player minor.
There many be 8 or 9 grades of competition at younger levels but the number decreases as youngsters move up through the age levels.
ASFAIK, there are only two grades at minor level; u18A and u8B. (I am not aware of any u18c grade but I may well be wrong on that.
So,  the GAA/Dublin County Board policy is to attract kids at an early age, provide them with the best facilities and coaching available and  then turf them out on a gradual basis as they get older.
I think it’s a no-brainer to say that the earlier a juvenile is forced to drop out of GAA  activities, the less likely he is to retain an attachment with club he had been involved with.
If, say, there were four medium-sized clubs in an area, there could be at least four times as many u18s engaged in competitive football as there would be in a single super sized one.
Put anyway you like, whatever the present policy of youth development may be, it benefits nobody.

Time to split Ballyboden in two.

Ballyboden already has two, the catchment area could easily take another two clubs though if there was any green areas to put them in
Westmeath - Home of the Christy Ring Cup...