Joanna Mills misses out on an Olympic place

[Applesisapples]

Radio Ulster

[Lucifer]

I believe the selection committee cited administrative reasons.  It certainly cannot be performance based as Mills has ran faster than Cuddihys PB 7 times in the past 13 months (this info comes from a friend in athletics, I know sweet FA about it myself.)

[Evil Genius]

Excuse my ignorance on this, but is it not solely based on seasons best times or are there other forces at work?

Joanna Mills misses out on Olympics after Cuddihy appeal upheld

Joanna Mills is to miss out on a place at London 2012 after Catriona Cuddihy successfully appealed to the Olympic Council of Ireland against her de-selection from the 4x400m relay team.

Cuddihy had originally been named in the six-women squad but an appeal by Mills was upheld by Athletics Ireland.

The tribunal found that the initial selection of Cuddihy had been correct based on the full range of criteria.

Mills may decide to appeal to the Court of Arbitration for Sport.

That body is sitting in London at present ahead of the Olympic Games, instead of their usual base in Lausanne, Switzerland.

Mills is currently consulting with her legal team before making a decision on whether to continue the appeals process.

It is understood that a legal technicality may have played a part in the final decision too as Athletics Ireland may have overstepped its remit in reinstating the Northern Ireland runner to the line-up.

Kilkenny City Harrier Cuddihy took her appeal to the OCI last Thursday night and the hearing, at which both of the athletes and Athletics Ireland were represented by separate legal advisors, took almost five hours.

Cuddihy was named in the original selection on 2 July even though her personal best of 54.59 was .18secs slower than Mills' seasonal best at that stage.

Since then, Mills, 19, has gone on to run times of 54.17 and 54.52 at the World Junior Championships in Barcelona where she reached the semi-finals.

"I'm really disappointed with how the whole thing has been handled, especially by Athletics Ireland, and I hope they learn from it," Mills told the BBC.

"It should just be about times and who is running faster, but other factors are coming in to play," she added.

A statement released by Athletics Ireland on Tuesday morning said they accepted the OCI's decision, but lessons would be learned from the entire process.

"The experience has been a significant learning one for the Association," admitted Athletics Ireland in their statement.

"In that regard the selection and appeals process to date will form part of an overall review of the preparation for London and the performance of Irish athletes there.

Athletics Ireland Chief Executive John Foley added: "We have to acknowledge that the past three weeks has been enormously difficult for the athletes involved in this appeal process, their families, supporters and friends.

"At this point however there is a final decision as to selection and we believe that it is now in the interests of all that we focus our attention on the Games themselves."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/olympics/18966792

[nifan]

The tribunal found that the initial selection of Cuddihy had been correct based on the full range of criteria.

What was the criteria is the question. Mills statement seemed to indicate that the performance director indicated "commitment to the relay team" as a reason, though she cites her own commitment in the statement.

Feel sorry for the girl, but id guess more nepotism at play than sectarianism here.

[Newbridge Exile]

Is it any wonder Unionists try to avoid All-Ireland sporting bodies given the treatment of Joanna Mills, half a second faster than her rival, who's dad just happens to be the team doctor! it's amazing in the year that Nationalists in the North have finally begun to get a semblance of equality from our Unionist brethren, and not too long after "Ireland" embraces Liz ans Phil like long lost cousins we see an outbreak of anti nordie feeling from the South...and from those who think Daley Thompson's remarks were racist too...Pot, kettle, black (no pun intended).

This is a very confused and confusing post. On one hand, you're suggesting it's nepotism, yet you also appear to be implying it's sectarian. Which is it? Because each one is a totally different argument.

No I don't think its sectarian, but it has been reported in NI as being a mix of North vs South and nepotism. I don't think myself that that is necessarily the case but I do believe on results she should have been included. The point I'm making is that it feeds the notion that Northerners don't get a fair shake.

Where has it been reported as north vs south?

By Sidebottom on Radio Ulster earlier today

[AQMP]

Whilst some of my original post was meant to be provocative, two things have emerged that do athletics no favours. Firstly the perception in Unionist quarters (and the suspicion in nationalist ones) is that the selection was based on where the two were from, north vs south. Secondly the whole saga has portrayed Athletics Ireland in a very bad light. Even if it was only the case of Daddy's girls being on the plane it is still a mess.

Frankly there's absolutely no evidence that this is an issue.

I'm not convinced that Mills was overlooked solely because she is from NI. But I wouldn't be surprised if the selectors thought they would get away more easily with overlooking her because she is from NI. And if so, then the distinction won't be of any consolation to the girl herself.

Further, since the girl is very young, she might have decided just to keep her head down and wait her turn etc. but the fact that she (her Coach, actually) raised her case so publicly means he must be risking her standing with Irish Athletics administrators for the future. This suggests to me a very heightened sense of injustice on the part of Coach and Athlete.

There are plenty of Northern athletes who have represented Ireland in the past and there'll be plenty more in the future.

Yes, because their record merited their selection and their performances were hoped to benefit Ireland etc.

Or to put it another way, can you ever see any circumstances when someone might be prompted to point out that "There are plenty of Southern athletes who have represented Ireland in the past and there'll be plenty more in the future."

Off the top of my head the two triathlon participants are both from the north as are two of the boxers at least one the cyclists etc.

So?

Or should we infer from that that their inclusion somehow "cancels out" her non-inclusion? 

I would agree that the whole selection process has been a shambles

The word "shambles" denotes incompetence, such as the selectors not appreciating her ability/availability/fitness etc.

What is being alleged here is more of a scandal i.e. the selectors knew all about her and her credentials for inclusion, but still consciously overlooked her for reasons of nepotism etc

... but as TYP pointed out GB left out the world ranked no 1 in some form of taekwando.

So if another country demonstrates favouritism when selecting their team, that makes it OK for Ireland to do so, then?

Cuddihy was originally selected and Mills appealed that decision and now Cuddihy has had her appeal upheld.

And it seems that Mills (her Coach) may now appeal to the Court of Arbitration in Sport, the highest body, despite the Games only being 3 days away.

If nothing else, this must all be seriously unsettling for the rest of the relay team, who (presumably) have nothing to answer for in this whole hoo-haa.

FWIW, Mills should be there as she's clearly the better athlete and better looking, but this is the Olympics...

Eh?

EG I think you've misunderstood the thrust of my post.  I think Mills should have been selected and that the selection of Cuddihy is wrong, however apart from the ramblings of Mark Sidebottom (he's got his own thread on the main board) there seems to be no evidence (yet) that Mills was de-selected because she is from the North or that there is an anti-northern bias within Athletics Ireland.

[Tony Baloney]

Joke decision but is expected in Ireland. Being the best should be only criteria for selection.

[Gold]

The Scoop. 4 runners, 2 reserves. 4 runners (starters) picked were then asked by management who they wanted to be reserves. One Cuddihy obviously wanted her sister to be one and so she was picked. Alot of those girls are good friends for years and picked their friend/family. It shouldnt have been the athlete's choice.

Typical of Irish Athletics that better athlete wasnt picked. Poor management.

But relay runners are not picked solely on flat times. Relay is more complicated than that and handovers etc have to be right so maybe Cuddihy was stronger there and had more experience of relays or of big events. But doubtful. Typical of us and GAA style "i'll play my sons and f uck the fella who's da isnt involved in club but is better."

Heads will roll over it.

But what did we expect? This is the organisation who gave Melanie Knocker goggles that were too big for her and fell off mid-race. The organisation who fought with Sonia O'Sullivan over gear and near pulled gear off her in the tunnel before going out in the Olympics. Farce

Hard for Mills if she does (how could she mix with team) or doesnt get picked

[TacadoirArdMhacha]

Has Cuddihy championship experience in the relay or significantly more experience in relays? These are genuine questions, I don't know the answers but suspect they could be relevant. Stephen Watson was positively salivating at the prospect of turning this into a North v South issue and suggesting Mills may want to declare for the UK.

As a 19 year old athlete with presumably a brighter future than Cuddihy ahead of her, Mills would seem the more natural choice but considering an athlete's record in relays would seem a reasonable criteron in selecting a relay team and it would be interesting to see how this affected matters. Without knowing the rules, it may also be that the times recorded after the original decision cannot be taken into account.

[imtommygunn]

This is a farce of a decision- better pb and better sb which is also better than the other girls pb. One reason they originally gave was potential - mills is 6 years younger and is already quicker so that doesn't add up.

In terms of commitment to relay mills went to Europeans but couldn't run as she was being rested until the final due to world juniors and then the team were disqualified in he semis. That would suggest she also had the commitment.

Irish athletics should hang their heads in shame for the position they have put these two girls in.

Mills is entitled to a place at the Olympics and you never know what could happen in 4 years so this could be her only chance so she should appeal. The unsettling has already been done.

Olympic selection is discretionary. There are a few other puzzling ones out there - Kenyan mens marathon, British 800 metres women and a few American ones too. It's not necessarily "sectarianism" but I would say who you are would have a bearing.

[lawnseed]

why dont they have a race and the winner gets the gig.. i'm not joking young mills should challenge the other girl

[Hound]

I'd be farily sure its nothing to do with North v South.

On the initial committee that selected Cuddihy there was one person from the south, one from the north, and one foreigner.
The appeals committee who then went for Mills was made up of 3 from the south.
Not sure what the Olympic Council make up was who decided they should go back to the original decision.

It does come down to politics. Cuddihy has been targeting the relay for the last 18 months or more, and taking part in all the relevant relay training etc. Mills has missed a lot of that as her primary target was the World Juniors.

Neither had a good enough time to qualify for the individual 400m.

You would think it would be a slam dunk to pick the person with the best time (i.e. Mills), but I can see why they made the initial decision to go with Cuddihy, given she's more part of the team, and her sister being our best 400m runner probably paid a part too, and in any event neither is likely to see any track time being ranked number 6 in a 4 person event! And we're not like the Americans that we can rest our best in the heats.

Intererstingly one of the other 400m relay runners is Jessie Barr who is supposed to be a great prospect in the 400m hurdles. While she has a B time for that event, she just missed out on the A time. She could have been picked for the 400m hurdles, but we decided to only pick people who have the A time.

However, given she was good enough to be picked for the relay team, it does seem ridiculous not to allow her take part in the 400m hurdles individual event also, which could only help her development. She could still also take part in the relay, but it would mean we would be allowed pick both Mills and Cuddihy as 5 and 6 in the relay (even though they'd be effectively 6 and 7 - neither would have much chance of track time, but it would have avoided all the mess and angst).

[johnneycool]

I'd be farily sure its nothing to do with North v South.

On the initial committee that selected Cuddihy there was one person from the south, one from the north, and one foreigner.
The appeals committee who then went for Mills was made up of 3 from the south.
Not sure what the Olympic Council make up was who decided they should go back to the original decision.

It does come down to politics. Cuddihy has been targeting the relay for the last 18 months or more, and taking part in all the relevant relay training etc. Mills has missed a lot of that as her primary target was the World Juniors.

Neither had a good enough time to qualify for the individual 400m.

You would think it would be a slam dunk to pick the person with the best time (i.e. Mills), but I can see why they made the initial decision to go with Cuddihy, given she's more part of the team, and her sister being our best 400m runner probably paid a part too, and in any event neither is likely to see any track time being ranked number 6 in a 4 person event! And we're not like the Americans that we can rest our best in the heats.

Intererstingly one of the other 400m relay runners is Jessie Barr who is supposed to be a great prospect in the 400m hurdles. While she has a B time for that event, she just missed out on the A time. She could have been picked for the 400m hurdles, but we decided to only pick people who have the A time.

However, given she was good enough to be picked for the relay team, it does seem ridiculous not to allow her take part in the 400m hurdles individual event also, which could only help her development. She could still also take part in the relay, but it would mean we would be allowed pick both Mills and Cuddihy as 5 and 6 in the relay (even though they'd be effectively 6 and 7 - neither would have much chance of track time, but it would have avoided all the mess and angst).

It seems that this A time grading is solely set by the Irish olympic committee, possibly to cut costs, but as you rightly point out Jessie Barr is already going as part of the relay team, so why not enter her in the hurdles as well?

The likes of Ciara Mageean will also lose out by not reaching the A grade time this year even though there'll be athletes from other countries competing with slower seasons bests.

It's a bit short sighted of the Irish Olympic committee in denying these young athletes a chance to dip their toes in an Olympics.

[Capt Pat]

It was all southerners who selected Mills  so she camn not say that being from the north didn't help.

I think it is a problem caused that the more talented younger runner did not commit to the relay team so she was not selected. In relation to nepotism. Joanne Cuddihy might have had some say being the star runner on the team. But it was Mills that didn't give herself a vouce as being a team member by not attending team practice sessions etc

If I was picking the team now I would have picked Mills but if I was the coach who had said "attend traing sessions if you want to be on the team" I would have to select Cuddihy in order to be fair to the team and keep them happy, one of whom happens to be Cuddihy senior.

[ludermor]

Lawnseed seems to be only concerned with athletes from the North who have missed out on selection, surely sectarian in itself.