Queens withdraw from McKenna Cup

[imtommygunn]

If university teams go out of the mckenna cup then there are little or no games in it and it becomes less valuable.

Surely county teams could appoint "scouts" to view the players playing for thei university. They'd be more likely to get games playing for univsities anyway and it's not like counties are playing full teams and they're seeing how they fit in anyway.

The mckenna cup has got a lot bigger since universities went into it. They pull out and there will be nowhere near the same value to it.

[INDIANA]

If university teams go out of the mckenna cup then there are little or no games in it and it becomes less valuable.

Surely county teams could appoint "scouts" to view the players playing for thei university. They'd be more likely to get games playing for univsities anyway and it's not like counties are playing full teams and they're seeing how they fit in anyway.

The mckenna cup has got a lot bigger since universities went into it. They pull out and there will be nowhere near the same value to it.

But why should a county team be subsquent to a team that 3 men and a dog go to watch.

I'm watching sigerson for 20 years and played in it for a number of years and its completely over-rated. Its played in poor weather conditions and is largely dominated by 2-3 colleges who hoover up all the county players.

How is a manager supposed to know how a player will fit into his team if he never plays in it?

Why can't it be played pre-christmas? Nobodyhas answered that

[Eamonnca1]

Frankly I'm at a loss to understand why college teams would play in a competitive competition against non college teams. An informal tournament, I could see the point of that. But a competitive competition with a bit of history behind it and a reasonable amount of public interest? That should be apples playing against apples, not apples playing against oranges.

[theticklemister]

Frankly I'm at a loss to understand why college teams would play in a competitive competition against non college teams. An informal tournament, I could see the point of that. But a competitive competition with a bit of history behind it and a reasonable amount of public interest? That should be apples playing against apples, not apples playing against oranges.

Yer last sentence summarises the whole problem here..................... thats why university teams should be allowed their full compliment.

If university teams go out of the mckenna cup then there are little or no games in it and it becomes less valuable.

Surely county teams could appoint "scouts" to view the players playing for thei university. They'd be more likely to get games playing for univsities anyway and it's not like counties are playing full teams and they're seeing how they fit in anyway.

The mckenna cup has got a lot bigger since universities went into it. They pull out and there will be nowhere near the same value to it.

But why should a county team be subsquent to a team that 3 men and a dog go to watch.

I'm watching sigerson for 20 years and played in it for a number of years and its completely over-rated. Its played in poor weather conditions and is largely dominated by 2-3 colleges who hoover up all the county players.

How is a manager supposed to know how a player will fit into his team if he never plays in it?

Why can't it be played pre-christmas? Nobodyhas answered that

Colleges return on the third week of September. The leagues takes place a week later ; say the start of October. They then have 3/4 league games which take it up to November (a lot of these games are called off because a) the weather is terrible and b) College games have more tendency than most to have games postponed because of student reasons) . This then leads to the qf of league, sf of league and then final. So if them games are played week in week out (which they never do), the earliest possible date for this final could be December. University finishes on the 2nd/3rd week of December then and of course the Christmas exams take precedence around this time. There you go Indiana; I have answered that.

[Eamonnca1]

GAA matches are supposed to represent something. When Armagh plays against Down it's supposed to show whether the standard of football is higher in Down or Armagh.  When Queen's plays against Jordanstown it's supposed to show whether the standard is higher in Queen's or Jordanstown.  When Armagh plays against Queen's and half the players on one team are eligible to play on the other, what exactly is this game supposed to prove?

I don't get it.

[theticklemister]

GAA matches are supposed to represent something. When Armagh plays against Down it's supposed to show whether the standard of football is higher in Down or Armagh.  When Queen's plays against Jordanstown it's supposed to show whether the standard is higher in Queen's or Jordanstown.  When Armagh plays against Queen's and half the players on one team are eligible to play on the other, what exactly is this game supposed to prove?

I don't get it.

Yer looking into it too much.

Schools play clubs in matches; county minor teams play decent mcroary teams in matches; schools play unis in matches; clubs play county teams in matches........................... list goes on lad.

[Eamonnca1]

GAA matches are supposed to represent something. When Armagh plays against Down it's supposed to show whether the standard of football is higher in Down or Armagh.  When Queen's plays against Jordanstown it's supposed to show whether the standard is higher in Queen's or Jordanstown.  When Armagh plays against Queen's and half the players on one team are eligible to play on the other, what exactly is this game supposed to prove?

I don't get it.

Yer looking into it too much.

Schools play clubs in matches; county minor teams play decent mcroary teams in matches; schools play unis in matches; clubs play county teams in matches........................... list goes on lad.

Aye, in challenge matches. That's okay.

[INDIANA]

Frankly I'm at a loss to understand why college teams would play in a competitive competition against non college teams. An informal tournament, I could see the point of that. But a competitive competition with a bit of history behind it and a reasonable amount of public interest? That should be apples playing against apples, not apples playing against oranges.

Yer last sentence summarises the whole problem here..................... thats why university teams should be allowed their full compliment.

If university teams go out of the mckenna cup then there are little or no games in it and it becomes less valuable.

Surely county teams could appoint "scouts" to view the players playing for thei university. They'd be more likely to get games playing for univsities anyway and it's not like counties are playing full teams and they're seeing how they fit in anyway.

The mckenna cup has got a lot bigger since universities went into it. They pull out and there will be nowhere near the same value to it.

But why should a county team be subsquent to a team that 3 men and a dog go to watch.

I'm watching sigerson for 20 years and played in it for a number of years and its completely over-rated. Its played in poor weather conditions and is largely dominated by 2-3 colleges who hoover up all the county players.

How is a manager supposed to know how a player will fit into his team if he never plays in it?

Why can't it be played pre-christmas? Nobodyhas answered that

Colleges return on the third week of September. The leagues takes place a week later ; say the start of October. They then have 3/4 league games which take it up to November (a lot of these games are called off because a) the weather is terrible and b) College games have more tendency than most to have games postponed because of student reasons) . This then leads to the qf of league, sf of league and then final. So if them games are played week in week out (which they never do), the earliest possible date for this final could be December. University finishes on the 2nd/3rd week of December then and of course the Christmas exams take precedence around this time. There you go Indiana; I have answered that.

You have perfectly. there is no necessity for the higher education leagues. Run the sigerson on a round robin pre-christmas and scrub the leagues.

The biggest problem is the universities non- acceptance that they are very much third to counties and clubs.

Which is the correct order of events in my view. Sooner the universities accept this the better.

They aren't county teams and never will be. So they shouldn't be playing in inter county competitions.

[shawshank]

I entirely agree Indiana. Queens have smelt the coffee. On another note I see kerry have withdrawn from their preseason compo due to player demands from uni and club. Surely when it gets to the point thAT kerry withdraw due to non availability of uni players for a county competition the whole purpose of it has been lost.

[theticklemister]

If the club v uni or county v uni dilemma came up when both seasons are at a peak then I could understand club/county before uni. Both playing seasons are at different stages however. The county teams are going at training aerobically at minute while im sure the uni teams will be building upon their agility and speed as their cship fast approaches. Two different forms of training will cause injury.  Anyway back to my point; lets look at seasons at this time of year at full swing - the all ireland club series and uni teams- ye didnt see jamie clarke togging out for jtown did ye. If the ulster championship was around the corner ye would not see any county player playing uni ball. Which states that when clubs/colleges are more important :-), which I think so too. However this of year the universoty should have their players available as they get ready for their championship. Mickey Harte, the selfish hoor should leave well alone.

[theticklemister]

I thought that kerry one was a joke !!!!! Well kerry never took part last year so they probably didnt want to again this year in reality. The mcgrath cup and the munster province are all the poorer for it. If I was ever good enough to be on an extended panel of fifty or in kerry I would be bucking raging.

[Donnellys Hollow]

I'd question how beneficial these January tournaments actually are for the third level colleges. Maynooth have done very well in the Sigerson in recent years for a college of their size and they have never competed in the O'Byrne Cup.

[yellowcard]

GAA matches are supposed to represent something. When Armagh plays against Down it's supposed to show whether the standard of football is higher in Down or Armagh.  When Queen's plays against Jordanstown it's supposed to show whether the standard is higher in Queen's or Jordanstown.  When Armagh plays against Queen's and half the players on one team are eligible to play on the other, what exactly is this game supposed to prove?

I don't get it.

Yer looking into it too much.

Schools play clubs in matches; county minor teams play decent mcroary teams in matches; schools play unis in matches; clubs play county teams in matches........................... list goes on lad.

Aye, in challenge matches. That's okay.

Are you trying to say that the Mckenna cup matches are anything but glorified challenge matches. Its simply county managers trying to lay down the law to prove their authority, a short sighted attitude imo.

As ticklemister alluded to, imagine the outcry if Armagh management forced the Crossmaglen contingent to play McKenna cup. They weren't asked and rightly so, why should the colleges be treated any differently when all the McKenna cup is a pre-season tournament full of formalised challenge matches.

[ONeill]

Harte and other managers are 'hired' to manage their county side to success. They need to hit the ground running in the NFL or they'll be facing relegation before they know it. To do that you need a semi-settled side. Tyrone are away to Mayo and Down in their first two games. I can understand why Harte and others want their favoured 15 playing together.

The Ulster Council can run the McKenna (and gate receipts) with the county teams only. The unis don't pull in that much revenue. They're not a big loss.

[imtommygunn]

If the unis pull out how do you play it off? The only way is as a knockout then half the teams only get one or two games.

The unis make it much more viable for everyone as league preparation with the league system and number of games.