Connacht Gaa Centre

[rodney trotter]

Cavan were actually the First county in Ireland to have a 3G pitch, but its hardly a Centre of Excellence when most Counties have 4/5 training pitches.

Cavans 3g pitch is no different than what's in ballyhaunis. Its just a pitch and plenty of games have been on the 3g in breffni so its not just a training pitch.

Primarily the 3G at Breffni is a training Pitch, you don't see Cavan playing League or Championhship games on it. Or any club championship games on it

Its mainly used October onwards when club grounds are in a mess and its the best option - being all weather. County Seniors play challenge games on it and a few under age blitz  games etc during the summer. But its primarily a training ground for the County teams.

[Syferus]

This has nothing to do with allegiances, though, it's about training and player development. All it being a Connacht GAA facility means is that Connacht counties and clubs will be able to avail of preferential treatment and costs. Alot of clubs have very poor facilities and access to something like this can be a godsend for an ambitious panel or manager.

I imagine a huge amount of clubs and county teams will be using it for special training sessions in the years to come, I can't see that it was intended as a full-time base for anyone. A few extra minutes on the road really matters for very little in those situations, it's not like most clubs will be making four weekly pilgrimages to Bekan. It's akin to those overseas training trips without the insane costs associated.

With respect Syferus, you don't seem to have your finger on the pulse at grassroots level the way Brian Boru has. Many clubs these days have at least feasible or adequate facilities to train on. The greater challenge for the clubs is to get all their players together training on week nights and at weekends. This can be hard enough at the best of times training at home. It would be folly for clubs to go to the expense of hiring a bus, the risk of not been able to get the whole squad together, and the time taken to drive a good hour, if not more, to a training centre that may be many miles from your own base, train for an hour plus, tog in and drive another hour or more home. What possible advantage could such a move have? Ok, if the club was involved in the later stages of their championship, a night or two, might make a change. But the reality is that the time factor alone would make any benefits largely redundant.

Good / great players are usually born. It's more the quality of coaching (and in a lot of cases the absence of too much coaching) that improve them. Facilities, good and all as they are, wouldn't make the world of difference.

Because my opinion begs to differ with his and your's? I live near Ballhaunis and I would never call the facilities in the locality 'adequate', indeed only the larger clubs have much beyond a soft pitch (at the best of times) and an old house/shed posing as a clubhouse. In alot of cases clubs find it hard enough fielding teams, nevermind building decent facilities. And by God we should be aiming for something higher than 'decent' for the most popular sport in the country and the overwhelmingly dominant one in this region.

Are St. Brigids or Salthill going to be rolling up to Bekan very often? No, but I doubt that was ever the intention. It's not just about adult panels, indeed if anything its greatest benefit is to underage panels at club and county level.

I know for a  fact my own club plans to use it, and I fully expect every other club in the locality to do likewise once any bluster and indignation inevitably dies down. It makes little sense not to utilise such a well-equipped facility, nevermind one built  for the purpose of serving those same clubs and counties. The same people who are complaining now will be doing a whole lot less of it if their own clubs are using it and they see the improvements that are possible when teams do more than take the sellotape and spit approach to building up players. And even great players need to be nurtured, no one is born with the natural ability to know how to train or how to prepare.

Of course coaching is important and the move towards standardising it is a welcome one. But you need a place to teach players properly and most clubs don't cut it in terms of the facilities that they can offer. Being able to access something like this when needed will make those same coaches' jobs a whole lot easier in the long run.

I'll repeat: it probably cost too much, and the money may have been better served funding regional facilities in each county, but what we have now does have plenty of logic behind it and it will be well utilised in the years to come.

[mouview]

This has nothing to do with allegiances, though, it's about training and player development. All it being a Connacht GAA facility means is that Connacht counties and clubs will be able to avail of preferential treatment and costs. Alot of clubs have very poor facilities and access to something like this can be a godsend for an ambitious panel or manager.

I imagine a huge amount of clubs and county teams will be using it for special training sessions in the years to come, I can't see that it was intended as a full-time base for anyone. A few extra minutes on the road really matters for very little in those situations, it's not like most clubs will be making four weekly pilgrimages to Bekan. It's akin to those overseas training trips without the insane costs associated.

With respect Syferus, you don't seem to have your finger on the pulse at grassroots level the way Brian Boru has. Many clubs these days have at least feasible or adequate facilities to train on. The greater challenge for the clubs is to get all their players together training on week nights and at weekends. This can be hard enough at the best of times training at home. It would be folly for clubs to go to the expense of hiring a bus, the risk of not been able to get the whole squad together, and the time taken to drive a good hour, if not more, to a training centre that may be many miles from your own base, train for an hour plus, tog in and drive another hour or more home. What possible advantage could such a move have? Ok, if the club was involved in the later stages of their championship, a night or two, might make a change. But the reality is that the time factor alone would make any benefits largely redundant.

Good / great players are usually born. It's more the quality of coaching (and in a lot of cases the absence of too much coaching) that improve them. Facilities, good and all as they are, wouldn't make the world of difference.

I know for a  fact my own club plans to use it, and I fully expect every other club in the locality to do likewise once any bluster and indignation inevitably dies down. It makes little sense not to utilise such a well-equipped facility, nevermind one built  for the purpose of serving those same clubs and counties. The same people who are complaining now will be doing a whole lot less of it if their own clubs are using it and they see the improvements that are possible when teams do more than take the sellotape and spit approach to building up players. And even great players need to be nurtured, no one is born with the natural ability to know how to train or how to prepare.

And therein lies the weakness in the whole venture. It's mostly suitable to clubs in it's locality, not to clubs in remote regions. Therefore the amount of money spent on it is scarcely justified.

[Syferus]

This has nothing to do with allegiances, though, it's about training and player development. All it being a Connacht GAA facility means is that Connacht counties and clubs will be able to avail of preferential treatment and costs. Alot of clubs have very poor facilities and access to something like this can be a godsend for an ambitious panel or manager.

I imagine a huge amount of clubs and county teams will be using it for special training sessions in the years to come, I can't see that it was intended as a full-time base for anyone. A few extra minutes on the road really matters for very little in those situations, it's not like most clubs will be making four weekly pilgrimages to Bekan. It's akin to those overseas training trips without the insane costs associated.

With respect Syferus, you don't seem to have your finger on the pulse at grassroots level the way Brian Boru has. Many clubs these days have at least feasible or adequate facilities to train on. The greater challenge for the clubs is to get all their players together training on week nights and at weekends. This can be hard enough at the best of times training at home. It would be folly for clubs to go to the expense of hiring a bus, the risk of not been able to get the whole squad together, and the time taken to drive a good hour, if not more, to a training centre that may be many miles from your own base, train for an hour plus, tog in and drive another hour or more home. What possible advantage could such a move have? Ok, if the club was involved in the later stages of their championship, a night or two, might make a change. But the reality is that the time factor alone would make any benefits largely redundant.

Good / great players are usually born. It's more the quality of coaching (and in a lot of cases the absence of too much coaching) that improve them. Facilities, good and all as they are, wouldn't make the world of difference.

I know for a  fact my own club plans to use it, and I fully expect every other club in the locality to do likewise once any bluster and indignation inevitably dies down. It makes little sense not to utilise such a well-equipped facility, nevermind one built  for the purpose of serving those same clubs and counties. The same people who are complaining now will be doing a whole lot less of it if their own clubs are using it and they see the improvements that are possible when teams do more than take the sellotape and spit approach to building up players. And even great players need to be nurtured, no one is born with the natural ability to know how to train or how to prepare.

And therein lies the weakness in the whole venture. It's mostly suitable to clubs in it's locality, not to clubs in remote regions. Therefore the amount of money spent on it is scarcely justified.

?

The 'locality' covers almost 100 clubs, there is more than enough interest to warrant a centre for the region. Indeed there's very few places in the entire country where gaelic football is as intrinsically tied to daily life as the Mayo/Roscommon/South Sligo area. There's both the numbers and the appetite to make the centre a big success for the area.

The sad reality I'm seeing is that because it's a Connacht GAA building some here are assuming it's a mis-managed attempt to service the whole, or even most, of Connacht. A centre of excellence in a given county still leaves plenty of border clubs in the shade so if anything there should be more Connacht GAA centres in border regions, not less.

Connacht GAA should be looking at Connacht as a whole, not as five counties. There's far too much insular tribalism that's stunting a proper network of facilities being built "well I don't want us using that place because it's in Mayo'' is something I've heard more than once on this topic. The same people have no answer when asked where else would they place a centre of excellence in the region or what exact size it should be. It's complete and utter guess-work on their part.

It cost too much but its location and intention are very much valid, however you or anyone else wants to wish otherwise.

Understand the reality on the ground before you call something a white elephant - if we want to get into that debate you only need to look at places like McHale Park and Gaelic Park in Limerick, not centres intended to improve the playing of the game in a given area.

[GalwayBayBoy]

This has nothing to do with allegiances, though, it's about training and player development. All it being a Connacht GAA facility means is that Connacht counties and clubs will be able to avail of preferential treatment and costs. Alot of clubs have very poor facilities and access to something like this can be a godsend for an ambitious panel or manager.

I imagine a huge amount of clubs and county teams will be using it for special training sessions in the years to come, I can't see that it was intended as a full-time base for anyone. A few extra minutes on the road really matters for very little in those situations, it's not like most clubs will be making four weekly pilgrimages to Bekan. It's akin to those overseas training trips without the insane costs associated.

With respect Syferus, you don't seem to have your finger on the pulse at grassroots level the way Brian Boru has. Many clubs these days have at least feasible or adequate facilities to train on. The greater challenge for the clubs is to get all their players together training on week nights and at weekends. This can be hard enough at the best of times training at home. It would be folly for clubs to go to the expense of hiring a bus, the risk of not been able to get the whole squad together, and the time taken to drive a good hour, if not more, to a training centre that may be many miles from your own base, train for an hour plus, tog in and drive another hour or more home. What possible advantage could such a move have? Ok, if the club was involved in the later stages of their championship, a night or two, might make a change. But the reality is that the time factor alone would make any benefits largely redundant.

Good / great players are usually born. It's more the quality of coaching (and in a lot of cases the absence of too much coaching) that improve them. Facilities, good and all as they are, wouldn't make the world of difference.

I know for a  fact my own club plans to use it, and I fully expect every other club in the locality to do likewise once any bluster and indignation inevitably dies down. It makes little sense not to utilise such a well-equipped facility, nevermind one built  for the purpose of serving those same clubs and counties. The same people who are complaining now will be doing a whole lot less of it if their own clubs are using it and they see the improvements that are possible when teams do more than take the sellotape and spit approach to building up players. And even great players need to be nurtured, no one is born with the natural ability to know how to train or how to prepare.

And therein lies the weakness in the whole venture. It's mostly suitable to clubs in it's locality, not to clubs in remote regions. Therefore the amount of money spent on it is scarcely justified.

?

The 'locality' covers almost 100 clubs, there is more than enough interest to warrant a centre for the region. Indeed there's very few places in the entire country where gaelic football is as intrinsically tied to daily life as the Mayo/Roscommon/South Sligo area. There's both the numbers and the appetite to make the centre a big success for the area.

Sure Ballyhaunis is even closer to north Galway than it is to south Sligo but I can't see many if any north Galway clubs clubs heading up there to use the facilities. It's just extra hassle to make the journey up and down bad roads (I've made that journey a fair few times) when most clubs have at least passable training facilities at home. And usually get any gym work done in local gyms or hotels or in colleges)

And you're coming at this from the perspective of someone who lives near the damn thing. What about all the football clubs out in Connemara or all the hurling clubs in south Galway. Absolutely shag all use to them. And I'm sure the same could be said about clubs from the extremities of all the counties in Connacht including Mayo itself.

If it was a smaller project and only 1 or 2 million was spent on it I'd say great build it away but nearly 10 million when you see how that money could have been divided up. Not good.

I'm sure local clubs will use it and some underage and college/schools games might be played there but is that worth the vast outlay when there are plenty of clubs who still don't even have a decent set of dressing rooms and showers? I seriously doubt it. My own club is still struggling to get the money together to complete it's dressing rooms so players are not changing in their cars or inside an old container.

[brianboru00]

My God......

The 'locality' covers almost 100 clubs

Sweet Jesus, Do you understand the word locality? Is Castlebar local to Ballyhaunis?  Is Gort local to Knock?
The locality covers perhaps 15-20 clubs.

Indeed there's very few places in the entire country where gaelic football is as intrinsically tied to daily life as the Mayo/Roscommon/South Sligo area.

Errr....WTF??? West Clare. Leitrim. Tyrone, Derry, Armagh,  How about ALL of Kerry, What about Derry... This is a GAA centre supposedly so your leaving out hurling areas lik the glens of Antrim, Kilk....Im gonna end up naming the 32 counties here - The GAA is intrinsically linked to almost every rural area in Ireland

A centre of excellence in a given county still leaves plenty of border clubs in the shade so if anything there should be more Connacht GAA centres in border regions, not less. 

No it doesn't.
The centres of excellence like in LoughGeoge were placed in a central location in order to provide 1. A permanent place for training for county teams so that they did not have to impose on different clubs depending on the weekend.

Understand the reality on the ground before you call something a white elephant

I do.Nobody has questioned or criticised the location of a Connacht "Centre" being where it is. The problem is building such a large scale venture in the first place. ONLY time will tell whether or not it is a white elephant but from the various spiels presented over the last number of years, All county teams should be gaining a benefit out of it on a regular basis. As well as all clubs.

[Lar Naparka]

1. We can manipulate the statistics to suit any argument.
(A) Leinster have only won one All Ireland in the last 10 years.
(B) Over the last 15 years Connacht have won 2 All Irelands, the same as Leinster .
U21 is an even spread through the provinces. Ulster dominated the Minor grade with the other three provinces winning twice each.

Well, I can certainly agree with you on this.
Mark Twain's quip about lies, damn lies and statistics come to mind. Stats only record facts so they don't lie but they can certainly be manipulated to suit a particular argument on occasion.

As you say, " Over the last 15 years Connacht have won 2 All Irelands, the same as Leinster."
That's undeniably a fact but of what relevance is it to our discussion?
Should that "fact" be taken to mean that the standard of football in Connacht football at present is it least as high as the standard in Leinster?
It could also be said that over the last 30 years Connacht won only two All Irelands, while Leinster won 7.
Does that mean the standard in Leinster is three and a half times higher than it is in Connacht? I don't think so but going by bare statistical analysis alone that case could certainly be made.

2. John Tobin - stating facts.

I never said otherwise. The facts he stated were about this place being open to everyone and being a top class facility. He stated that 91 clubs were within a 40 mile radius - Where have I disputed this? The fact is he is not impartial in this.

I don't think I have accused you of misrepresention. That certainly was not my intention. But the fact that he is a paid employee of the Connacht Council doesn't necessarily mean that his word is suspect.
In my original post on the matter (to Syferus) I stated that:
"I think John presented the case for the establishment of the new complex very well indeed."
I did not say I fully agreed with hm.
You did write:
"And of course John Tobin is praising it - Connacht GAA are paying his wages...."
I accept that he is not an impartial observer but  note also that you did not challenge anything he had to say. It's up to observers to draw their own conclusions and nobody, ASAIK, has challenged anything he stated as fact.

3. Should each county go it alone?
Of course they should - As I stated you play for you club or your county or both it makes no sense organising on a provincial level.

How exactly will this improve the standard in Connacht?
Will the top U16 players int he province be brought to the centre on a regular basis? If so, when - Presumably these players will also be on their county development panels So your adding an extra representative level at a time when we're doing so much to curb over training.

I guess I will have to respectfully disagree with you here. Nothing is being organised on a county level, never mind a provincial one. Teams, both club and county, are to be given the chance to avail of Bekan's facilities. There is no cross-county interaction of any sort involved. Schools from primary to third level will be free to come along also. Indeed Prenty has said that it is the provision of facilities for the playing of second-level games that has most driven the need for the Centre.
He was also keen to emphasise that the Centre should be viewed as an additional facility for counties, in combination with their own.
"How exactly will this improve the standard in Connacht?"I have no idea but Tobin did state that all counties were fully supportive of the initiative (or something to that effect) so I'm prepared to take their collective word for it.
"Will the top U16 players in the province be brought to the centre on a regular basis?"
Surely that is a matter for whoever is in charge of those teams. Nobody is being forced to do anything.

Who is "The GAA" ? The GAA financed all of this project. Central Council financed 4 million , Connacht Council finance the rest. This is all GAA money. So the answer your question, instead of earmarking 4 million for this, they give each of the five counties 800 000 . Connacht Council give each county 400 000 .

Sure, the GAA financed the project and consequently has an obligation to see that best use is made of it.  If the money was to be divided equally between the five counties involved as you say it would mean each Connacht Council giving each €400,000.
Now in terms of playing numbers, I would rate the counties in descending order as Galway, Mayo, Roscommon, Sligo and Leitrim. I don't think giving Galway and Leitrim exactly the same amount of scarce resources would be a fair or equitable move; do you?
If Central Council shelled out €800,000 to each county west of the Shannon, would the rest of the counties in Ireland agree to this without protest?  I hardly think so. What would   be the justification for so doing?
Again €800,000 to Leitrim would mean far more to that county than a similar amount would to Galway or Mayo- or the other two for that matter.

5. Standard of Facility
The biggest benefit is to have a permanent place to train besides looking for club grounds constantly.
1 million would go a hell of a long way . Look at the prices of property - 10 000 per acre is the highest price you ll pay for land. 30 acres therefore is about 300 000. 300 000 will also build a superb gymnasium / meeting rooms / lecture halls.
Car parking & Floodlighting add another 250 000. two pitches at 25 000 each is 50 000.
That leaves 300 000 to install a prunty pitch ... and Im being generous in these amounts - It could be done for far less.
Pitches - budget 100 000 ea

From what Prenty and Tobin have to say, I don't think providing training pitches for inter county teams is high on the agenda.  The CC is adopting what you might call a holistic approach and is attempting to provide facilities for the largest number of interested parties.
"1 million would go a hell of a long way . Look at the prices of property - 10 000 per acre is the highest price you ll pay for land. 30 acres therefore is about 300 000. 300 000 will also build a superb gymnasium / meeting rooms / lecture halls."

I agree with that if such was the object of the exercise. But it would also mean a vast duplication of resources at a time of economic hardship and it would mean those lecture halls etc. lying idle most of the time.
Besides, some of the resources built in Bekan could not be provided on a per county basis.
I can't see Bekan being any different to Jordanstown, DCU or UL in any respect so I don't really see why there's such  a fuss about the Connacht Council trying to providing a common resource site for all of the counties that it represents.

[brianboru00]

1.

That's undeniably a fact but of what relevance is it to our discussion?

Because the original point was that Connacht should make a joint effort to improve the situation. If one were to really examine the relative  success of recent times, Tyrone and Kerry are the teams to replicate - not Ulster and Munster. (Has Fermanagh/Down/Antrim OR Clare/Waterfor/Limerick (Tipp look to have but thats based on their structures within the county).

2. Agreed

3. Im aware its open to everybody - but the fact remains that it won't be of benefit to everybody. Take for example Galway and Roscommon and Leitrim teams - they all have a large number of players based in Dublin so its hardly fair to bring those an extra 40 or 50 minute journey - particularly in winter.

Nothing is being organised on a county level,

This is simply not true. Every county in the province (AFAIK) have development squads at U14, U15  & U17 levels. These have been organised at county level -NOT at provincial level.
And I know nobody is being forced to do anything but the fact is, its NOT PRACTICAL for counties Galway, Roscommom or Leitrim to hold training sessions there- essentially doubling the average travelling times compared to a centrally located training centre within the counties.

.....but Tobin did state that all counties were fully supportive of the initiative

The representatives at the time on the CC and the charimen at the time  BUT at grassroots level i.e. if it were to go to a full meeting of the relevant county boards, it would not have got the go ahead. And most club players / managers in G/R/L would have a similar opinion to myself.

4.

Now in terms of playing numbers, I would rate the counties in descending order as Galway, Mayo, Roscommon, Sligo and Leitrim. I don't think giving Galway and Leitrim exactly the same amount of scarce resources would be a fair or equitable move; do you?.........
Again €800,000 to Leitrim would mean far more to that county than a similar amount would to Galway or Mayo...

I do think it equitable actually. By that logic, Mayo & Galway should be getting approx 1.8million while the other three counties should get 200 000 and 500 000 approx. .. .If a grant is available for non club facilities - it should be divided evenly.

A similar argument came about in the early 90's when Hyde Park was earmarked for redevelopment as the number one ground in the province enabling it host all provincial finals ala Clones. But at club and county board level there was upheaval and the plug was pulled on that one - Everyone got the same share. 
If there were grants available for clubs - of course more mayo and galway clubs than L/R/S club should get grants.

5.

... I don't think providing training pitches for inter county teams is high on the agenda.  The CC is adopting what you might call a holistic approach and is attempting to provide facilities for the largest number of interested parties....

Thats just it- its not providing for those its claiming to. Secondary schools? - Ive no doubt these were high on the agenda , but what about fixtures between Sligo/Leitrim/Roscommon schools or Galway/Roscommon schools?

..... vast duplication of resources at a time of economic hardship and it would mean those lecture halls etc. lying idle most of the time.

How so? vast duplication of pitches? Thats whats needed more than anything else. A place for county teams to call its own. 'a club ground for the county club' . Why would the lecture halls on a per county basis be idle any more than those at bekan?
What has economic hardship got to do with it - we're heading towards €2 per litre of petrol - What is the average distance from a Connacht club to this facility?

Besides, some of the resources built in Bekan could not be provided on a per county basis.

Such as what exactly?

[Turlough O Carolan]

In fairness to Connacht Council they stuck a pin on a map and found the dead center of Connacht , a backwater called Bacon. Could a student in Dublin get a train there? No. Enough said.

[Syferus]

I do think there's a case grants are harder to get for a project involving five smaller facilities in the five counties than a big flagship development because it gives politicians and officials something to crow about to the masses.

Again, I feel the ultimate cost was signifiantly above what it should have been but the indignation in this thread is at odds with the function the facility will have. I've seen GAA clubs and counties spend money on utterly ridiculous things but this isn't one of them, this is something that will actually help improve the sport in quite a wide area. Without fanning the flames too much,  there's a little too much bluster in this thread for my liking, there's too much

Anyways, to GalwayBayBoy - I did a quick Google Maps search for some stats and Monasteraden is only 29.9km from Ballyhaunis, and what I was refering to in particular is clubs like Eastern Harps that have been very serious contenders who will be looking at something like Bekan as a way to push on a little bit.

Tuam only 32.1km and indeed Dunmore is only 17.4km from Ballyhaunis and those places alone will give the centre plenty of traffic, particularly in winter months and the lead-up to championship matches. The centre services all five counties to some degree and for any facility to do that is an achievement. Of course for more remote places in relation to the centre it's not very feasible but I don't know many other locations that would have given a wider swathe of coverage. The spot's excellent, the only real question was ever size and cost.

I think it was telling that Galway and Sligo played at Bekan in the FBD League to kick off the 2012 season on January 4th of this year and Sligo returned to use the facilities numerous times afterwards. It's clear even senior inter-county teams see the value in the centre and I put more weight into that than some of the more vocally opposed commentaries here or elsewhere.

[GalwayBayBoy]

Tuam only 32.1km and indeed Dunmore is only 17.4km from Ballyhaunis and those places alone will give the centre plenty of traffic, particularly in winter months and the lead-up to championship matches.

I would be amazed if these clubs would go up to Mayo to train. Especially as many of their players would probably be living close to Galway city whether it be for work or college so it would make no sense really to go beyond their home clubs to train further north and then drive back down again past their own club again to go back to Galway.

[Rossfan]

Connacht GAA should be looking at Connacht as a whole, not as five counties. There's far too much insular tribalism

There are only FIVE Counties in Connacht .
"Insular tribalism" is what the GAA is all about, what continues to make it tick and is in fact the main reason of its games being the top sports in Ireland.

[sans pessimism]

Lads,just let him have this particular bone ,
and let him f**k off home and play with it,otherwise
this thread will be stuck here forever.

[Lar Naparka]

Because the original point was that Connacht should make a joint effort to improve the situation. If one were to really examine the relative success of recent times, Tyrone and Kerry are the teams to replicate - not Ulster and Munster. (Has Fermanagh/Down/Antrim OR Clare/Waterfor/Limerick (Tipp look to have but thats based on their structures within the county).

I'm lost here. You brought the matter  of Connacht/Leinster titles up, not I.
That said, I do agree with what you say above. Kerry and Tyrone are probably the teams to replicate but there are others close behind them and, yes, the original point was that Connacht (ie the 5 counties) should make a joint effort to improve the situation.

3. Im aware its open to everybody - but the fact remains that it won't be of benefit to everybody. Take for example Galway and Roscommon and Leitrim teams - they all have a large number of players based in Dublin so its hardly fair to bring those an extra 40 or 50 minute journey - particularly in winter.

I will accept that it won't be of equal benefit to everybody. Mayo and Sligo have players in Dublin too and they also  face long journeys to and from training in the course of their preparations. But I don't recall anyone connected with the place saying that it would be used by any county or club panel for regular training sessions. In that way, it will be similar to the other centres I have mentioned.

"Nothing is being organised on a county level,"
This is simply not true. Every county in the province (AFAIK) have development squads at U14, U15 & U17 levels. These have been organised at county level -NOT at provincial level.

O dear, what is "simply not true?"
I would have thought that, given the context, what I said was clear enough.  I believe all counties have such development squads but they will not be going to the centre for the purpose of representing their counties unless an intercounty match is to be played there.
While it is a CONNACHT centre, it is open to all units of the GAA to make use of it if they wish and by that I mean that if, say, the Roscommon u14s come along it will be as members of  a panel and not as official representatives of their county.

And I know nobody is being forced to do anything but the fact is, its NOT PRACTICAL for counties Galway, Roscommom or Leitrim to hold training sessions there- essentially doubling the average travelling times compared to a centrally located training centre within the counties.

Hmm... I wonder if any Munster county holds regular training sessions at UL or Ulster teams at Jordanstown. TBH, I don't really know but my guess is that they don't.  I know Mayo have sent players to Ul to have specific tests carried out and I think the squad went there from time to time for specific sessions but I know of no team that uses it for a training base.

".....but Tobin did state that all counties were fully supportive of the initiative."
The representatives at the time on the CC and the charimen at the time BUT at grassroots level i.e. if it were to go to a full meeting of the relevant county boards, it would not have got the go ahead. And most club players / managers in G/R/L would have a similar opinion to myself.

Maybe they should all listen to you (and I'm not being particularly sarcastic btw) but until I see or hear some tangible evidence to the contrary, I'll have to take Tobin at his word.
THe whole caper may indeed be "nothing more than a Prenty vanity project" but you have to say he is one hell of a character if he can swing all the other Council delegates to his side, hoodwink the entire lot of county boards and then cajole Central Council into ponying up over €4 million to feed his greed but may all those I've mentioned say merit in the project from the beginning.

"Now in terms of playing numbers, I would rate the counties in descending order as Galway, Mayo, Roscommon, Sligo and Leitrim. I don't think giving Galway and Leitrim exactly the same amount of scarce resources would be a fair or equitable move; do you?........."
Again €800,000 to Leitrim would mean far more to that county than a similar amount would to Galway or Mayo...
I do think it equitable actually. By that logic, Mayo & Galway should be getting approx 1.8million while the other three counties should get 200 000 and 500 000 approx. .. .If a grant is available for non club facilities - it should be divided evenly.

By that logic, Central Council should pay out around €4 million to Leitrim to let it go develop its own facilities.Like I've already said, other counties in the land might not be too happy at that.
How  do you think  the CC would justify such a move if this money was paid over?

A similar argument came about in the early 90's when Hyde Park was earmarked for redevelopment as the number one ground in the province enabling it host all provincial finals ala Clones. But at club and county board level there was upheaval and the plug was pulled on that one - Everyone got the same share.
If there were grants available for clubs - of course more mayo and galway clubs than L/R/S club should get grants.

Agreed

... I don't think providing training pitches for inter county teams is high on the agenda. The CC is adopting what you might call a holistic approach and is attempting to provide facilities for the largest number of interested parties....

Thats just it- its not providing for those its claiming to. Secondary schools? - Ive no doubt these were high on the agenda , but what about fixtures between Sligo/Leitrim/Roscommon schools or Galway/Roscommon schools?

I really can't follow you here. Going by what Tobin said, the CC should be releasing details of its intentions to the media this week and we can all find out what their intentions are.

..... vast duplication of resources at a time of economic hardship and it would mean those lecture halls etc. lying idle most of the time.
How so? vast duplication of pitches? Thats whats needed more than anything else. A place for county teams to call its own. 'a club ground for the county club' . Why would the lecture halls on a per county basis be idle any more than those at bekan?
What has economic hardship got to do with it - we're heading towards €2 per litre of petrol - What is the average distance from a Connacht club to this facility?

IMHO, economic hardship has everything to do with it.
Let's say you had, say, 2 lecture halls per centre. Now if every county got its own centre, you'd have 10 bleddy lecture halls lying idle for the most part while the two or three at Bekan would get some use if needed.

"Besides, some of the resources built in Bekan could not be provided on a per county basis."
Such as what exactly?

How 'bout an indoor, 3g pitch for starters, not to mention a stand for over 900 people?

I'll let Prenty have the final word. (Courtesy of the Mayo News.)

"What it will be is an add-on to what counties have," he said. "Each county needs their own training centre but there are parts of this centre, like the indoor pitch for instance, that make more sense to have in a central provincial location rather than the counties each having them. The counties can use these facilities in addition to their own."

[Syferus]

Connacht GAA should be looking at Connacht as a whole, not as five counties. There's far too much insular tribalism

There are only FIVE Counties in Connacht .
"Insular tribalism" is what the GAA is all about, what continues to make it tick and is in fact the main reason of its games being the top sports in Ireland.

I meant treating the province as one strategic entity and not as five separate counties when it comes to centres and other initiatives that have cross-border appeal. Did you think I was subjugating Donegal?

It's one thing to have tribalism when Roscommon are playing Mayo in the championship, that's beneficial to atmosphere, but it's another thing when that bleeds over into planning and funding and makes counties mistrust each other 'because they're not us'. It's a small enough island as it is without each county treating itself as a country.

That's why I said insular tribalism, it's one thing to love your county but another to mistrust the others so much you're not willing to work properly with them on common issues.

Tuam only 32.1km and indeed Dunmore is only 17.4km from Ballyhaunis and those places alone will give the centre plenty of traffic, particularly in winter months and the lead-up to championship matches.

I would be amazed if these clubs would go up to Mayo to train. Especially as many of their players would probably be living close to Galway city whether it be for work or college so it would make no sense really to go beyond their home clubs to train further north and then drive back down again past their own club again to go back to Galway.

But these types of centres mostly service underage teams, for adult teams it's going to be for day retreats or spot training in the lead up to big games. I think a big part in clubs using it will be that it'll be far more cost efffective to use this centre than any other options because of who owns it, when clubs really start looking at what they can avail of they'll be pleading with non-home based players to 'give it a go'.