Why is Jim McGuinness such a good manager ?

[Dinny Breen]

I thought the same. I'm not sure I've seen a lot of tactical flexibility. If Donegal control the tempo, turn you over and counter in waves, they beat you. If you control the tempo on them, you have a chance.

But do you not think the introduction of Christy Toye and when he made the change 10 mins before half-time, affected the flow (tempo) of the game?

[seafoid]

Population at the last census:

Mayo 130,638

Kerry 145,502.

Donegal 161,137.

Dublin 1,270,603


and ...

"Talent is over-rated, I would have always stressed that from a young age,"

"Hard work will always beat talent.

"Some lads just haven't been able to put it in, for millions of different reasons. A lot of the guys who I grew up with were superstars when they were 18 but are nowhere to be seen now.

"Sometimes it's the luck of the break, sometimes it's attitude. I always had the highest expectations for myself and you always should. I always backed myself in everything I did. It's not a cockiness. It's just a sort of a self belief thing."

I don't think so. Talent can get away with a lot of stuff. 

[AZOffaly]

Maybe, but that's just a substitution, rather than tactical flexibility. I'm not slagging him off by the way, Im very impressed with what they've managed to do this year, but I don't think it's through tactical variations, I think it's through collective imposition if their will on other teams.

[Dinny Breen]

Just a substitution? I thought it was very clever, Toye upped the intensity at a time when Donegal had just weathered the storm, championship minutes are those minutes before and after half-time and it really put the doubts in Dublin's minds before half-time.

[AZOffaly]

Sorry, I phrased that wrong. In my mind, a like for like substitution is one way of changing the game, but to be tactically flexible implies you have a few different approaches up your sleeve and can adapt the gameplan as required. I'm not sure I've seen that from Donegal. Of course the art of making good substitutions is important too.

[INDIANA]

Maybe, but that's just a substitution, rather than tactical flexibility. I'm not slagging him off by the way, Im very impressed with what they've managed to do this year, but I don't think it's through tactical variations, I think it's through collective imposition if their will on other teams.

Id agree . I've always maintained if you're behind against them with 20 mins to go you will lose.

They have 7/8 outstanding footballers but 3-4 very average ones as well but the system is so well drilled they always have a reference point for what they should be doing when the shit hits the fan.

Dublin had none of that yesterday. Empowering players is fine provided they can be trusted to make the right calls on the pitch. Ours made a lot of bad choices and consequently it fell apart as a result.

[Dinny Breen]

My point is that he has the ability to make these changes and the switch is not like for like but a more subtle change , such as how he deploys Murphy at different times during a game.

[seafoid]

Maybe, but that's just a substitution, rather than tactical flexibility. I'm not slagging him off by the way, Im very impressed with what they've managed to do this year, but I don't think it's through tactical variations, I think it's through collective imposition if their will on other teams.

Id agree . I've always maintained if you're behind against them with 20 mins to go you will lose.

They have 7/8 outstanding footballers but 3-4 very average ones as well but the system is so well drilled they always have a reference point for what they should be doing when the shit hits the fan.

Dublin had none of that yesterday. Empowering players is fine provided they can be trusted to make the right calls on the pitch. Ours made a lot of bad choices and consequently it fell apart as a result.

Indiana

Did you think 2 back to back all Irelands was realistic for the dubs ? Or was the result expected? 

[screenexile]

I thought the tactic Donegal employed on their own kickouts in the 2nd half was a masterstroke. They bunched the whole shebang just in Donegal's half (Except for maybe the 2 lads up front) and then Durcan bombed it over them all for Gallagher to run forward and flick it on to 2 or 3 runners (Usually McHugh) who then had acres to run into... they had more than just the 3 goal chances yesterday and this gave them the platform to do it.

McGuinness gambled that Dublin would go man to man with all his players and took advantage of it when it happened  making the Dubs HB line vacate their roles. It didn't happen so much in the first half so I wonder was this something they had a plan for but then executed in the 2nd half??

Fascinating game that was yesterday!!

[The Hill is Blue]

Did you think 2 back to back all Irelands was realistic for the dubs ? Or was the result expected?

Of course back to back All Irelands was a realistic possibility for the Dubs. Had two of their three first-half goaling chances been taken (as they were against Monaghan) we could be discussing a different result today. One result (no matter how dramatic or traumatic) doesn't transform a great team (which this Dublin team is) into anything less than that.

Come on you boys in blue.

[imtommygunn]

The turning point in the game yesterday in my view was toye coming on. Toye's first run saw him attack mccarthy and run directly at dublin. They were opened right up straight away and this paved the way. I wonder did mcguinness intentionally put him on for this after seeing the game unfold?

Donegal last year were a tired team. The effort they put in to get to the fitness levels they have is immense. THey have a smaller top quality playing pool than dublin and probably mayo too so this hurts them more.

The collective awareness thing i think is key. The tyrone teams of the noughties that won had an understanding that to me was rarely if ever seen before. Lots of games in qualifiers helped this i think in 05 and 08.

[yellowcard]

If Donegal manage to win the All Ireland for me there is no question that McGuinness is the best GAA football manager of all time. That may sound ott to some but its all weighed against the quality of players he had at his disposal. Other multiple AI winning managers like O'Dwyer, Harte, Boylan and O'Connor had way more talented individual players and what McGuinness has achieved is remarkable. To win it once was a brilliant achievement but to regain the title would be the icing on the cake. However I believe that Kerry will present a very stiff test for Donegal. Donegal struggled most against Armagh and a defensive system. Kerry play a similar way under Fitzmaurice and Donegal will not be able to counter attack with the same devastation as they did yesterday.

The 2 semi finals were so enthralling because of the contrast in styles between the 2 teams in each match. It was noticeable that the 2 defensive teams won the day, however no such contrast will exist in the final and I will not be expecting a classic.

[bcarrier]

Back to OP...

was it the time he spent in Tralee

http://www.donegaldemocrat.ie/sport/soccer/kerry-gold-inspired-mcguinness-1-4114709

[J70]

The turning point in the game yesterday in my view was toye coming on. Toye's first run saw him attack mccarthy and run directly at dublin. They were opened right up straight away and this paved the way. I wonder did mcguinness intentionally put him on for this after seeing the game unfold?

Donegal last year were a tired team. The effort they put in to get to the fitness levels they have is immense. THey have a smaller top quality playing pool than dublin and probably mayo too so this hurts them more.

The collective awareness thing i think is key. The tyrone teams of the noughties that won had an understanding that to me was rarely if ever seen before. Lots of games in qualifiers helped this i think in 05 and 08.

Of course it was intentional (which is not to say it was guaranteed to work, but what substitutions are?) That running and ball carrying has always been Toye's primary strength from when he announced himself in a minor game against Fermanagh in the early 2000s. Plus, David Walsh was having little impact on the game, which was not too surprising as he has not featured very much this season and is a much smaller man than Toye. I'd say the plan was to make the switch later in the game, but circumstances dictated otherwise.

[Walter Cronc]

Its the bottles of football special they drink in the hills.