Playing at home for the rest of the Season (year)!

[lynchbhoy]

All players want to play in croke park!
From underage to adult - hurling, football, camogie and ladies football!

Sure ever soccer and rugby would still want tobplaybthere ( for extra revenue!)

Any team that wants success , has to play in croker as that's where the semis and finals are played!
In past few decades Dublin have rarely been the opposition!

Sports people are competitive so want to play there!

Money wasn't the factor behind kilkenny's dominance in hurling !!
Time, coaching and focus were the factors - same as dublins rising - ya can't buy players!

Who said nobody wants to play there?

What decade have Dublin Rarely been the opposition for Semis and Finals?

Just because Kilkennys had success has does this mean that Money will not buy you success?

My point is that everyone wants to play there.
Ask any Kildare, Meath, Galway, limerick or ulster lad would they prefer to play in their home venue or croker and I'd expect the majority would prefer croker.
Many reasons for that- over riding any potential home adv they might get.

80's, 90's Meath were the team so Dublin rarely got out of Leinster.

Since the qualifiers Dublin have fared better but was it 3 or 4 all Ireland's in 30 years I think- hardly domination in football.
In quarter finals , semi finals final etc only one team could possibly meet Dublin- so yes, Dublin are rarely the opposition for all teams!!!

Money hasn't bought success for all the teams winning Sam or Liam over the past few decades- so why so Dublin ( or is it people want to pick on them).
I'm not a dub , but fair is fair for fecks sake!!

Dublin won Leinster titles 1983, 1984, 1985, 1989, 1992, 1993, 1994, 1995,  Rare?

Dublin in AI finals 83, 84, 85, 92, 94, 95 Rare?

As for the horse sh!t that because a team are really want to play in Croker or Really want to beat the Dubs is enough to beat them. Well you are very naive. If you think a Team who play all year round on a pitch, in front of a home crowd, on a distinct playing ground, on a ground that is bigger than most, that is on their doorstep. How could Dublin not have an advantage? It's only natural?

Six out of 20+
Maybe not the definition of rare but certainly not dominance like the Kilkenny cats in hurling - but I don't see any whinge about them....

Did you play? Did your aspirations finish at your county ground?
No one I know who was decent and competitive set their sights so low!

I know playing in newbridge or navan for the county was not the extent oft ambitions or any of my team mates!

Ask any players - esp intercounty ones and I expect you will get the same answer!

Also - as the qf, semis and finals are generally played in croker - ALL teams want to get there In Order to acclimatize and get used to playing at croker.

Demanding home advantage when croker is an option is short sightedness at its best!

Sure the ulster final played at croke park was largely to get the players au fait with croker as much as reaping in larger gate receipts!

I know the likes of Carlow were bemoaning the fact that they never got the chance to play at hq!

Again- why no whinge at Kilkenny , did money fuel their dominance?
Did money fuel Kerry's football dominance ?

Jello - thanks for pointing that out- however Meath were still better !   

[Jell 0 Biafra]

All players want to play in croke park!
From underage to adult - hurling, football, camogie and ladies football!

Sure ever soccer and rugby would still want tobplaybthere ( for extra revenue!)

Any team that wants success , has to play in croker as that's where the semis and finals are played!
In past few decades Dublin have rarely been the opposition!

Sports people are competitive so want to play there!

Money wasn't the factor behind kilkenny's dominance in hurling !!
Time, coaching and focus were the factors - same as dublins rising - ya can't buy players!

Who said nobody wants to play there?

What decade have Dublin Rarely been the opposition for Semis and Finals?

Just because Kilkennys had success has does this mean that Money will not buy you success?

My point is that everyone wants to play there.
Ask any Kildare, Meath, Galway, limerick or ulster lad would they prefer to play in their home venue or croker and I'd expect the majority would prefer croker.
Many reasons for that- over riding any potential home adv they might get.

80's, 90's Meath were the team so Dublin rarely got out of Leinster.

Since the qualifiers Dublin have fared better but was it 3 or 4 all Ireland's in 30 years I think- hardly domination in football.
In quarter finals , semi finals final etc only one team could possibly meet Dublin- so yes, Dublin are rarely the opposition for all teams!!!

Money hasn't bought success for all the teams winning Sam or Liam over the past few decades- so why so Dublin ( or is it people want to pick on them).
I'm not a dub , but fair is fair for fecks sake!!

Dublin won Leinster titles 1983, 1984, 1985, 1989, 1992, 1993, 1994, 1995,  Rare?

Dublin in AI finals 83, 84, 85, 92, 94, 95 Rare?

As for the horse sh!t that because a team are really want to play in Croker or Really want to beat the Dubs is enough to beat them. Well you are very naive. If you think a Team who play all year round on a pitch, in front of a home crowd, on a distinct playing ground, on a ground that is bigger than most, that is on their doorstep. How could Dublin not have an advantage? It's only natural?

Six out of 20+
Maybe not the definition of rare but certainly not dominance like the Kilkenny cats in hurling - but I don't see any whinge about them....

Did you play? Did your aspirations finish at your county ground?
No one I know who was decent and competitive set their sights so low!

I know playing in newbridge or navan for the county was not the extent oft ambitions or any of my team mates!

Ask any players - esp intercounty ones and I expect you will get the same answer!

Also - as the qf, semis and finals are generally played in croker - ALL teams want to get there In Order to acclimatize and get used to playing at croker.

Demanding home advantage when croker is an option is short sightedness at its best!

Sure the ulster final played at croke park was largely to get the players au fait with croker as much as reaping in larger gate receipts!

I know the likes of Carlow were bemoaning the fact that they never got the chance to play at hq!

Again- why no whinge at Kilkenny , did money fuel their dominance?
Did money fuel Kerry's football dominance ?

Jello - thanks for pointing that out- however Meath were still better !   

Count those Leinster's again, Lynchboy!   Certainly Meath were better at certain points over those 20 years, but Dublin were better at other points.   Dublin had more Leinsters and an equal # of AIF appearances (though fewer All-Irelands) than Meath over the two decades.

[lynchbhoy]

It's only all Ireland's that count!! Meath were still better is all I will say!!


As for the rest- to be honest it's a moot point

Dublin have some bit of an adv due to proximity and familiarity
But all key games are played there and any player/team worth their salt want to play there.
I know I was pssed off when croker was closed in 1988 to us and our all Ireland fresher final was relocated elsewhere!

Plus when someone can respond as to why there's no whinge at Kilkenny and Kerry's dominance without money to back this or players bought- I may respond!

Some eejits and closed minded people on here - plus others who could channel their undoubted passion to more positive effect!!

[Ringfort]

Lynchbhoy. You are either simple or are wilfully missing the point. DUBLIN PLAY EVERY GAME AT HOME. NO ONE ELSE DOES.

Why are you harping on about where players might want to play. It's immaterial. Emlyn Mulligan has never played in CP as far as I know. Should Leitrim v Ros be played at CP cos he wants to play there? Players do not choose where the games are on so please drop that line.

As for Kerry and Kilkenny. They dominated through tradition and excellence. No unfair advantages, they just prepared themselves better than everyone else. That's why no one is complaining. Yet Dublin are now a top tier hurling side, will prob win an AI soon enough, and that is all through 'games development' in the capital ie FUNDING. That is artificial success.

The footballers have a near professional set up. They have the population and profile to attract significant outside sponsorship to pay for this so good luck to them. It is scandalous they get the added advantage of every game at home as well. Did you read my previous analogy? What if the likes of Spurs or Arsenal played EVERY FA Cup game at Wembley?

[Main Street]

It's only all Ireland's that count!! Meath were still better is all I will say!!


As for the rest- to be honest it's a moot point

Dublin have some bit of an adv due to proximity and familiarity
But all key games are played there and any player/team worth their salt want to play there.
I know I was pssed off when croker was closed in 1988 to us and our all Ireland fresher final was relocated elsewhere!

Plus when someone can respond as to why there's no whinge at Kilkenny and Kerry's dominance without money to back this or players bought- I may respond!

Some eejits and closed minded people on here - plus others who could channel their undoubted passion to more positive effect!!

If by some freak state of affairs, Derry drew Dublin in the qualifiers to play at Celtic park, I'm led to believe that Derry would/should concede home advantage, traipse all the way to Dublin and expect their supporters to do the same, because it's a players ambition to play in Croke Park? 
If Monaghan county board conceded home advantage to Dublin, I'd expect them to be chucked into Lough Major in a sack with some heavy rocks.

On finance, Kilkenny are a cash rich county, I think they are even richer than Dublin and Kerry are not that far behind them both.
Kerry are also cute hoors when it  come to things like raising cash for the pursuit of Sam.

[easytiger95]

Ringfort, I'd suggest that Kilkenny have an "unfair" advantage over other hurling counties in that they don't even bother paying lip service to football - they just don't promote it and no one pulls them up on it (there were murmurs of this during  their five in a row run but it didn't get traction). As for Kilkenny and Kerry dominating through tradition and excellence, to infer that Dublin did not triumph through traditon and excellence is just manure lads.

The Brogan's dad has three All Ireland medals, their uncle was on the same panel and was a selector on various successful teams. Pat Gilroy's father was intsrumental in St. Vincent's success, Pat has a medal from 95, whilst his selector Mickey Whelan is a direct link back to the fifties era of Dublin men for Dublin teams. David Hickey served as a selector in our 2011 triumph and  Mick Deegan was an All Ireland winner in 95 and serves now. James McCarthy is the son of the famous Maccer, Jack McCaffrey links back to 83 through his father Noel. Going further back Pillar Caffrey who was a selector when Alan Brogan broke in to the team in 2002, is a brother to John Caffrey, a sub in 83, who would have been over teams in St. Declan's that brought on the likes of Senan Connell and the three Brogan brothers.

If any other county's team had such a rich web of connections, tradition and excellence there would be two page spreads in the Sunday Indo, pictures of flint-eyed men staring over Atlantic waves and banging on about how football is in their blood, they are rooted in the land etc etc

However because they are Dubs they are merely gym monkeys who bought their success and rely on a home advantage to cheat their way to titles.

Please, give us all a break.

Anyway, 15 points - Lord Jaysis what a team.

[From the Bunker]

Ringfort, I'd suggest that Kilkenny have an "unfair" advantage over other hurling counties in that they don't even bother paying lip service to football - they just don't promote it and no one pulls them up on it (there were murmurs of this during  their five in a row run but it didn't get traction). As for Kilkenny and Kerry dominating through tradition and excellence, to infer that Dublin did not triumph through traditon and excellence is just manure lads.

The Brogan's dad has three All Ireland medals, their uncle was on the same panel and was a selector on various successful teams. Pat Gilroy's father was intsrumental in St. Vincent's success, Pat has a medal from 95, whilst his selector Mickey Whelan is a direct link back to the fifties era of Dublin men for Dublin teams. David Hickey served as a selector in our 2011 triumph and  Mick Deegan was an All Ireland winner in 95 and serves now. James McCarthy is the son of the famous Maccer, Jack McCaffrey links back to 83 through his father Noel. Going further back Pillar Caffrey who was a selector when Alan Brogan broke in to the team in 2002, is a brother to John Caffrey, a sub in 83, who would have been over teams in St. Declan's that brought on the likes of Senan Connell and the three Brogan brothers.

If any other county's team had such a rich web of connections, tradition and excellence there would be two page spreads in the Sunday Indo, pictures of flint-eyed men staring over Atlantic waves and banging on about how football is in their blood, they are rooted in the land etc etc

However because they are Dubs they are merely gym monkeys who bought their success and rely on a home advantage to cheat their way to titles.

Please, give us all a break.

Anyway, 15 points - Lord Jaysis what a team.

Yeah, agree with ya that Dublin have a tradition (and a proud one at that). Often over looked as they don't have the small town heroes that rural Counties have.

[J OGorman]

It's only all Ireland's that count!! Meath were still better is all I will say!!


As for the rest- to be honest it's a moot point

Dublin have some bit of an adv due to proximity and familiarity
But all key games are played there and any player/team worth their salt want to play there.
I know I was pssed off when croker was closed in 1988 to us and our all Ireland fresher final was relocated elsewhere!

Plus when someone can respond as to why there's no whinge at Kilkenny and Kerry's dominance without money to back this or players bought- I may respond!

Some eejits and closed minded people on here - plus others who could channel their undoubted passion to more positive effect!!

If by some freak state of affairs, Derry drew Dublin in the qualifiers to play at Celtic park, I'm led to believe that Derry would/should concede home advantage, traipse all the way to Dublin and expect their supporters to do the same, because it's a players ambition to play in Croke Park? 
If Monaghan county board conceded home advantage to Dublin, I'd expect them to be chucked into Lough Major in a sack with some heavy rocks.

On finance, Kilkenny are a cash rich county, I think they are even richer than Dublin and Kerry are not that far behind them both.
Kerry are also cute hoors when it  come to things like raising cash for the pursuit of Sam.

that did happen about 10 years ago and the powers that be moved it to Clones!

[Dinny Breen]

Interesting debate firstly I think everyone acknowledges Dublin's traditions, heritage, culture and philosophy when it comes to football, 2nd only to Kerry of that no one can argue.

For anyone interested in sport in general you should read Soccernomics by Simon Kuper because a lot of models spoken off in that are applicable to Dublin GAA, from population size to money invested on preparing teams.

Anyhow they discuss home advantage in the book and for International football, statistical analysis will show that in soccer terms home advantage is worth approximately 0.6 goals per game or in effect you start two out of every three games with a goal start.  In fact they also show that being a large country with a healthy economy is only worth a tenth of a goal. So for Dublin being rich and large isn't that big an advantage certainly not compared to home advantage. 

Another big advantage Dublin are starting to have over other teams is experience, very evident yesterday, have twice as much experience as the opposition is worth in International football 0.5 of a goal. 

So conservatively speaking in a one off game these statistics would be nonsense but spread out over a series of games and you will see Dublin probably have a 6/7 point advantage before a ball is even kicked.

The GAA need to reassess their values, for me personally Leinster Finals, AI semi-finals, National League finals and obviously AI finals should only be played in Croke Park. And if the Corporates kick up, 'so f**king what', I always thought the GAA was backboned by socialist ideals, at the moment it looks like all sides are equal some are just more equal than others.

[Thisonegoesto11]

Do we have it in any other sport? Can you imagine Man Utd with such an advantage? Bayern Munich? Munster (in rugby)? God even Celtic with a whole season of home games in the league and Cup, they'd be unbackable? On top of all this there is economics and convenience for the fans. Is there a work around? Not really. The authorities that be are naturally concerned about making money and making as much as possible. So the chasing bunch will have to just work around this disadvantage each year?

Indeed, Mayo would have landed 10 AI's by now if Dublin didn't play games at Croke Park.

Tip for Mayo 2014. If ye need a goal to salvage an AI final, then go for a goal. Knocking over a couple of consoliation points for a  ' we only lost by one point'  stance lacks ambition.
Of course , the game being  played at Croke Park was the real reason Dublin won. Least all the other finals you lost were fair and square. (although Meath's proximity to Croke Park should be questioned)

Time to focus on real football issues. Let this one go and knuckle down.

[AZOffaly]

Not sure about your extrapolation of 6/7 points advantage Dinny, but I certainly agree that familiarity breeds comfort, comfort breeds confidence and confidence breeds performance. I was nearly killed for saying this before, but playing all your championship games in Croke Park for several years, and now half your league games or more, has got to give new Dub players a sense of confidence and comfort. Routine is huge for many players, and having a set routine for every big game you play has to be an advantage.

Having said that, I'm sure the Dubs would be happy to play down the country in the early rounds of the championship, and it's not the reason why they are winning all round them at the moment, but it is a help and anyone who denies that is being deliberately contrarian, or is burying their head in the sand.

[Dinny Breen]

Not sure about your extrapolation of 6/7 points advantage Dinny, but I certainly agree that familiarity breeds comfort, comfort breeds confidence and confidence breeds performance. I was nearly killed for saying this before, but playing all your championship games in Croke Park for several years, and now half your league games or more, has got to give new Dub players a sense of confidence and comfort. Routine is huge for many players, and having a set routine for every big game you play has to be an advantage.

Having said that, I'm sure the Dubs would be happy to play down the country in the early rounds of the championship, and it's not the reason why they are winning all round them at the moment, but it is a help and anyone who denies that is being deliberately contrarian, or is burying their head in the sand.

Not sure of that myself just picked it out of the sky to exaggerate a point, we can look at the reasons why home advantage is such but it can't be denied that much I know.

I don't blame Dublin and no it's only a factor in many and why would they give up a competitive advantage they have a county board with a spine and are doing best for Dublin GAA.

[Rossfan]

I suppose it all started out with the laudable aim of getting more young people in Dublin playing Gaelic Games. Getting more people everywhere in Ireland playing our games is what the GAA should be all about.
Next step was to give young people in dublin another sporting "brand" to get into in opposition to the Leinster rubby "brand".
This gave us the "Spring Series" of 4 or 5 big GAA nights in Croker and then with Dublin footballers playing 5 or 6 Summer championship games in Croker we were able to rival the Rubbys by having a big team playing loads of games in a big stadium just as regularly as the Leinster crowd. (When will Galway/Limerick/Antrim/Cork get a similar arrangement to rival their rubby opponents).
Have we now created a "monster" which could destroy all semblance of competition where we'll end up like the Scotch Soccer league with one team so far ahead of the rest that things will start to crumble?
The Leinster SFC is now simply a Dublin cash raising thing for the Leinster Council as the attendances( and standards??) have dropped alarmingly at most LSFC games. ( 3,000 at Westmeath v Carlow around the same for Wicklow/Longford compared to 5 figure attendances at the likes of Cavan/Fermanagh or Ros Leitrim).
I hope we don't go back to the days of 17,000 and 19,000 at AI Semis as we had back in the 80s because the games had become so one sided.

[Thisonegoesto11]

Not sure about your extrapolation of 6/7 points advantage Dinny, but I certainly agree that familiarity breeds comfort, comfort breeds confidence and confidence breeds performance. I was nearly killed for saying this before, but playing all your championship games in Croke Park for several years, and now half your league games or more, has got to give new Dub players a sense of confidence and comfort. Routine is huge for many players, and having a set routine for every big game you play has to be an advantage.

Having said that, I'm sure the Dubs would be happy to play down the country in the early rounds of the championship, and it's not the reason why they are winning all round them at the moment, but it is a help and anyone who denies that is being deliberately contrarian, or is burying their head in the sand.

Not sure of that myself just picked it out of the sky to exaggerate a point, we can look at the reasons why home advantage is such but it can't be denied that much I know.

I don't blame Dublin and no it's only a factor in many and why would they give up a competitive advantage they have a county board with a spine and are doing best for Dublin GAA.

I do get the points made on this but not sure on the relevance.

Gooch gave as good as display as I have seen v Dublin at CP in that first half last year.
There's been many huge performaces against us there – Cavanagh, Canavan, Mcconville, Mcdonald, too many Meath players to mention and Micko's Kildare and Laois teams.
Reasons were quality and team work more than location.
Give 'em a ball and a yard of grass and location shouldn't matter that much.

[Hill16 Blues]

Not sure about your extrapolation of 6/7 points advantage Dinny, but I certainly agree that familiarity breeds comfort, comfort breeds confidence and confidence breeds performance. I was nearly killed for saying this before, but playing all your championship games in Croke Park for several years, and now half your league games or more, has got to give new Dub players a sense of confidence and comfort. Routine is huge for many players, and having a set routine for every big game you play has to be an advantage.

Having said that, I'm sure the Dubs would be happy to play down the country in the early rounds of the championship, and it's not the reason why they are winning all round them at the moment, but it is a help and anyone who denies that is being deliberately contrarian, or is burying their head in the sand.

Not sure of that myself just picked it out of the sky to exaggerate a point, we can look at the reasons why home advantage is such but it can't be denied that much I know.

I don't blame Dublin and no it's only a factor in many and why would they give up a competitive advantage they have a county board with a spine and are doing best for Dublin GAA.

Has anyone even remotely connected to Dublin asked that we play our leinster championship games in Croke Park? These games are there simply to generate income for the leinster council.  Will happily travel to any ground in leinster to play. And if we do and whack whoever it is we will be playing what will be the gripe at that point? Jealousy is a sh1t characteristic displayed by many small minded people on this site.

We are winning at the minute because we just happen to have the best team and players. In my time watching football this is probably the best Dublin team we have ever had. And as Kerry and Kilkenny have shown the best teams usually win. So for those with their anti Dublin agendas and hatred build a fcukn bridge and get over it!!