Author Topic: Money, Dublin and the GAA  (Read 131798 times)

Orchard park

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #390 on: September 20, 2017, 03:52:36 PM »
is a Nama survivor and a high profile yank not bankrolling the management in Roscommon Syferus ???

Click the fûcking link. Keep on topic, I know it seems to be a sore point for you.

no sore point , you seem to be the resident Rossie expert here even if your views dont match those Rossies I know.... i'm asking the question who pays McStay and Maughan, David Joyce etc or will it appear in the 2017 roscommon accounts. its very much on topic you claim financial impropriety in Dublin and I am arguing the Dublin mgmt team earn less than roscommon and roscommon arent getting much in return unless you really value an out dated provincial title

TheGreatest

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #391 on: September 20, 2017, 03:56:44 PM »
one other big point in the funding debate, is that John Costello prepared the blue prints, put the business case together etc to show how the money was to be spent, it  wasnt a case of Dublin needs a million for coaching development, he had the stats to back the demand

Absolutely. They put together a great plan, and have delivered on it, in terms of high quality coaching outputs. I certainly wouldn't argue that point.

Y'see that's all well and good, but it's the money being spent at senior IC that really warps things. Dublin are good at underage, but not the unbeatable force they are at senior. So their advantages only tend to amplify as they move up the grades. On top of reigning in Dublin's money you need to have proper limits on backroom teams, IC preparation spending and even training (beyond the piss-weak 'don't train in the off-season' that the managers circumvent anyways), in my opinion. Dublin have created an unsustainable arms race at senior with counties like Mayo, Kerry and Kildare in the past spending insane amounts of money over and under the table to try to match their opponents' professional set-up.

how much are Dublin spending as opposed to other counties ??? I tell you Syf your beloved Roscommon are spending more on the manager coach and selectors than Dublin are with we the taxpayer basically underwriting their main benefactor for many years and some other lad from San Franciso pumping in a fortune also

Ah yeah, Roscommon is flush with cash and everything you said is true and not half-invented whataboutry - http://www.roscommonpeople.ie/sport/50-sport/money-owed-a-major-problem-gaa-treasurer

You can try to distract from the money Dublin is using to warp IC competition into nothing more than a race for second place but no one here will be failing for that nonsense.

David O’Connor of Club Rossie made a very strong defence of the use of the bus saying that it was a very important promotional tool for Roscommon GAA and that it’s worth and benefit far outweighed any negatives.

Promotional tool, not beneficial to teams no.



Orchard park

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #392 on: September 20, 2017, 03:58:39 PM »
i think that bus is a great idea if its fully sponsored as its claimed to be. Volunteer drivers panel an all that

Declan

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #393 on: September 20, 2017, 04:06:02 PM »

Talk of splitting Dublin shows a defeatist attitude
Philip Jordan

Updated / Wednesday, 20 Sep 2017 15:34

I want to address the suggestion of breaking Dublin up into more than one team for senior inter-county football by looking at their results over the past two seasons.

In 2016 and 2017, between League and Championship, they had 12 games that were decided by three points or less.

They drew four of them, lost one one - this year’s League final to Kerry at Croke Park - and won the rest.

Of the four they drew, they came from behind against Kerry and Tyrone in the League to get a point and only Donegal and Mayo were able to catch them coming from behind with a late equaliser.

Mayo are a brilliant team, even close to being a great team, and in any other era they would have won an All-Ireland by now, and Dublin have only beaten them by a point in their two All-Ireland final wins over them plus last year’s draw.


I would love to see more money invested in Belfast, which is a big city with a young population, to help drag Antrim up

The fact of the matter is that this Dubs team have an incredible ability not to lose games and, more importantly, win the big ones when the stakes are highest and margins are at their finest.

There’s no amount of coaching at youth level, investment or anything else that can train a team to do that.

This is a mentally tough group of players that know how to close it out and that sort of resolve is built up over time.

I predicted the past two years that Dublin wouldn’t have the hunger to come back and win another All-Ireland and they did it both times. Doing three in-a-row, something that happens so rarely in Gaelic football, in this modern era, where the demands on players are greater than ever, is truly remarkable.

Again, there’s no amount of money that can buy that desire. Dublin also have a brilliant manager in Jim Gavin who has been able to adapt his game plan and overhaul his team with new players while keeping established names happy on the bench.

There are so many other reasons too, one of them that the Dubs had such an easy passage to the All-Ireland final this year that they only had to peak for one game in September.

If there was more depth and stronger opposition, maybe they wouldn’t be three in-a-row champions because it seems to be a case of the top two a long way ahead of everyone else.

In history before we’ve had dominant teams, Kerry in the seventies and eighties, Galway in the sixties and others further back and it’s a cause for concern at the time, but they always get beaten eventually.

There’s no doubt in my mind that this Dublin team are the greatest I’ve ever seen playing Gaelic football and it would be no surprise to see them win again next and maybe even do a five in-a-row in 2019.

But splitting the county up isn’t the right thing to do. Sure, Dublin have a bigger population than everyone else, but they can only have 15 players on the field at any given team, the same as their opponents.

To say that they have to be split up is a defeatist attitude: ‘we can’t reach that standard so break them up’. As a player I certainly wouldn’t have had any interest in beating North Dublin or South Dublin - I wanted to beat the best.

I would agree though that the GAA’s funding has to be divided up differently. Dublin has gotten a lot of money in recent years and it’s to their credit that they have invested it wisely and reaped the rewards - there’s no guarantee that another county would have made such good use of similar funding.

For example, from an Ulster football point of view I would love to see more money invested in Belfast, which is a big city with a young population. Soccer and rugby are the most popular sports there and with greater investment the GAA could harness that youth and drag Antrim up a long way.

The Leinster Championship also has to be made more competitive. Dublin have dominated it since 2005, only missing out once in 2010, and just moving them out of Croke Park more often would have a positive effect on this.

Carlow were competitive against the Dubs this summer in Laois and had that been at Croke Park the margin of defeat could easily have been double.

The problem for every other Leinster county is that they are beaten before they go out, which is understandable, and players have to see hope in order to develop. It’s no use to them if they see no way of beating Dublin and straight away start wondering can they get a good draw in the qualifiers.

With equal funding, every county should be able to produce 25 senior footballers of a similarly good standard to be competitive, even though it requires an awful lot of work from grassroots up to get right.

Dublin have invested their money well and now the time has come to invest in other counties.

Rossfan

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #394 on: September 20, 2017, 04:10:27 PM »
Grand so - give Leitrim, Longford and Fermanagh €1m each and they'll bate all before them in a few tears.
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6th sam

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #395 on: September 20, 2017, 04:16:28 PM »
i think that bus is a great idea if its fully sponsored as its claimed to be. Volunteer drivers panel an all that
There is no doubt the bus has paid for itself , on promotional value alone ("there's no such thing as bad publicity"), there are also benefits in terms of player comfort, pride in quality, ?financial savings. It's an example of what any county can do in terms of doing things well , cost effectively. Rather than despise what Dublin, Kerry, Roscommon have done in seeking excellence, we should learn from it and try and disseminate models of best practice throughout the country.
Dublin are an example of how a strategy formulated and implemented by very able individual(s) can reap rewards. Many of their ideas are transferable throughout the land and beyond. We all say that the GAA has "created a monster" in Dublin's current status, which has negative connotations . Let's turn that on his head and say we have "created a beast" , in a positive sense, and the success of Dublin can be a catalyst and/or template for overall GAA success.
Notwithstanding that , the GAA needs to remove the inequalities in the current system around provincial bias, distribution of resources, and lack of financial capping , for example.

magpie seanie

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #396 on: September 20, 2017, 04:17:49 PM »
Good common sense article there from Jordan. Gavin is a super manager in the right job. I think he might only be average in a different county but in terms of keeping a winning team fresh and hungry he's a genius.

Captain Obvious

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #397 on: September 20, 2017, 04:23:24 PM »

There’s no doubt in my mind that this Dublin team are the greatest I’ve ever seen playing Gaelic football and it would be no surprise to see them win again next and maybe even do a five in-a-row in 2019.


They may well win five in-a-row in 2019 however to truly judge greatness you normally look at the strength of the contenders.  A team of the quality of Philip Jordans Tyrone of 2003,05 would beat this Dublin team in All Ireland final IMO.

Falcao

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #398 on: September 20, 2017, 04:36:53 PM »
Like this?




There are 2 major issues I can see with the development money received per registered player figures, which render them completely inaccurate.

1. The figures only cover development funding paid from the Central Council directly to the counties. Dublin receive most of their dev funds this way whereas the other counties receive the bulk of their games dev funding from their provincial councils. For example in 2015, Connacht received 796k, Munster almost 1.2m, Leinster 1.7m and Ulster 1.27m.

According to the figures on the image, this 5 million distributed by provincial councils is assumed to have disappeared down a black hole. Due to this 5 million not being accounted for, every figure shown on the map is incorrect, and that is a fact.

How a professional journalist can repeatedly reference these figures, which he knows do not cover all of the money distributed is beyond me, although in this case I think the agenda of the journalist is pretty clear.

2. It is illogical to divide the funding received by the no. of Registered GAA players in the county. The funding is not just used to coach already registered players.  For example it funds Cul Camps which are held for 6-13 yr old's and coaching in primary schools. I think it is safe to assume that a lot of these kids are not registered GAA players and some schools that coaches are sent to would in fact have very little registered GAA players.

The only reason I can see for this calculation is to push the numbers up for Dublin. If funding was divided by population or number of juveniles (registered and unregistered) that benefited from the funding then Dublin's amount per head would be reduced significantly.

manfromdelmonte

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #399 on: September 20, 2017, 04:38:38 PM »
Seriously low number of registered players in Dublin is it not?
some clubs in Dublin only field one adult team

TheGreatest

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #400 on: September 20, 2017, 04:39:13 PM »

There’s no doubt in my mind that this Dublin team are the greatest I’ve ever seen playing Gaelic football and it would be no surprise to see them win again next and maybe even do a five in-a-row in 2019.


They may well win five in-a-row in 2019 however to truly judge greatness you normally look at the strength of the contenders.  A team of the quality of Philip Jordans Tyrone of 2003,05 would beat this Dublin team in All Ireland final IMO.

An opinion and we will never know. My opinion is they wouldn't.

Also an opinion, Would Mayo have 3 all Irelands this decade if the Dubs were in noughties mode or would Mayo be as good as they are without meeting this Dublin team to get to that level.

Just remember in 12 games Mayo have not beaten the Dubs since 2012. Once.


From the Bunker

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Halfquarter

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #402 on: September 20, 2017, 10:25:10 PM »
Like this?




There are 2 major issues I can see with the development money received per registered player figures, which render them completely inaccurate.

1. The figures only cover development funding paid from the Central Council directly to the counties. Dublin receive most of their dev funds this way whereas the other counties receive the bulk of their games dev funding from their provincial councils. For example in 2015, Connacht received 796k, Munster almost 1.2m, Leinster 1.7m and Ulster 1.27m.

According to the figures on the image, this 5 million distributed by provincial councils is assumed to have disappeared down a black hole. Due to this 5 million not being accounted for, every figure shown on the map is incorrect, and that is a fact.

How a professional journalist can repeatedly reference these figures, which he knows do not cover all of the money distributed is beyond me, although in this case I think the agenda of the journalist is pretty clear.

2. It is illogical to divide the funding received by the no. of Registered GAA players in the county. The funding is not just used to coach already registered players.  For example it funds Cul Camps which are held for 6-13 yr old's and coaching in primary schools. I think it is safe to assume that a lot of these kids are not registered GAA players and some schools that coaches are sent to would in fact have very little registered GAA players.

The only reason I can see for this calculation is to push the numbers up for Dublin. If funding was divided by population or number of juveniles (registered and unregistered) that benefited from the funding then Dublin's amount per head would be reduced significantly.

Dublin also receive development funds from the provincial council.

trileacman

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #403 on: September 20, 2017, 11:27:41 PM »
Worth listening to

http://www.offtheball.com/podcasts/Off_The_Ball/GAA_on_Off_The_Ball/57592/Financial_imbalances_in_the_GAA

Sean kelly's opinion is a f**king disgrace. Typical gaa big wig attitude, "smaller counties are the problem, if only we could marginalise and exclude them from the championship proper it would be great."
Fantasy Rugby World Cup Champion 2011,
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magpie seanie

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Re: Money, Dublin and the GAA
« Reply #404 on: September 20, 2017, 11:28:27 PM »
Worth listening to

http://www.offtheball.com/podcasts/Off_The_Ball/GAA_on_Off_The_Ball/57592/Financial_imbalances_in_the_GAA

Sean kelly's opinion is a f**king disgrace. Typical gaa big wig attitude, "smaller counties are the problem, if only we could marginalise and exclude them from the championship proper it would be great."


He was always a muppet anyway.