Author Topic: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling  (Read 4093063 times)

vallankumous

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 437
    • View Profile
Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #34740 on: April 22, 2017, 07:24:19 AM »
Yeah cause a new manager is going to come in and free up the players to play club football every weekend whilst still having Tyrone winning all Irelands playing open attacking football. The only issue I have is with the timing of the request for the training weekend.

When you see what other counties are doing it wasn't an unreasonable request to have the players for one of the 6 weekends pre Derry game. He wasn't even demanding that the games were cancelled just moved to mid week.

Midweek games happen in local soccer and other counties and in a one off scenario weren't the big deal they were made out to be. Harte is far from perfect but has been allowed clubs access to their county players as much if not more than other top county managers in recent years.

This board has got terrible. Full of crying and yapping and over dramatising everything. Just like other forms of social media I guess. The majority of people now on the Tyrone pages complain in at least 75 per cent of messages. There's been 2 full rounds of club games and plenty of underage games with very little talked about them. The county players and management give an awful lot to the county and don't deserve half the crap they get.

I think you miss the point here. The issue here is with Harte as this is the Tyrone Forum. The fact that it happens elsewhere does not mean it's not a problem. Your argument is like claiming Global warming isn't a problem because China have more emissions than Ireland.

Redhand Santa

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1237
    • View Profile
Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #34741 on: April 22, 2017, 09:20:51 AM »
I don't think I've missed the point at all. There is a national issue with fixtures and county player availability. No matter who manages Tyrone the issue is going to be there. So there is no point attacking harte who when you look at other counties is pretty reasonable.

He is the appointed county manager and has to do what he thinks is best for the team. He is competing against other counties who are having week long training camps and more access to the players. He is expected to compete and has been seen here recently when things don't go well takes the blame and serious abuse for results. Everyone can't have it both ways.

The issue needs addressed nationally were designated periods are put in place for club football that can't be touched. Until then the county board need to do there best with the current structures to allow the county to remain competitive whilst allowing regular club games.

They came up with in my opinion a decent proposal which would have allowed 11 starred games and regular matches from June to August which is traditionally the period with biggest problem for fixtures. The clubs voted it down which I can't work out.

vallankumous

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 437
    • View Profile
Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #34742 on: April 22, 2017, 09:48:15 AM »
I don't think I've missed the point at all. There is a national issue with fixtures and county player availability. No matter who manages Tyrone the issue is going to be there. So there is no point attacking harte who when you look at other counties is pretty reasonable.

He is the appointed county manager and has to do what he thinks is best for the team. He is competing against other counties who are having week long training camps and more access to the players. He is expected to compete and has been seen here recently when things don't go well takes the blame and serious abuse for results. Everyone can't have it both ways.

The issue needs addressed nationally were designated periods are put in place for club football that can't be touched. Until then the county board need to do there best with the current structures to allow the county to remain competitive whilst allowing regular club games.

They came up with in my opinion a decent proposal which would have allowed 11 starred games and regular matches from June to August which is traditionally the period with biggest problem for fixtures. The clubs voted it down which I can't work out.

I agree that another manager would do the exact same thing and therefore change is not needed.
There is a big theme here that our ability to compete now and in the future is being hampered by the problems facing the clubs. Many here believe this will have a negative impact on our ability to compete therefore lowering expectations. Go back and have a look at the comments as see there is a lowering of expectation.


Redhand Santa

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1237
    • View Profile
Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #34743 on: April 22, 2017, 10:19:48 AM »
To me unless things change nationally the county players are only ever going to be able to play 7 or 8 club league games (unless league runs on late which no one wants) under the current system. We should be realistic and plan around that and ensure regular fixtures for club players when they aren't available. This will stop the same complaints every year, save the county player/management hassle and allow club fixtures a decent more concrete fixture list.

Maybe the county board proposal of 4 12s with 11 starred and 11 with county men should have been tweaked. They could have spilt the 3 divisions into 2 x 8. 7 starred and 7 non starred. This would have allowed the league to be easily completed before the championship and no hold up at the end of the year. But the problem with it is 14 games isn't enough to allow regular games all season. If you did it you'd need a seoerate summer competition but it's hard to get clubs to buy into it (though maybe they should as it's surely better than sitting around all summer then playing games in November).

But either way something needs done that ensures the leagues are wrapped up pre championship and more concrete fixtures are in place for clubs.

square_ball

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 282
    • View Profile
Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #34744 on: April 22, 2017, 12:04:44 PM »
I think the issue Redhand Santa is not the access to county players but more the whole timing and notice period given to clubs over these fixtures. If they were agreed in advance I'd say there wouldn't be as big an outcry. Calling off a match while Dromore are travelling to the venue is disgraceful in my opinion. The whole fiasco with the fixtures on Tuesday then Thursday then Sunday is not fair on club players and their family/work life. Fixtures is obviously a national issue but in this particular case it's firmly at the door of the county board/Mickey Harte. You're right about leagues needing form dates put in place and games will just have to be played with or without county men. Now I know that's easy for me to say when my club has no county players.

Although I agree with someone earlier. The 2 Tyrone threads have turned into the hoganstand forum. 80% is pure tripe.

Il Bomber Destro

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1964
    • View Profile
Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #34745 on: April 22, 2017, 01:16:49 PM »
I've said it before, only a matter of time before "Club" players are contracted to their County for that playing year and Club League Football goes on ahead without them. Would sort this shambles from happening. No point holding up league games for 90% of players just to keep 1 man and his 10% happy

Make them available for Club Championship yeah but let the league games go ahead.

No wonder the youth are disinterested and player drop outs after 18 are so high

Yup, this is what makese sense.

How many league games do Dublin, Kerry, Mayo or Donegal county players play for their clubs by the way? I'd imagine Tyrone are a lot more accommodating than any of these counties when it comes to county players playing with their clubs.

Redhand Santa

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1237
    • View Profile
Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #34746 on: April 22, 2017, 01:20:44 PM »
I think the issue Redhand Santa is not the access to county players but more the whole timing and notice period given to clubs over these fixtures. If they were agreed in advance I'd say there wouldn't be as big an outcry. Calling off a match while Dromore are travelling to the venue is disgraceful in my opinion. The whole fiasco with the fixtures on Tuesday then Thursday then Sunday is not fair on club players and their family/work life. Fixtures is obviously a national issue but in this particular case it's firmly at the door of the county board/Mickey Harte. You're right about leagues needing form dates put in place and games will just have to be played with or without county men. Now I know that's easy for me to say when my club has no county players.

Although I agree with someone earlier. The 2 Tyrone threads have turned into the hoganstand forum. 80% is pure tripe.

Can't argue with that, the training weekend has not been handled well. The Derry fixture has been known now for a long time with the only variable being the chance of Tyrone getting to the league final.

The county board should have told harte there was 6 fixtures being played with county players before the Derry game but allowed him some input to the scheduling. If he wanted a training weekend this could have been ageed with one set of derby games moved to midweek to free up a weekend or even the double games at Easter that they tried. They could also have agreed to play a Friday night round two weeks before the Derry game to free up a 2 week build up to it whilst at the same time giving club players the rest of that weekend of.

Once agreed these should have been communicated to the clubs (with consultation) and set in stone months ago. Bit more communication could definitely solve a lot of problems.

Redhand Santa

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1237
    • View Profile
Re: Tyrone Club Football and Hurling
« Reply #34747 on: April 22, 2017, 01:22:43 PM »
I've said it before, only a matter of time before "Club" players are contracted to their County for that playing year and Club League Football goes on ahead without them. Would sort this shambles from happening. No point holding up league games for 90% of players just to keep 1 man and his 10% happy

Make them available for Club Championship yeah but let the league games go ahead.

No wonder the youth are disinterested and player drop outs after 18 are so high

Yup, this is what makese sense.

How many league games do Dublin, Kerry, Mayo or Donegal county players play for their clubs by the way? I'd imagine Tyrone are a lot more accommodating than any of these counties when it comes to county players playing with their clubs.

If they played no league games it would take away from the competition and I'm not sure that is good idea. Playing a couple less games would help though.