Can 134,849 people be wrong ?

[Zulu]

Was that promised? You might need to show me where any poster promised free flowing football in every game due to the black card.

[BennyHarp]

Was that promised? You might need to show me where any poster promised free flowing football in every game due to the black card.

Ok, I must have imagined a few posters nearly creaming themselves after a few league games. I can't be arsed looking through the posts but I'll take your word for it that nobody thought the black card would create a faster free flowing game. I realise now, you have put me straight, that the black card was just to eliminate cynical play. So job done I suppose, the championship is cynical foul free zone (though someone would need to tell the Ulster Championship) but unfortunately has had no discernible impact on the quality of football. I can't wait until the FRC try to tackle improving the quality of football now they have sorted cynicism.

[Zulu]

Fair enough Benny, you can't support your own argument. What is your point?

[BennyHarp]

Fair enough Benny, you can't support your own argument. What is your point?

My point is that we have introduced a new rule which has served no real purpose other than to increase controversy, make life more difficult for refs and create a situation where players like Darren McCurry and Ciaran McManus get sent off in big games for the most innocuous of tackles. If we had seen an improvement in the quality of football then maybe it would be worth it but we have barely seen a decent game so far in this championship.

[Zulu]

So the black card is the reason we've had a poor championship?

The black card has had a positive effect insofar as it's largely eliminated off the ball blocking and dragging down players outside of scoring zones. That's a good thing for the game. However, it has been as poor a championship as I can remember and it appears teams are increasingly going down the packed defence route which is making for a very poor spectacle. I'm not sure what you can do about that but something radical might be needed as kicking the ball is becoming a rare sight.

[BennyHarp]

So the black card is the reason we've had a poor championship?

The black card has had a positive effect insofar as it's largely eliminated off the ball blocking and dragging down players outside of scoring zones. That's a good thing for the game. However, it has been as poor a championship as I can remember and it appears teams are increasingly going down the packed defence route which is making for a very poor spectacle. I'm not sure what you can do about that but something radical might be needed as kicking the ball is becoming a rare sight.

It's not the sole reason, I agree, but it definitely hasn't helped the quality of football. After the league people were comparing scoring stats etc and suggesting it was due to the black card and lauding how the positive impact it had on the matches. I think the evidence so far suggests it's had no impact on the quality of the play and has in fact created more controversy and frustration amongst fans and players. People do still get dragged down etc, it's just a pure lottery as to what happens to them, see for example the Brian Fox tackle yesterday in the Tipp v Galway game. Football is going through a phase of defensive football and will come through it as tactics develop and managers work it out. I don't think we needed to meddle with it.

[Zulu]

Can't agree Benny. Of course people still get dragged down but not as much as they used to and there are few if any blatant pull downs when a team is coming out of it's own defence. The black card has largely been a success IMO it has helped the game and despite some referee mistakes it hasn't negatively impacted on any teams.

Can't agree that football is going through a defensive phase either, unless you regard 14 years a phase! Cork, a division 1 team, played 2 sweepers against Sligo and Galway had 14 men in their own 45 for the last 10 minutes against Tipp, a division 4 side. Cork will play 2 sweepers against Mayo, Galway will play likewise against Kerry and Monaghan, Kildare and Donegal will play everyone in defence should they meet Dublin. We played an U12 team in the ABC's who had a sweeper and they were one of the strongest teams in it - madness.

[Corner Forward]

So the black card is the reason we've had a poor championship?

The black card has had a positive effect insofar as it's largely eliminated off the ball blocking and dragging down players outside of scoring zones. That's a good thing for the game. However, it has been as poor a championship as I can remember and it appears teams are increasingly going down the packed defence route which is making for a very poor spectacle. I'm not sure what you can do about that but something radical might be needed as kicking the ball is becoming a rare sight.

It's not the sole reason, I agree, but it definitely hasn't helped the quality of football. After the league people were comparing scoring stats etc and suggesting it was due to the black card and lauding how the positive impact it had on the matches. I think the evidence so far suggests it's had no impact on the quality of the play and has in fact created more controversy and frustration amongst fans and players. People do still get dragged down etc, it's just a pure lottery as to what happens to them, see for example the Brian Fox tackle yesterday in the Tipp v Galway game. Football is going through a phase of defensive football and will come through it as tactics develop and managers work it out. I don't think we needed to meddle with it.

Cant think of too many overly controversial black cards to date, Brian fox tackle should have been a black card and the ref got that wrong however he later applied the rule correctly when he issued a black card to the Tipp midfielder when he pulled the leg of the galway player-ref made a mistake hardly makes the whole thing a lottery. take the last 15/20 mins of that game and the way tipp were able to attack for goals, last year that wouldn't have been possible as galway would have dragged them down around the 45 and conceded a free. The last 10 mins or so of the AI final last year was effectively Dublin running around fouling mayo players and eating up the time. think it has had a positive effect but to improve the quality need teams to commit more to attack rather than packing the defence with 13 odd players 

[BennyHarp]

So the black card is the reason we've had a poor championship?

The black card has had a positive effect insofar as it's largely eliminated off the ball blocking and dragging down players outside of scoring zones. That's a good thing for the game. However, it has been as poor a championship as I can remember and it appears teams are increasingly going down the packed defence route which is making for a very poor spectacle. I'm not sure what you can do about that but something radical might be needed as kicking the ball is becoming a rare sight.

It's not the sole reason, I agree, but it definitely hasn't helped the quality of football. After the league people were comparing scoring stats etc and suggesting it was due to the black card and lauding how the positive impact it had on the matches. I think the evidence so far suggests it's had no impact on the quality of the play and has in fact created more controversy and frustration amongst fans and players. People do still get dragged down etc, it's just a pure lottery as to what happens to them, see for example the Brian Fox tackle yesterday in the Tipp v Galway game. Football is going through a phase of defensive football and will come through it as tactics develop and managers work it out. I don't think we needed to meddle with it.

Cant think of too many overly controversial black cards to date, Brian fox tackle should have been a black card and the ref got that wrong however he later applied the rule correctly when he issued a black card to the Tipp midfielder when he pulled the leg of the galway player-ref made a mistake hardly makes the whole thing a lottery. take the last 15/20 mins of that game and the way tipp were able to attack for goals, last year that wouldn't have been possible as galway would have dragged them down around the 45 and conceded a free. The last 10 mins or so of the AI final last year was effectively Dublin running around fouling mayo players and eating up the time. think it has had a positive effect but to improve the quality need teams to commit more to attack rather than packing the defence with 13 odd players 

Really? You can't think of any controversial black card decisions? The bit in bold is exactly the main problem.

[Corner Forward]

So the black card is the reason we've had a poor championship?

The black card has had a positive effect insofar as it's largely eliminated off the ball blocking and dragging down players outside of scoring zones. That's a good thing for the game. However, it has been as poor a championship as I can remember and it appears teams are increasingly going down the packed defence route which is making for a very poor spectacle. I'm not sure what you can do about that but something radical might be needed as kicking the ball is becoming a rare sight.

It's not the sole reason, I agree, but it definitely hasn't helped the quality of football. After the league people were comparing scoring stats etc and suggesting it was due to the black card and lauding how the positive impact it had on the matches. I think the evidence so far suggests it's had no impact on the quality of the play and has in fact created more controversy and frustration amongst fans and players. People do still get dragged down etc, it's just a pure lottery as to what happens to them, see for example the Brian Fox tackle yesterday in the Tipp v Galway game. Football is going through a phase of defensive football and will come through it as tactics develop and managers work it out. I don't think we needed to meddle with it.

Cant think of too many overly controversial black cards to date, Brian fox tackle should have been a black card and the ref got that wrong however he later applied the rule correctly when he issued a black card to the Tipp midfielder when he pulled the leg of the galway player-ref made a mistake hardly makes the whole thing a lottery. take the last 15/20 mins of that game and the way tipp were able to attack for goals, last year that wouldn't have been possible as galway would have dragged them down around the 45 and conceded a free. The last 10 mins or so of the AI final last year was effectively Dublin running around fouling mayo players and eating up the time. think it has had a positive effect but to improve the quality need teams to commit more to attack rather than packing the defence with 13 odd players 

Really? You can't think of any controversial black card decisions? The bit in bold is exactly the main problem.

i can think of a couple that are debatable but none that as i said are overly controversial. Ref got one right and one wrong yesterday, his error had no impact on the outcome of the game-dont see the overall problem with it. As i said without the black card tipp would have been pulled and dragged down all over the field once galway built up a lead-made the last 20mins or so worth watching.

[rosnarun]

most contoversial black card incidents in the championship are the one the refs haven't taken. like the advantage rule it is ignored and wrongly used 90% of the Time. i think back Britterly to my agreement to Aidain o shea  was right to be black carded on day one of the League, If they had followed that precident most games would end up 5  a side.
some on is going to feel might peeved when a week before the all Ireland Blind Pat Mcenany intructs the ref to obey the letter of the law and  a player is sidelined after 10 mins of the final

[samwin08]

All forecasts are for attendances well  down at qualifiers and 1/4 final games this August Bank Holiday, yet we have several so called exponents of  Gaelic Football playing--Kerry, Galway,, Mayo, Cork, Meath , Kildare.
Can anyone explain this low interest,  Sky maybe or  Perhaps all are awaiting Donegal and Dublin next week end to see "real football" Or perhaps the games are just too expensive for the ordinary football fan. Has GAA lost touch with ordinary  GAA fans?

[armaghniac]

Many of these places are quite far from Dublin, and even in this day and age this involves a journey to get there and more expenditure on fuel etc than the tickets for the games will cost. Perhaps the GAA should charge more to tickets but throw in a free bus from every club in the county concerned, then the cost would be the same for everyone.

But the main problem is that these games might not be competitive, and certainly do not involve big close rivalries.

[Zulu]

Please define what real football is?

[Maguire01]

Many of these places are quite far from Dublin, and even in this day and age this involves a journey to get there and more expenditure on fuel etc than the tickets for the games will cost. Perhaps the GAA should charge more to tickets but throw in a free bus from every club in the county concerned, then the cost would be the same for everyone.

But the main problem is that these games might not be competitive, and certainly do not involve big close rivalries.

Forget charging more for tickets - charge less! The logistics of running busses would be madness, and I wouldn't consider it the role of the GAA centrally.

And I'd expect most if not all games this weekend to be competitive, so the idea that that's the main problem is a nonsense.