New Catholic Church/ DUP coalition! Is this they way forward?

[T Fearon]

Once again I ask the question,what value personally is it for any cleric to attain high office in the Catholic Church? Money? Ego? I just don't see anything other than devotion to service and an extremely thick skin.Do you think any clergyman ever,in their mid 30s thinks they'll be (or wants to be) a Cardinal?

[Oraisteach]

And, so, Tony, with a sweep of the Pontifical hand, you reduce your opponents' argument to absurd extremes-- the church is responsible for EVERYTHING  and personal responsibility means NOTHING.  Of course, neither is true absolutely, but given that a representative of the church is responsible for the crime and the church itself was complicit in a cover-up, then, of necessity, the church must shoulder the much greater responsibility.

And as for your question in your last post, I'd say Ego is your best bet.

[The Iceman]

Brady was wrong to not report what he was part of and witness to. The Church was wrong in it's cover up of the abuse and it's handling of everything since.
I've said before that Brady was following vows which none of us will ever understand. I can only wrestle with the Marriage vows I have taken and wonder what I would do to follow them, what I would choose over them. I don't know and never will. Those vows are not to be taken lightly. In saying that I'd hope in the same position I would have chosen the right thing over any vows I had to any church.

I don't know if Brady had Cardinal or Pope or any high rank on his mind back then. He doesn't strike me as the type. He isn't charismatic in any way, he isn't dynamic, he isn't really Cardinal material. He has never struck me as a very holy man or someone I would follow like his predecessors. So i don't know about that one...

We're way off the topic of the whole thread though and 40 odd pages lately we've stroked Tony's ego to no end.

Tony does not represent the Church nor do I. But if Tony is the church then I'm ashamed to be a part of it and God help us all

[T Fearon]

We are witnessing the modern day equivalent of all this now with Sinn Fein.The human instinct is to protect an institution's reputation at all costs,deal with things in house etc.

It is of course the wrong option.

Iceman I agree with a lot of what you say,aside from the unnecessary derogatory comments against myself.But I am not the Church (and most certainly neither was the likes of Brendan Smyth) and although I feel Brady was thrust into the post of Cardinal unwillingly I think he was far more devout than the likes of O'Fiaich,who could mix it with the best including Thatcher.

I would point out the opinion of the non Catholic religious correspondent of the Belfast Telegraph,Alf Mc Creary,a man not shy about expressing an honest opinion,who said Brady is a good and decent man who was caught up in an horrendous situation.

[Maguire01]

What does the opinion of one writer in the Belfast Telegraph prove?!

[T Fearon]

A non Catholic religious correspondent of many years standing.His objective opinion on any aspect of religion is surely worthy of respect

[muppet]

What does the opinion of one writer in the Belfast Telegraph prove?!

I decided to look up Alf McCreary's comments on Brady and sure enough Tony is only quoting what suits him.

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/opinion/columnists/alf-mccreary/clearly-cardinal-bradys-time-at-helm-is-almost-up-28746231.html

He is supportive of Brady, to a point, but still makes comments such as the following:

"One of the saddest sights this week has been watching Cardinal Sean Brady trying to defend the indefensible. He is a good man caught up in a public struggle for the soul of the Irish Catholic Church, and he is now well out of his depth."

Tony doesn't mention that McCreary called for his resignation. For most of Brady's critics this is the most galling aspect of the sad episode. I suspect the majority of critics would have accepted his resignation as sufficient. I can't speak for the victims.

[T Fearon]

He resigned or retired when a competent replacement was found.What is it about "He is a good man" that you don't understand.

Do you get off on researching paedophilia in the Catholic Church?

[Mike Sheehy]

What is the biggest threat to gay rights....Catholic fundamentalism or Islamic apologism ?

[T Fearon]

Gays have a plethora of rights,they're not under threat from anyone.Its Christian rights that are abused nowadays.

[ONeill]

Anthony, did ye ever share a hotel/BB room with the wife before you were married? Now, be a Christian and be honest.

[Mike Sheehy]

Gays have a plethora of rights,they're not under threat from anyone.Its Christian rights that are abused nowadays.

wrong answer. Gays have the basic rights they are due as human beings. Someday you will see this Tony.

Stop feeding the beast.

My point is that the church has an opportunity. It has so much scope to reinvent itself in the face of the barbarity that is enveloping the world. People are trying to make sense of the world. The church should help not hinder.

[T Fearon]

The Church cannot alter its beliefs to court popularity.What was sinful in 1950 is sinful still and always will be.Gays have equal rights and will soon have the right to marry,so they're not exactly an oppressed minority,but Christian business owners don't have the right to decline business when doing so conflicts with their beliefs.

[michaelg]

The Church cannot alter its beliefs to court popularity.What was sinful in 1950 is sinful still and always will be.Gays have equal rights and will soon have the right to marry,so they're not exactly an oppressed minority,but Christian business owners don't have the right to decline business when doing so conflicts with their beliefs.

Why have you not answered O'Neills's question above?

[T Fearon]

Do you seriously expect me to answer a crass question like that? I wouldn't even divulge that to a priest much less a bald voyeur from Tyrone