Unpaid M50 toll - advice needed!

[macdanger2]

If you pay it first time then the penalties are moot.

You can't pay it until you get the letter telling you how to pay it. The point is, subsequent letters and penalties are being issued in an unreasonably short time after the previous. By the time the letter comes with instructions on how to pay, the debt collections have already issued a subsequent letter for a higher amount.

The second letter does come very quickly after the first letter TBF, 14 days as far as I know. If your car is registered at home and you live away, it's easy enough to miss it

[macdanger2]

A 5000% penalty as an incentive to pay? That's not an incentive that's pure robbery.

How much do you think he should owe for ignoring it over a thousand times? For the purposes of the discussion, can we leave out broadsides about the ripoff in general that is tolls.

'On the spot' type fines and if they're not paid, penalty points.
It looks from this system that the English firm are taking a percentage of whatever revenue is raised, so it's in their interest to maximise revenue not to collect unpaid tolls. Whatever governmental department letting this happen is obviously complicit in the scam.

You seem to have an issue with it being an English company - would it be ok if it was an Irish company ripping you off?? 

[deiseach]

The second letter does come very quickly after the first letter TBF, 14 days as far as I know. If your car is registered at home and you live away, it's easy enough to miss it

I've no doubt lots of people find themselves on a treadmill of frustration. Emails gone into spam folders, disconnections from call centres (when they can get through at all), letters crossing over in the post . . . I don't think that failure to pay in good time means you're stupid and/or dishonest. With all that in mind, let's not turn someone who fails to pay over a thousand times into a latter-day Robin Hood.

[armaghniac]

If you've missed a few, and are getting letters, they will generally waive most fines if you register an account. Yer man is well past that point.

[macdanger2]

The second letter does come very quickly after the first letter TBF, 14 days as far as I know. If your car is registered at home and you live away, it's easy enough to miss it

I've no doubt lots of people find themselves on a treadmill of frustration. Emails gone into spam folders, disconnections from call centres (when they can get through at all), letters crossing over in the post . . . I don't think that failure to pay in good time means you're stupid and/or dishonest. With all that in mind, let's not turn someone who fails to pay over a thousand times into a latter-day Robin Hood.

Oh yeah, this fella was / is just chancing his arm, I'd have little sympathy for him

[Ulick]

If you pay it first time then the penalties are moot.

You can't pay it until you get the letter telling you how to pay it. The point is, subsequent letters and penalties are being issued in an unreasonably short time after the previous. By the time the letter comes with instructions on how to pay, the debt collections have already issued a subsequent letter for a higher amount.

Bollix. If you are competent to drive a car then you should be capable of paying the fee without needing a personal letter telling you what to do.

It's not bollix. If you don't pay the toll within 24 hours then it can't be paid until the letter arrives. So let's say someone from the north going on a weekend break. If they don't stop off somewhere to pay the toll en-route then they'll not be able to pay until the letter arrives. Throw a couple of children into the mix and it's very easy to forget to stop specifically to pay a toll. Even so, it's not unreasonable to expect a fair penalty, not a 5000% penalty. 

[Ulick]

A 5000% penalty as an incentive to pay? That's not an incentive that's pure robbery.

How much do you think he should owe for ignoring it over a thousand times? For the purposes of the discussion, can we leave out broadsides about the ripoff in general that is tolls.

'On the spot' type fines and if they're not paid, penalty points.
It looks from this system that the English firm are taking a percentage of whatever revenue is raised, so it's in their interest to maximise revenue not to collect unpaid tolls. Whatever governmental department letting this happen is obviously complicit in the scam.

You seem to have an issue with it being an English company - would it be ok if it was an Irish company ripping you off?? 

No I've also mentioned the government department. Getting fu*ked over is the same no matter who is doing it.

[Ulick]

Aren't penalty points a tool of road safety? Most people who neglect to pay the toll and get hit with a fine grumble about it, pay the damn thing, and move on. Again, I'm discounting the people who are being genuinely screwed over by a computer-says-no system, although if the system is supposed to reward revenue maximisation there are surprisingly few of them. Penalty points, on the other hand, are a much more onerous penalty, likely to cause widespread distress. Bringing in that penalty to deal with the kind of person who ignores the toll over a thousand times is way over the top.

Well a fixed penalty notice would be more than sufficient. It's not a matter of a computer-says-no system. Considering that a child could design a more competent collection system, the only other conclusion is that the system is deliberately rigged to screw people over. Southerners are just so used to getting screwed over from all directions, they meekly accept and get the wallet out - e.g. pay in advance car parks which clamp you if you underestimate or get delayed.

[Ulick]

If you've missed a few, and are getting letters, they will generally waive most fines if you register an account. Yer man is well past that point.

Not so. Your details are sent off to the English company 24 hours after the toll point has been passed. Registering an account with eFlow will make no difference to what happens with the English firm. If you try to pay the toll even 25 hours after the journey on the website, there is no record of the journey, which forces you to wait until the letter comes from London.

[Bingo]

Just pay the toll when you use the M50 or register online for a free account and discounted toll charge. Its not rocket science.

If you don't want to pay the toll, avoid the bloody motorway. Its a choice.

No sympathy for your man and he is just a bloody chancer who likely wants everything but doesn't want to pay for it.

[Ulick]

Just pay the toll when you use the M50 or register online for a free account and discounted toll charge. Its not rocket science.

If you don't want to pay the toll, avoid the bloody motorway. Its a choice.

No sympathy for your man and he is just a bloody chancer who likely wants everything but doesn't want to pay for it.

Northern addresses were not included when the website first opened. As I said, have no issue with the principle of paying a toll, just the potential of a 5000% penalty if I'm five minutes late in paying it.

[deiseach]

You have to be 56 days late to be hit with a 5000% penalty.

[Bingo]

Just pay the toll when you use the M50 or register online for a free account and discounted toll charge. Its not rocket science.

If you don't want to pay the toll, avoid the bloody motorway. Its a choice.

No sympathy for your man and he is just a bloody chancer who likely wants everything but doesn't want to pay for it.

Northern addresses were not included when the website first opened. As I said, have no issue with the principle of paying a toll, just the potential of a 5000% penalty if I'm five minutes late in paying it.

I know you know this is totally incorrect. You have ample time to pay it, even when late to avoid paying a higher charge and you shouldn't really have an excuse unless you are leaving the country for a prolonged period. Even at it, paying it and remembering to pay it should be a priority.

[Ulick]

You have to be 56 days late to be hit with a 5000% penalty.

Nope, that's not what is happening unless they have northerners on a different system.

[Ulick]

Just pay the toll when you use the M50 or register online for a free account and discounted toll charge. Its not rocket science.

If you don't want to pay the toll, avoid the bloody motorway. Its a choice.

No sympathy for your man and he is just a bloody chancer who likely wants everything but doesn't want to pay for it.

Northern addresses were not included when the website first opened. As I said, have no issue with the principle of paying a toll, just the potential of a 5000% penalty if I'm five minutes late in paying it.

I know you know this is totally incorrect. You have ample time to pay it, even when late to avoid paying a higher charge and you shouldn't really have an excuse unless you are leaving the country for a prolonged period. Even at it, paying it and remembering to pay it should be a priority.

I said "potential" penalty of 5000%. If you read my previous posts you'll see how the English company (http://www.epcplc.com/) administrating the scheme have it deliberately arranged ensure that those "potential" circumstances occur a lot more than they should.