Why is Jim McGuinness such a good manager ?

[Syferus]

The McGees are fairly average footballers. . . how would either of them fared in Keith Higgins' position on Saturday?? They'd have been off before half time. The system means that the forwards they are marking have no space and when they get the ball the McGee's can just pummel them until they overcarry or drop the ball.

They are highly effective at what they do but they are limited footballers.

FFS must be a lot of very average footballers about so, if Higgins is the benchmark. 

How many footballers in the country can man-mark like Higgins?

Lacey could, before switching to centre back. Not many others.

I wouldn't swap Neil McGee for any other full back.

The day of the individual man-marker is gone and has been replaced by 'the defensive system' and there were NO  average footballers playing in the AI semi's last weekend.  Jim McG has organised a bunch of player to produce a 'professional performance' rotating from defence to attack in about 8 secs to create goal and point scoring opportunies.  The Final will be fascinating and I doubt if the 'referee' will be as easy on Kerry as C O'R was in their game against Mayo.  Donegal should shade it with their mental intensity frustrating Kerry's only attacking option of playing direct diagonal ball into Donaghy and O'Donaghue.  They also have to eliminate the 'hard work' of the tireless Donagha Walsh.  That said Ryan McHugh will also have to be man - marked who does Mike Sheehy think will do that job for the Kingdom - I think he has been outstanding this year.  Will be a fantastic conest.

Kerry will be well prepared and are far better setup then us. They'll not fear them and in 2012 only for a lucky goal Kerry probably would have beaten them.

To beat Donegal you need to shut down their runners from the back - Mc Glynn being one, Lacey the other and Magee likes the old charge too.

I liken to what Tyrone used to do with Ricey and a few others. step across them , run across their line etc but whatever you do the points these lads get and runs they make are game changers. We were desperately naive on that score. I suspect the likes of Donncha Walsh, Maher and Johnny Buckley will be a hell of a lot effective in stopping them then we ever were.

Ya wha?

Donegal completely dismantled Kerry tactically and physically in that game. It was Kerry's ineffectual shot in anger at the end (a goal) that gave the scoreline an unrealistically tight gloss. Kerry looked a sad sight in that game and as Donegal begun to realise they had nothing to fear they grew in confidence as the game developed. And that Kerry team was better than this year's version.

It's advantage Donegal, Kerry's game-plan now is basically Donegal lite with less talented players. Still could be a classic, mind.

[INDIANA]

The McGees are fairly average footballers. . . how would either of them fared in Keith Higgins' position on Saturday?? They'd have been off before half time. The system means that the forwards they are marking have no space and when they get the ball the McGee's can just pummel them until they overcarry or drop the ball.

They are highly effective at what they do but they are limited footballers.

FFS must be a lot of very average footballers about so, if Higgins is the benchmark. 

How many footballers in the country can man-mark like Higgins?

Lacey could, before switching to centre back. Not many others.

I wouldn't swap Neil McGee for any other full back.

The day of the individual man-marker is gone and has been replaced by 'the defensive system' and there were NO  average footballers playing in the AI semi's last weekend.  Jim McG has organised a bunch of player to produce a 'professional performance' rotating from defence to attack in about 8 secs to create goal and point scoring opportunies.  The Final will be fascinating and I doubt if the 'referee' will be as easy on Kerry as C O'R was in their game against Mayo.  Donegal should shade it with their mental intensity frustrating Kerry's only attacking option of playing direct diagonal ball into Donaghy and O'Donaghue.  They also have to eliminate the 'hard work' of the tireless Donagha Walsh.  That said Ryan McHugh will also have to be man - marked who does Mike Sheehy think will do that job for the Kingdom - I think he has been outstanding this year.  Will be a fantastic conest.

Kerry will be well prepared and are far better setup then us. They'll not fear them and in 2012 only for a lucky goal Kerry probably would have beaten them.

To beat Donegal you need to shut down their runners from the back - Mc Glynn being one, Lacey the other and Magee likes the old charge too.

I liken to what Tyrone used to do with Ricey and a few others. step across them , run across their line etc but whatever you do the points these lads get and runs they make are game changers. We were desperately naive on that score. I suspect the likes of Donncha Walsh, Maher and Johnny Buckley will be a hell of a lot effective in stopping them then we ever were.

Ya wha?

Donegal completely dismantled Kerry tactically and physically in that game. It was Kerry's ineffectual shot in anger at the end (a goal) that gave the scoreline an unrealistically tight gloss. Kerry looked a sad sight in that game and as Donegal begun to realise they had to fear they grew in confidence as the game developed.

It's advantage Donegal, Kerry's game-plan now is basically Donegal lite with less talented players. Still could be a classic, mind.

It funny how these less talented players are in an AI Final. I wouldn't mind having a few of them.

If you think a Kerryman is going to be cacking it playing a Donegal man in the final you're sadly mistaken regardless of whatever yerras come out of them.

Its too close to call IMO. Killian Young is a huge addition for the Kerry defence. Donaghy gives them the perfect outlet.

[yellowcard]

I don't think anyone is suggesting that Kerry will have an inferiority complex playing Donegal in the final, in fact that would be laughable. However the old chestnut of struggling against northern teams will be resurfaced in the build up to this game. In terms of talent I don't think there is much to choose between the 2 sides and I'd expect it to be a very close encounter. Two very good managers who put a big emphasis on their tactical approach, this game could be won and lost on the line.

[Syferus]

They didn't have to play Donegal to get there, if they did they might well not be there.

David Moran is the obvious revelation for Kerry. A key position that looked quite pedestrian heading into the AISFs is suddenly a strength. If Kerry don't get the dominance in the middle they did against Mayo they will be in a lot of trouble against Donegal.

It has nothing to do with cracking either, Donegal are just the sort of team Kerry have had trouble dealing with even when they had teams littered with all-time greats. Ironically Donegal had a lot of trouble with another 'Donegal lite' in Armagh in the AIQF and Kerry have better players than Armagh do.

It's going to be a fascinating final. Both teams playing to their best would mean Donegal win - Murphy is everything Donaghy is and so much more, the Donegal FB line match up very well with Donaghy, Kerry's doesn't match up well at all with Murphy - but football is never that simple.

[INDIANA]

They didn't have to play Donegal to get there, if they did they might well not be there.

David Moran is the obvious revelation for Kerry. A key position that looked quite pedestrian heading into the AISFs is suddenly a strength. If Kerry don't get the dominance in the middle they did against Mayo they will be in a lot of trouble against Donegal.

It has nothing to do with cracking either, Donegal are just the sort of team Kerry have had trouble dealing with even when they had teams littered with all-time greats. Ironically Donegal had a lot of trouble with another 'Donegal lite' in Armagh in the AIQF and Kerry have better players than Armagh do.

It's going to be a fascinating final. Both teams playing to their best would mean Donegal win - Murphy is everything Donaghy is and so much more, the Donegal FB line match up very well with Donaghy, Kerry's doesn't match up well with Murphy - but football is never that simple.

You're in nostalgic mode. This isn't a Kerry team littered with stars its the sum of the parts that make this Kerry team.

Which makes them the perfect final opponents for Donegal. No flash, just graft. Donegal will be favourites and they'll struggle to reproduce yesterday.

Kerry are very like Kerry in 2009 IMO- they've found their team as the championship has progressed and are improving with each game.

Dangerous in my view. Donegal will need a repeat of yesterday to win.

[Syferus]

They didn't have to play Donegal to get there, if they did they might well not be there.

David Moran is the obvious revelation for Kerry. A key position that looked quite pedestrian heading into the AISFs is suddenly a strength. If Kerry don't get the dominance in the middle they did against Mayo they will be in a lot of trouble against Donegal.

It has nothing to do with cracking either, Donegal are just the sort of team Kerry have had trouble dealing with even when they had teams littered with all-time greats. Ironically Donegal had a lot of trouble with another 'Donegal lite' in Armagh in the AIQF and Kerry have better players than Armagh do.

It's going to be a fascinating final. Both teams playing to their best would mean Donegal win - Murphy is everything Donaghy is and so much more, the Donegal FB line match up very well with Donaghy, Kerry's doesn't match up well with Murphy - but football is never that simple.

You're in nostalgic mode. This isn't a Kerry team littered with stars its the sum of the parts that make this Kerry team.

Which makes them the perfect final opponents for Donegal. No flash, just graft. Donegal will be favourites and they'll struggle to reproduce yesterday.

Kerry are very like Kerry in 2009 IMO- they've found their team as the championship has progressed and are improving with each game.

Dangerous in my view. Donegal will need a repeat of yesterday to win.

A repeat of Sunday's performance would absolutely crush Kerry. They don't need a repeat that to beat a cagey Kerry team, to be honest. Just need to beat what's in front of them and that's a defensive team with a good work-rate and a bit if a shoddy FB line.

Kerry are obviously much more Donegal than old school Kerry these days so in many ways they're going to end up playing Donegal at the game they patented. That's never a good start. I'd fancy Donegal to hold out Kerry if they get a lead, I'm less sure Kerry could produce the sort of shut-down game Donegal can if they get in front.

I also don't see either team going in as serious favourites - it'll be near enough even, particularly with Kerry's tradition tempering anyone who fancies Donegal.

[BluestackBoy]

McGuinness's success is also due to his somewhat idiosyncratic & old fashioned view of the world.

He sees everything in black & white, you are either with us or against us, in or out & anyone who threatens the edifice he has built is discarded. Alex Ferguson did the same thin at Man Utd & I'd say Jim has learned a lot from his way of doing things.

But what seperates him is that he is the living embodiment of his principles. Words like honesty, effort, belief, trust, commitment are more than just words to him. His commitment is total, his confidence unwavering & he transmits this to everyone in his sphere.

He isn't perfect, no one is but there aren't many like him & we are lucky to have him

[SouthDublinBro]

You're in nostalgic mode. This isn't a Kerry team littered with stars its the sum of the parts that make this Kerry team.

Which makes them the perfect final opponents for Donegal. No flash, just graft. Donegal will be favourites and they'll struggle to reproduce yesterday.

Kerry are very like Kerry in 2009 IMO- they've found their team as the championship has progressed and are improving with each game.

Dangerous in my view. Donegal will need a repeat of yesterday to win.

I agree with this. Donegal would have been well up for another crack at Mayo and I think would have beat them well. Kerry will hopefully have too much for them though. They certainly won't panic like we did towards the end of yesterday's game.

[BluestackBoy]

You're in nostalgic mode. This isn't a Kerry team littered with stars its the sum of the parts that make this Kerry team.

Which makes them the perfect final opponents for Donegal. No flash, just graft. Donegal will be favourites and they'll struggle to reproduce yesterday.

Kerry are very like Kerry in 2009 IMO- they've found their team as the championship has progressed and are improving with each game.

Dangerous in my view. Donegal will need a repeat of yesterday to win.

I don't agree that we are likely to see a repeat performance of yesterday from Donegal in the final.

Donegal played the way they did yesterday because they were playing Dublin, Kerry are a different animal altogether with a different more traditional style & Donegal will adapt their approach to cope with the new challenge.

One idea would be to just put six men round Donaghy but I'd say McGuinness will be a bit more subtle than that!!

[thebandit]

Very good post Wobbler. Agree with all of it. I believe that our win in 2008 contained a lot of those elements. After an apparent season ending defeat in Newry something clicked amongst the group. A cathartic moment where the whole team went 100% after Sam. The team became greater than the sum of it's parts and players who were on the fringes (Penrose, T Mc Guigan, McCullagh etc) dragged us home. IMO, the whole beard thing, whilst appearing silly, served a purpose in not only uniting the team but the county as a whole.

A whole county embraced their ugliness for the greater good

[Croí na hÉireann]

I thought the same. I'm not sure I've seen a lot of tactical flexibility. If Donegal control the tempo, turn you over and counter in waves, they beat you. If you control the tempo on them, you have a chance.

Donegal getting tighter on the in form Dublin players, Flynn and Connolly was key. After the first 25 minutes we saw nothing from the pair of them again apart from a wonder point from Connolly in the second half. Would have loved to be there yesterday to see it first hand.

Specsavers I suggest. You didn't watch the game too much. They never really got to grips with them. Connolly had four players marking him in the second half.

Never really got to grips with them? Can you outline their contributions in the second half then apart from the wonder Connolly point?

[Mikhailov]

The McGees are fairly average footballers. . . how would either of them fared in Keith Higgins' position on Saturday?? They'd have been off before half time. The system means that the forwards they are marking have no space and when they get the ball the McGee's can just pummel them until they overcarry or drop the ball.

They are highly effective at what they do but they are limited footballers.

Screenexile - you must have been quite a player or maybe still are but to suggest that the McGees are average is crazy. How did the much vaunted Dublin inside line get on against them over the 70 mins (not 15 or 20). I seem to recall them snuffing out various inside forwards of reputation over the last 4 years from inside Ulster and beyond. Yes, of course they have a system in pace in front of them allowing them a luxury but how many times are they beat to the ball, how many times are they dummied, how many times are they beat in the air.
I remember from Sunday 1 time in 2nd half, O gara was 5 yards in front of one of them but still didn't win the ball - I think it was Eamon got the hand in at the vital time and some other team mate picked up the loose ball - that is their job. Man markers don't necessarily have to be on the ball - their job is to deny the forward the ball ( like your fellow county men of yesteryear McKeever and Scullion). In addition to this McGee was involved deep into Dublin territory for the 2nd Donegal goal and displayed composure to wait until the right time to pass the ball to the supporting Thompson.
I think they are both great footballers who sacrifice a lot for the team good - I believe they are actually better players than they appear due to their marking roles but could also play elsewhere on the team but they are the best at what they do so are prepared to play for that role for the 'greater team benefit'.
By the way, I am not from the Hills so no bias involved here just my honest opinion which maybe right or wrong

[Mike Sheehy]

Clearly Celtic were impressed with him back in July so his stock must have risen even further now. I wonder how much of his experience/connections/resources  in the professional game is he able to leverage for Donegal.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/celtic-boss-ronnie-deila-well-be-using-jim-mcguinness-more-and-more-30412688.html

New Celtic manager Ronnie Deila is planning to increase the Donegal manager's influence and is determined to get inside the heads of the players."We already have a sports psychologist in Jim McGuinnes, so I want to bring him in even more," Deila told the Daily Record."All my staff's knowledge is going to be used, I can't do it all."Of course, I learn a lot because I hire fantastic people around me but I want all my staff to be a specialist in something and then you need to be even better."I want the best scientists in the world. They have to have experience and learn but I also have to go out to seek new knowledge, look at what's happening on the internet, go away on trips to see what the best are doing because then I will bring it back. In the end we will grow as a staff in our knowledge and the players will adapt."I'm very curious. Someone asked me if I have a lot of energy on the pitch but I get energy from learning and I think. I'm going to try to be a very good role model."Deila plans to utilise all the backroom staff at his disposal to get the best from his players."There are more people here but every role we have I also had at my former club," he added."I used a lot of money on my staff because if you have a player but you can't develop him it's no use."So your staff must get the end product, they have to have the knowledge in every way."Someone on psychology, mental training, someone on finishing, somebody on recovery and everything about injury prevention."It's like a library and you need all the books and the players need to take the books they need. The players have to be curious, they have to want to learn, they have to want to get better."

[screenexile]

The McGees are fairly average footballers. . . how would either of them fared in Keith Higgins' position on Saturday?? They'd have been off before half time. The system means that the forwards they are marking have no space and when they get the ball the McGee's can just pummel them until they overcarry or drop the ball.

They are highly effective at what they do but they are limited footballers.

Screenexile - you must have been quite a player or maybe still are but to suggest that the McGees are average is crazy. How did the much vaunted Dublin inside line get on against them over the 70 mins (not 15 or 20). I seem to recall them snuffing out various inside forwards of reputation over the last 4 years from inside Ulster and beyond. Yes, of course they have a system in pace in front of them allowing them a luxury but how many times are they beat to the ball, how many times are they dummied, how many times are they beat in the air.
I remember from Sunday 1 time in 2nd half, O gara was 5 yards in front of one of them but still didn't win the ball - I think it was Eamon got the hand in at the vital time and some other team mate picked up the loose ball - that is their job. Man markers don't necessarily have to be on the ball - their job is to deny the forward the ball ( like your fellow county men of yesteryear McKeever and Scullion). In addition to this McGee was involved deep into Dublin territory for the 2nd Donegal goal and displayed composure to wait until the right time to pass the ball to the supporting Thompson.
I think they are both great footballers who sacrifice a lot for the team good - I believe they are actually better players than they appear due to their marking roles but could also play elsewhere on the team but they are the best at what they do so are prepared to play for that role for the 'greater team benefit'.
By the way, I am not from the Hills so no bias involved here just my honest opinion which maybe right or wrong

Ah here all I'm saying is that in if it were old school football man on man they wouldn't be as lauded as they are. Don't get me wrong what they've achieved is fantastic and I don't doubt they're in serious physical shape but the point remains the system Donegal have in place means they have a lot more protection than a McKeever\Scullion\Matt Gallagher would have had in their time.

They'll still have 2 All Irelands though I think so fair play to them.

[Dont Matter]