Author Topic: A United Ireland. Opening up the discussion.  (Read 127651 times)

Franko

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Re: A United Ireland. Opening up the discussion.
« Reply #2355 on: November 02, 2018, 05:43:34 PM »
I'm typing this from the Enterprise train.

Wee Jeffrey Donaldson was hiding away at the back of the carriage I'm in and got off in Newry.

Would love to know what he thinks of the smoothness of AI infrastructure Surely a brief experience of how much sense it all makes.

He boycotted the toilets - the signs are bi-lingual.

Probably down at the passport office.

yellowcard

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Re: A United Ireland. Opening up the discussion.
« Reply #2356 on: November 02, 2018, 10:09:18 PM »
There are brickies from south Armagh commuting an hr at most each way to the north side of Dublin, with 1500 euro in their arse pocket on a Friday afternoon, maybe more. That would give you a very comfortable lifestyle in the north.

Brickies taking home over €70k per annum so before tax over €100k gross a year??!!

Why would anybody go to college now when they can earn that sort of money. There are plenty of professional people earning nowhere near those sums.

trailer

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Re: A United Ireland. Opening up the discussion.
« Reply #2357 on: November 02, 2018, 10:16:41 PM »
There are brickies from south Armagh commuting an hr at most each way to the north side of Dublin, with 1500 euro in their arse pocket on a Friday afternoon, maybe more. That would give you a very comfortable lifestyle in the north.

Brickies taking home over €70k per annum so before tax over €100k gross a year??!!

Why would anybody go to college now when they can earn that sort of money. There are plenty of professional people earning nowhere near those sums.

Bricklaying is seasonal work and it's also heavy work. You'd want €1500 if not more, a week. In fact I don't think I'd do it for €1500 a week.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2018, 10:22:16 PM by trailer »

armaghniac

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Re: A United Ireland. Opening up the discussion.
« Reply #2358 on: November 02, 2018, 10:35:10 PM »
Why would anybody go to college now when they can earn that sort of money. There are plenty of professional people earning nowhere near those sums.

Those professional people are probably not working in Dublin.
if at first you don't succeed, then goto Plan B

Tubberman

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Re: A United Ireland. Opening up the discussion.
« Reply #2359 on: November 02, 2018, 11:46:03 PM »
There are brickies from south Armagh commuting an hr at most each way to the north side of Dublin, with 1500 euro in their arse pocket on a Friday afternoon, maybe more. That would give you a very comfortable lifestyle in the north.

Brickies taking home over €70k per annum so before tax over €100k gross a year??!!

Why would anybody go to college now when they can earn that sort of money. There are plenty of professional people earning nowhere near those sums.

Bricklaying is seasonal work and it's also heavy work. You'd want €1500 if not more, a week. In fact I don't think I'd do it for €1500 a week.

well its november now and brickies are still working so the off-season must be fairly short!
"Our greatest glory is not in never falling, but in rising every time we fall."

ardtole

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Re: A United Ireland. Opening up the discussion.
« Reply #2360 on: November 03, 2018, 07:59:48 AM »
Block laying is heavy work, brick laying wouldn't be. Most of the bigger sites would have inside work for the wet days. Some brickies getting 90 cent a brick so 1500 euro would be conservative enough.
Young lads seem to have no interest in getting a trade these days, they all want to go to college. 10 years down the line I wonder what tradesmen will be earning?

armaghniac

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Re: A United Ireland. Opening up the discussion.
« Reply #2361 on: November 03, 2018, 12:56:21 PM »
Block laying is heavy work, brick laying wouldn't be. Most of the bigger sites would have inside work for the wet days. Some brickies getting 90 cent a brick so 1500 euro would be conservative enough.
Young lads seem to have no interest in getting a trade these days, they all want to go to college. 10 years down the line I wonder what tradesmen will be earning?

Routine bricklaying has to be a job for a robot. Then the craftsmen would be left with the unusual jobs for which they would get a premium.
if at first you don't succeed, then goto Plan B

trailer

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Re: A United Ireland. Opening up the discussion.
« Reply #2362 on: November 03, 2018, 01:05:38 PM »
There are brickies from south Armagh commuting an hr at most each way to the north side of Dublin, with 1500 euro in their arse pocket on a Friday afternoon, maybe more. That would give you a very comfortable lifestyle in the north.

Brickies taking home over €70k per annum so before tax over €100k gross a year??!!

Why would anybody go to college now when they can earn that sort of money. There are plenty of professional people earning nowhere near those sums.

Bricklaying is seasonal work and it's also heavy work. You'd want €1500 if not more, a week. In fact I don't think I'd do it for €1500 a week.

well its november now and brickies are still working so the off-season must be fairly short!

Winter is coming.

bennydorano

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Re: A United Ireland. Opening up the discussion.
« Reply #2363 on: November 03, 2018, 02:21:32 PM »
Plenty of days lost to bad weather surely, but to say Bricklaying is seasonal is just plain wrong.

Applesisapples

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Re: A United Ireland. Opening up the discussion.
« Reply #2364 on: November 03, 2018, 04:14:29 PM »
There are brickies from south Armagh commuting an hr at most each way to the north side of Dublin, with 1500 euro in their arse pocket on a Friday afternoon, maybe more. That would give you a very comfortable lifestyle in the north.

Brickies taking home over €70k per annum so before tax over €100k gross a year??!!

Why would anybody go to college now when they can earn that sort of money. There are plenty of professional people earning nowhere near those sums.

Bricklaying is seasonal work and it's also heavy work. You'd want €1500 if not more, a week. In fact I don't think I'd do it for €1500 a week.

well its november now and brickies are still working so the off-season must be fairly short!

Winter is coming, so it is!

seafoid

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Re: A United Ireland. Opening up the discussion.
« Reply #2365 on: December 04, 2018, 06:51:30 AM »
Very interesting article in the IT
 First though an amuse bouche from the DUP

« A senior minister is at risk of being suspended from the House of Commons after Labour and the Democratic Unionist party were allowed to submit an emergency motion accusing the government of holding parliament in contempt for failing to publish the full Brexit legal advice. »

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/north-down-on-brexit-the-dup-threatens-the-union-more-than-sinn-féin-1.3717598?mode=amp

The buffeting of Northern Ireland in the political storm between the pro-Brexit Democratic Unionist Party and UK prime minister Theresa May (whom the DUP keeps in power) over her Brexit plan is stirring unexpected conversations in these parts around nationality, constitutionality and what is right economically.
“The DUP is threatening the union more than anything Sinn Féin can do at the minute,” says Hilary Warnock, a member of the liberal centrist Alliance Party who describes herself as a soft unionist. “I am tired of them speaking for us.”

None of them support the DUP, preferring the local Independent unionist MP Sylvia Hermon. They all back May’s deal and fear that a disorderly Brexit would spell economic catastrophe and bring forward the thorny question of a united Ireland. That, they feel, is a question better asked years, if not decades, from now.
“If the deal that is on the table got through, that would calm that question and people would think that we have got the best of both worlds here and that’s okay,” says Warnock. “If we leave with a no-deal, then I think yes, it is pushing the question of a united Ireland or not.”
She feels “more Irish” than English or British since Brexit, she says.

A no-deal would be calamitous for Northern Ireland to the point where we would probably be better off within Europe within an all Ireland,” says West.
While, he still favours maintaining the union of Northern Ireland with Britain, his mind is “not unchangeable” on the possibility of a united Ireland.
The “pain and suffering” from a no-deal Brexit, he says, could “shift the dial in terms of support for a united Ireland in some sectors” and that this could be enough to swing a majority for reunification.
Brexit has reintroduced identity politics into Northern Ireland two decades after the Belfast Agreement provided an acceptable fudge on the issue. Re-emerging orange-green fault lines mean a returned focus on identity and sovereignty trumps any pressing economic concerns, practical thinking or, for the DUP, even compromise. The party has returned to the “not an inch” mentality it doggedly stuck to in the past.
Ringland believes talk of a united Ireland is premature and that it must come from the ground up over time rather than from politicians. People are not as polarised as politics, he says.
“We have a wee bit of healing to do and a bit of real thinking about relationships in Northern Ireland to undo the damage that the conflict caused and across this island as well,” he says.
Ringland, who sees himself as British-Irish and European, believes to push any sooner for reunification would create “a sense of triumphalism in Irish nationalism matched by the sense of loss in that British tradition” that would set “the project” back socially and economically for generations.

Jeremy Stewart, a north Down teacher and unionist who voted Leave, says if people were sold a united Ireland for long-term, pragmatic social and economic reasons, he thinks people would “start to consider and look at it more reasonably”.

The problem is that the DUP don’t have confidence in the Good Friday Agreement. That is my backstop. Until the people of Northern Ireland change their mind on that, I am confident in the union,” he says.
Warnock believes Northern Ireland can work “as a good unit” and would work even better with May’s Brexit deal, but feels the DUP must be “more open” and change its views on same-sex marriage and abortion.
“If they don’t, then the numbers are going to come into play and there will be a united Ireland, and people won’t be happy because you will end up with this horrendous group of unionists very unhappy,” she says.

Barry believes the Troubles may have robbed some unionists of their ability to acknowledge their Irishness because of its association with Catholicism or armed-force republicanism.
“Since the Good Friday Agreement, there has been a re-embracing of those aspects of Irish identity, and it may be that the passports are symbolic of that,” he says.

He believes that Northern Ireland’s future is in blurring the lines around identity that Brexit has inadvertently redrawn.
“Belfast is as British as Finchley but it is not as English and it is as Irish as Cork but it is not as Irish-Irish,” he says.

Ringland sees sport, along with the all-island structure and diverse make-up of Ireland’s rugby team, something he has first-team experience of, as a template that can help unite people.
“That is where we need to be in Ireland pre-Brexit, not looking at Brexit but just looking at relationships,” he said. “It is a feast of identities that we can have at different times.”
Those biscuits are for the visitors

armaghniac

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Re: A United Ireland. Opening up the discussion.
« Reply #2366 on: December 07, 2018, 12:33:56 AM »
Poll in Times newspaper.

65% of NI support backstop.
If border poll with backstop than 50/50 (actually 48/48 4% don't know)
If Britain leaves the EU with no deal, 55 per cent of people would back a united Ireland, including 11 per cent of unionists, but 42 per cent said they would prefer to stay in the UK, while 3 per cent did not know.
if at first you don't succeed, then goto Plan B

seafoid

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Re: A United Ireland. Opening up the discussion.
« Reply #2367 on: December 07, 2018, 08:08:12 AM »
Poll in Times newspaper.

65% of NI support backstop.
If border poll with backstop than 50/50 (actually 48/48 4% don't know)
If Britain leaves the EU with no deal, 55 per cent of people would back a united Ireland, including 11 per cent of unionists, but 42 per cent said they would prefer to stay in the UK, while 3 per cent did not know.

50/50 but it is very early days

NI could be like the rest of Ireland in 1918 when the Parliamentary party collapsed. Under conditions of extreme chaos political systems break down.

This is what the DUP want

https://democracy.kent.gov.uk/documents/s88112/Item%207%20-%20Brexit.pdf
“A no-deal Brexit could cause major disruption across Kent, with gridlock on the roads around Dover, rubbish not being collected, children unable to take exams and rubbish piling up on streets, a local council report has warned.
The registration service for weddings could also be affected and bodies could pile up in morgues because of traffic gridlock, Kent county council warned in an update on no-deal contingency planning. "

If you tolerate this Ballymena will be next
 
« Last Edit: December 07, 2018, 08:09:44 AM by seafoid »
Those biscuits are for the visitors

playwiththewind1st

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Re: A United Ireland. Opening up the discussion.
« Reply #2368 on: December 07, 2018, 08:20:19 AM »
Is that not a normal day in Ballymena already??