The Palestine thread

Started by give her dixie, October 17, 2012, 01:29:42 PM

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Mike Sheehy

Quote from: moysider on July 22, 2014, 11:35:27 PM
Quote from: Itchy on July 22, 2014, 10:43:04 PM
Rossiewanderer, your argument us so incredibly stupid I'm wondering are you a troll. Let me reverse this. Do you think it is reasonable for IDF to retaliate to aggression from Hamas by targeting civilian areas for shelling (illegal in international law), target hospitals and schools with the net result that 80% of victims are civilian. Is that reasonable? You should be ashamed of yourself.

It doesn t matter what Rossiewander thinks Itchy. And it doesn t matter what I think either.

But the US media and the US president don t seem to see anything unreasonable there. Neither do the British, Irish, French, German, Italian. And they do count. Israel are obviously being given carte blanche to deal with this as they see fit. I suspect they would wipe out gaza with nukes if they could without contaminating themselves. If they did use nukes at least they would know they would remain immune from criticism from the west.

Now that flights into Israel have been cancelled, expect a step up in intensity of the Gaza gig to get the job done and get the show back on the road.

Again, for the umpteenth time, what do you want them to do. Give specifics, so that a proper debate can happen.



johnneycool

Quote from: Mike Sheehy on July 23, 2014, 10:11:21 AM
Quote from: moysider on July 22, 2014, 11:35:27 PM
Quote from: Itchy on July 22, 2014, 10:43:04 PM
Rossiewanderer, your argument us so incredibly stupid I'm wondering are you a troll. Let me reverse this. Do you think it is reasonable for IDF to retaliate to aggression from Hamas by targeting civilian areas for shelling (illegal in international law), target hospitals and schools with the net result that 80% of victims are civilian. Is that reasonable? You should be ashamed of yourself.

It doesn t matter what Rossiewander thinks Itchy. And it doesn t matter what I think either.

But the US media and the US president don t seem to see anything unreasonable there. Neither do the British, Irish, French, German, Italian. And they do count. Israel are obviously being given carte blanche to deal with this as they see fit. I suspect they would wipe out gaza with nukes if they could without contaminating themselves. If they did use nukes at least they would know they would remain immune from criticism from the west.

Now that flights into Israel have been cancelled, expect a step up in intensity of the Gaza gig to get the job done and get the show back on the road.

Again, for the umpteenth time, what do you want them to do. Give specifics, so that a proper debate can happen.

Lift the embargo on Gaza and other Palestinian territories and allow Palestine to get back to some form of normality where the likes of Hamas wouldn't thrive.

The Palestinians have been backed into a corner where they had to do something, you just can't keep poking the dog and then be surprised when it tries to bite back, so you then hammer it to an inch from its life, yet blame the dog for trying to bite you!!


haveaharp

Quote from: Mike Sheehy on July 23, 2014, 10:11:21 AM
Quote from: moysider on July 22, 2014, 11:35:27 PM
Quote from: Itchy on July 22, 2014, 10:43:04 PM
Rossiewanderer, your argument us so incredibly stupid I'm wondering are you a troll. Let me reverse this. Do you think it is reasonable for IDF to retaliate to aggression from Hamas by targeting civilian areas for shelling (illegal in international law), target hospitals and schools with the net result that 80% of victims are civilian. Is that reasonable? You should be ashamed of yourself.

It doesn t matter what Rossiewander thinks Itchy. And it doesn t matter what I think either.

But the US media and the US president don t seem to see anything unreasonable there. Neither do the British, Irish, French, German, Italian. And they do count. Israel are obviously being given carte blanche to deal with this as they see fit. I suspect they would wipe out gaza with nukes if they could without contaminating themselves. If they did use nukes at least they would know they would remain immune from criticism from the west.

Now that flights into Israel have been cancelled, expect a step up in intensity of the Gaza gig to get the job done and get the show back on the road.

Again, for the umpteenth time, what do you want them to do. Give specifics, so that a proper debate can happen.

Sanctions, suspension of trade, expel diplomats for starters

seafoid

Quote from: Mike Sheehy on July 23, 2014, 10:09:02 AM
Quote from: seafoid on July 23, 2014, 09:17:41 AM
Interestingly there is no sign of MikeSheehy. He only works one on one.

I only work one on one with anti-semites.
Trolling is hard when nobody agrees with you.
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

Mike Sheehy

Quote from: johnneycool on July 23, 2014, 11:14:10 AM
Quote from: Mike Sheehy on July 23, 2014, 10:11:21 AM
Quote from: moysider on July 22, 2014, 11:35:27 PM
Quote from: Itchy on July 22, 2014, 10:43:04 PM
Rossiewanderer, your argument us so incredibly stupid I'm wondering are you a troll. Let me reverse this. Do you think it is reasonable for IDF to retaliate to aggression from Hamas by targeting civilian areas for shelling (illegal in international law), target hospitals and schools with the net result that 80% of victims are civilian. Is that reasonable? You should be ashamed of yourself.

It doesn t matter what Rossiewander thinks Itchy. And it doesn t matter what I think either.

But the US media and the US president don t seem to see anything unreasonable there. Neither do the British, Irish, French, German, Italian. And they do count. Israel are obviously being given carte blanche to deal with this as they see fit. I suspect they would wipe out gaza with nukes if they could without contaminating themselves. If they did use nukes at least they would know they would remain immune from criticism from the west.

Now that flights into Israel have been cancelled, expect a step up in intensity of the Gaza gig to get the job done and get the show back on the road.

Again, for the umpteenth time, what do you want them to do. Give specifics, so that a proper debate can happen.

Lift the embargo on Gaza and other Palestinian territories and allow Palestine to get back to some form of normality where the likes of Hamas wouldn't thrive.

The Palestinians have been backed into a corner where they had to do something, you just can't keep poking the dog and then be surprised when it tries to bite back, so you then hammer it to an inch from its life, yet blame the dog for trying to bite you!!

Well, the question was what you want the US, France, Uk etc to do but , fair enough, we can discuss this aspect as well.

"Lift the embargo"...agree with you 100%
"allow Palestine get back to normality".......agree with you 100%
"where the likes of Hamas wouldn't thrive".....I think Hamas will "thrive" as long as Israel exists in any form...that is the problem isn't it ? They are not interested in real compromise. 

There would have to be something given in return though...something that would demonstrate that there was serious intent. Wouldn't a reasonable starting point be that Hamas remove from their charter calls for the destruction of Israel and the killing of jews ? I think if you are going to negotiate from a position of good faith with someone then the bare minimum should be that you don't say your main goal is to kill them ?  Once that is given then concrete , real steps can be taken after that to show they were serious about peace.


QuoteThe Palestinians have been backed into a corner where they had to do something, you just can't keep poking the dog and then be surprised when it tries to bite back, so you then hammer it to an inch from its life, yet blame the dog for trying to bite you!!

Agree with you 100%. The way I characterize it is that if I was a Palestinian I'd want to kill every Israeli I see. No argument there.  However, if I was an Israeli  I would see this as a fight to the death. You may think that is paranoia but , given the history, it is justifiable paranoia.

The key issue from the Israeli perspective is security. You have to address that if you are serious about wanting peace in Israel/Palestine.
If you think the security issue is just an excuse then, fine, lets call their bluff......Is there something that can be done to take away that "excuse" ?

Mike Sheehy

Quote from: seafoid on July 23, 2014, 11:52:44 AM
Quote from: Mike Sheehy on July 23, 2014, 10:09:02 AM
Quote from: seafoid on July 23, 2014, 09:17:41 AM
Interestingly there is no sign of MikeSheehy. He only works one on one.

I only work one on one with anti-semites.
Trolling is hard when nobody agrees with you.

You offer nothing constructive to this debate. Your hatred of jews blinds you to any attempt at positive input.

The worst thing about you seafoid is that you view whats happening in Gaza as a point scoring exercise.

seafoid

Will you be flying el al to tel aviv in solidarity?
Rock and troll.
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

Mike Sheehy

Quote from: seafoid on July 23, 2014, 12:31:47 PM
Will you be flying el al to tel aviv in solidarity?
Rock and troll.

The airport closure will no doubt affect the Israeli company that you work for.

No more expense paid trips with sneaky visits to the S&M clubs.

whitey

2 quick comments

(1) the argument about the lob sidedness of the casualty count is comets BS. Hamas has fired  over 2000 rockets into Israel. 90% of them have been neutralized by the ingenious missile defense system the Israelis developed. Without that the Israeli count would be much higher.

(2) Not sure if it's true, but an Israeli spokesman was getting grilled on MSNBC this morning. He claimed that they issued an evacuation order for a specific neighborhood, but Hamas then came out and ordered everyone to stay put in order to maximize casualties

LeoMc

Quote from: moysider on July 22, 2014, 11:22:10 PM
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on July 22, 2014, 07:43:35 PM
What bullshit excuse did they give for shelling the hosital, some imaginary rocket launcher spotted in the operating theatre??
years ago when the suicide bombings were going on i sympathise with Israel as this was open slaughter of women and children - civilians)
but for many years now i have seen the unjustice openly handed out to palestine , and Israeli total disregard for the killing of women and children,
they could not survive dishing out the violence and slaughter without America backing, its laughable at their outrage to the going on in the Ukraine (which we all condemn)
but the same slaughter in another part of the world by one of their buddies, there not even the same condemnation,and on war terms soldiers made a choice on war to fight and die for their country, innocent woman and children do not have a choice. they have turned into the very thing they have despised and are becoming more like the Nazis who original quest for slaughter was living space for it people and that was Hitler pretense for war

Maybe but it makes no difference. The US media are backing the Israeli onslaught and backing the Israeli PM claim that the genocide is self inflicted. I wouldn t be surprised if a captured Hamas leader was put on trial for war crimes. Zero % that could happen an Israeli. Wont be even a rap accross the knuckles not a cross word about Netanyahu from any serious western leader. A hawk on Fox earlier described Israel as their 'only friend' in a hostile region and criticised Obama for being soft on Muslims and giving Palestinians financial aid in his first term. These creatures who form public opinion in US clearly don t lose sleep over dead kids. If the lot of Palestinians are wiped out they will have brought it on themselves is the spin.
Ban Ki Moons appearance in Tel Aviv was an embarrassment for anybody that thinks that the UN can do anything for the little man. Netanyahu was setting the agenda, was bullish and confident that nobody would dare challenge him . Moon s appeasing rhetoric offered little hope to the Palestian people - and there is no hope.

Israel has  free trade agreements with the European Union, the United States, Turkey, Mexico, Canada, Jordan, Egypt, and  with the Mercosur trade bloc. Nobody - not even the Muslim nations have even threatened even to impose economic sanctions on Israel. Israel have a free hand to deal with the problem as they see fit. The West is happy to accept their most risible justification for land grabbing - which is what Isreal essentially is - an exercise in land grabbing as blatant as any and then resorting to superior firepower to hold on to it. The US has a history of land grabbing itself and also of targeting civilians so Gaza is small beer for them.

Anyway the baddest wolf on the lot now for the West is Putin. That s the newsworthy heavyweight division. Those that matter don t care about Gaza.
Not a chance, if the IDF get close enough they will execute them.

LeoMc

Quote from: seafoid on July 23, 2014, 09:17:03 AM
Quote from: moysider on July 22, 2014, 11:35:27 PM
Quote from: Itchy on July 22, 2014, 10:43:04 PM
Rossiewanderer, your argument us so incredibly stupid I'm wondering are you a troll. Let me reverse this. Do you think it is reasonable for IDF to retaliate to aggression from Hamas by targeting civilian areas for shelling (illegal in international law), target hospitals and schools with the net result that 80% of victims are civilian. Is that reasonable? You should be ashamed of yourself.

It doesn t matter what Rossiewander thinks Itchy. And it doesn t matter what I think either.

But the US media and the US president don t seem to see anything unreasonable there. Neither do the British, Irish, French, German, Italian. And they do count. Israel are obviously being given carte blanche to deal with this as they see fit. I suspect they would wipe out gaza with nukes if they could without contaminating themselves. If they did use nukes at least they would know they would remain immune from criticism from the west.

Now that flights into Israel have been cancelled, expect a step up in intensity of the Gaza gig to get the job done and get the show back on the road.

Moysider

I wonder if the FAA decision on flights from the States isn't a warning from Obama to Israel to cop on .
Israel is now reported to be looking for a dignified exit from the mess it chose to start.

Monday - The Hamas rockets are so dangerous we have no choice but to go into Gaza and destroy them and everything which stands in our way.
Tuesday - Those rockets wont do any harm. Keep on flying.

haranguerer

Quote from: whitey on July 23, 2014, 12:45:28 PM
2 quick comments

(1) the argument about the lob sidedness of the casualty count is comets BS. Hamas has fired  over 2000 rockets into Israel. 90% of them have been neutralized by the ingenious missile defense system the Israelis developed. Without that the Israeli count would be much higher.

(2) Not sure if it's true, but an Israeli spokesman was getting grilled on MSNBC this morning. He claimed that they issued an evacuation order for a specific neighborhood, but Hamas then came out and ordered everyone to stay put in order to maximize casualties

Away and cop yourself on. How exactly do you think that conversation would go?

whitey

Quote from: haranguerer on July 23, 2014, 01:12:55 PM
Quote from: whitey on July 23, 2014, 12:45:28 PM
2 quick comments

(1) the argument about the lob sidedness of the casualty count is comets BS. Hamas has fired  over 2000 rockets into Israel. 90% of them have been neutralized by the ingenious missile defense system the Israelis developed. Without that the Israeli count would be much higher.

(2) Not sure if it's true, but an Israeli spokesman was getting grilled on MSNBC this morning. He claimed that they issued an evacuation order for a specific neighborhood, but Hamas then came out and ordered everyone to stay put in order to maximize casualties

Away and cop yourself on. How exactly do you think that conversation would go?

Point is Hamas are not the Legion of Marythey are violent Muslim Jihadists. They rule Gaza thru fear and intimidation and for I I can completely believe they would pull something so despicable

haranguerer

While maintaining support from these same people they're apparently ordering to stand under Israeli bombs?

Good man

whitey

Quote from: haranguerer on July 23, 2014, 01:27:57 PM
While maintaining support from these same people they're apparently ordering to stand under Israeli bombs?

Good man

Lol-you have no idea who you're dealing with here

My wife's 2 nephews served in Iraq and Afghanistan respectively. They salty with these terrorists first hand. You have no idea as to the depths these monsters will sink