The State Of Gaelic Football

[BennyHarp]

Ban the fcukin thing and put the FOOT back into FOOTball!!!

Maybe we should ban handling the ball altogether and only use the FOOT because it's FOOTball.

[Zulu]

Forward hand-passing is not a problem. You see can some really inventive short passes in attack, many of which are harder to execute correctly than lumping a ball 40 metres up a field in the general area of a FF and hoping he can win a ball 2-to-1. Charts of numbers of hand-passes and the like don't really convey much useful information.

It's when teams are going backwards and backwards with the ball that problems present themselves.

Of course they do, especially when added to what you see with your own eyes. 7 of the top ten happened in the last few months, one game nearly reaching 500, that can't be entirely ignored. I wouldn't however be in favour of any kind of limitation of the hand pass. I'd be more in favour of telling managers to wise up and stop being so f**king cowardly, go out and try to win games by having a go. I guarantee you most teams would do as well playing largely conventionally as they do playing ultra conservatively. There seems to be this idea that there was never more than 6 lads back when teams defended which is nonsense, there was often 10 or more lads in their own half (sure you've 9 in a conventional set up). However, now lads are drifting back before the ball is kicked out or simply sprinting back if the ball is turned over. You don't have to do that to defend effectively but it is the easiest way to defend effectively, the one that needs the least individual skill and coaching. The payoff though is you've few if anyone in attack when you do get the ball back so you have to run and hand pass the ball back up the field. In an era where we have full forwards like James O'Donoghue,  Cillian O'Connor, Colm O'Neill, Brian Hurley, Bernard Brogan, Micheal Murphy, Paddy McBrearty, Jamie Clarke, Ciaran McManus, Colm Cooper etc. I can only hope managers and coaches grow some balls and focus more on maximising the immense talent in we have football rather than stifling it.

[rrhf]

Only allow the handpass in the opposition half ie on the attack.
Kickouts will probably go long. Ball will move quicker and be kicked out of this zone early.  Limits defensive options an gives the forwards a slight advantage.

[muppet]

Only allow the handpass in the opposition half ie on the attack.
Kickouts will probably go long. Ball will move quicker and be kicked out of this zone early.  Limits defensive options an gives the forwards a slight advantage.

Has the Black Card not already done this, leading to an all out retreat by some teams?

I think the more advantages we give to the forward, the more likely some managers will pull back players to help defend. It simply seems to be in the nature of many managers to prefer to lose a game 0-0 0-1 than lose 5-19 5-20.

Until their own supporters boo them off the park every time it happens, it will continue.

[highorlow]

Colm O'Rourke's article in last weekends Sunday Independent is worth a read.

In next weekends edition he is putting forward a 'template for change'. He is also looking for suggestions.

Fair play to Colm on this, at least he is brave enough to publish some suggestions for change.

It should make some interesting reading .

Here is a link to his piece last Sunday...

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/the-more-things-change-the-more-they-stay-the-same-31135174.html

[Syferus]

Colm O'Rourke's article in last weekends Sunday Independent is worth a read.

In next weekends edition he is putting forward a 'template for change'. He is also looking for suggestions.

Fair play to Colm on this, at least he is brave enough to publish some suggestions for change.

It should make some interesting reading .

Here is a link to his piece last Sunday...

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/the-more-things-change-the-more-they-stay-the-same-31135174.html

Brave? Everyone and their mother thinks they know what needs to be fixed and don't mind broadcasting it. The real answer is that there is no perfect solution.

[highorlow]

Everyone and their mother thinks they know what needs to be fixed and don't mind broadcasting it.

I don't recall reading anyone else's template for change?

Can you send me a link to anything you have read, I'd be interested in seeing what other ex players and county managers have had to say on this.

[rrhf]

Only allow the handpass in the opposition half ie on the attack.
Kickouts will probably go long. Ball will move quicker and be kicked out of this zone early.  Limits defensive options an gives the forwards a slight advantage.

Has the Black Card not already done this, leading to an all out retreat by some teams?

I think the more advantages we give to the forward, the more likely some managers will pull back players to help defend. It simply seems to be in the nature of many managers to prefer to lose a game 0-0 0-1 than lose 5-19 5-20.

Until their own supporters boo them off the park every time it happens, it will continue.

Think you misunderstood the point there.  They can pull 15 men back but they will be kicking the ball to each other rather than handpassing and thats dangerous if the other team pushes up on them.  Any team worth its salt will be driving to the half back line and up the fiield as soon as possible so they can get at the bould handpassing again. but it leaves only one half of the pitch for each team to fist pass.   

[INDIANA]

Colm O'Rourke's article in last weekends Sunday Independent is worth a read.

In next weekends edition he is putting forward a 'template for change'. He is also looking for suggestions.

Fair play to Colm on this, at least he is brave enough to publish some suggestions for change.

It should make some interesting reading .

Here is a link to his piece last Sunday...

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/the-more-things-change-the-more-they-stay-the-same-31135174.html

Brave? Everyone and their mother thinks they know what needs to be fixed and don't mind broadcasting it. The real answer is that there is no perfect solution.

Typical gaa answer to everything in my view . See no evil hear none either

[muppet]

Only allow the handpass in the opposition half ie on the attack.
Kickouts will probably go long. Ball will move quicker and be kicked out of this zone early.  Limits defensive options an gives the forwards a slight advantage.

Has the Black Card not already done this, leading to an all out retreat by some teams?

I think the more advantages we give to the forward, the more likely some managers will pull back players to help defend. It simply seems to be in the nature of many managers to prefer to lose a game 0-0 0-1 than lose 5-19 5-20.

Until their own supporters boo them off the park every time it happens, it will continue.

Think you misunderstood the point there.  They can pull 15 men back but they will be kicking the ball to each other rather than handpassing and thats dangerous if the other team pushes up on them.  Any team worth its salt will be driving to the half back line and up the fiield as soon as possible so they can get at the bould handpassing again. but it leaves only one half of the pitch for each team to fist pass.

Ok I see what you mean.

I would be concerned it could lead to a sort of aerial tennis that we see Ireland play in rugby, as in once a team gets pressed near its own line they will simply kick it back to the opposite who will camp at half way. Although your idea of giving the attacking team an advantage of the hand-pass might discourage them from kicking in straight again, as happens now in rugby.

[Whitnail]

It's the over handpassing that has grated me most over the last 5 years. Limit that and managers can't. really design a sturdy enough blanket , ?thats my opinion anyway.

Take the leauge semi's this weekend. I saw all four teams equally handpassing up the field (15-20 passes) then someone takes a shot at the bar. On at least 3 of those occasions I counted  the ball wasn't even kicked at the bar -it was handpassed over it meaning the only kick involved in the entire move was the goalie"s shot kick out. Add the fact that you have fellas taking 6-10 carrying steps going unpunished then it's just  not very inspiring.

If your a foreinger watching this (and sometimes you have to put yourself in the position of an outsider for a balanced view) then sometimes you might even strugle to call it a game or a sport at all.

In the cork /donegal game at least. cork's goals relieved the monotony a bit although there were several goal opportunities from both teams

I counted one goal chance in the Dublin/Monaghan game, a fluffed half chance from a dub half- forward. Thats one goal chance from both teams in 70mins of football.

Look forward to Colm's antidotes cause the handpas handpass handpass kick over the bar is as tough (if not tougher)  to appreciate even than massed defences imo.

I'm not convinced at all that this will just sort itself out anymore.

[BennyHarp]

It's the over handpassing that has grated me most over the last 5 years. Limit that and managers can't. really design a sturdy enough blanket , ?thats my opinion anyway.

Take the leauge semi's this weekend. I saw all four teams equally handpassing up the field (15-20 passes) then someone takes a shot at the bar. On at least 3 of those occasions I counted  the ball wasn't even kicked at the bar -it was handpassed over it meaning the only kick involved in the entire move was the goalie"s shot kick out. Add the fact that you have fellas taking 6-10 carrying steps going unpunished then it's just  not very inspiring.

If your a foreinger watching this (and sometimes you have to put yourself in the position of an outsider for a balanced view) then sometimes you might even strugle to call it a game or a sport at all.

In the cork /donegal game at least. cork's goals relieved the monotony a bit although there were several goal opportunities from both teams

I counted one goal chance in the Dublin/Monaghan game, a fluffed half chance from a dub half- forward. Thats one goal chance from both teams in 70mins of football.

Look forward to Colm's antidotes cause the handpas handpass handpass kick over the bar is as tough (if not tougher)  to appreciate even than massed defences imo.

I'm not convinced at all that this will just sort itself out anymore.

Give me strength! I think we've finally lost the run of ourselves!

[thewobbler]

All told people want to see more high catches, more goals, and more kicking the ball - and they don't give a fiddler's if they ruin the game in pursuit of their ideals.



A summary conclusion to this thread could be something along the lines of "thank the Lord that these people who want to radically change Gaelic football have neither the initiative nor influence to make it happen".

[armaghniac]

All told people want to see more high catches, more goals, and more kicking the ball - and they don't give a fiddler's if they ruin the game in pursuit of their ideals.

I think they believe that they are improving the game. But it isn't easy, if you fiddle with one thing you affect another and simplistic solutions may do more damage than good.

[blewuporstuffed]

All told people want to see more high catches, more goals, and more kicking the ball - and they don't give a fiddler's if they ruin the game in pursuit of their ideals.

I think they believe that they are improving the game. But it isn't easy, if you fiddle with one thing you affect another and simplistic solutions may do more damage than good.

Exactly and the quicker the people who spout this 'ban the hand pass' nonsense realise that the better.
Has anyone stopped to think what a game with NO hand passing would actually look like?