Suicide

[Cold tea]

Depression can be treated, there is studies to suggest that deficient serotonin levels may be genetic, it is also why young men are more susceptible as girls have larger amounts of serotonin.  Of course noone really knows and each new death bring massive heartache to all concerned especially the poor family who think they should have done more, should have read the signs etc. 

[Cold tea]

I'm not aware of the statistics and I don't have proof to back this up but I consider the misuse of alcohol, especially among young men to be a strong contributing factor to the suicide rate. You can talk about getting people to "talk about things" and "recognizing signs" but if we really want to tackle suicide at its roots then our attitude to drink has to change. Attitudes that include the idea that people being wasted is funny especially if it's someone you know and that alcohol is almost a mandatory part of any celebration.

If you have no proof maybe you should stop spouting crap.

Your very short on proof yourself. What lofty position have you to speak down from on these matters? Treatment of depression with serotonin is no more successful than lithium, thyroxine or even ECT. The chemical interactions in the brain are extremely complex and as such leads it to being difficult to treat, often it takes a long time to reach a successful treatment.

and in most cases if the patient is prevented from one attempt they will surely succeed in another.

That's spouting crap. You are saying that most of the time if doctors or therapists intervene in a case then they are often destined to take there own life anyway? That's the type of attitude that leads to such a high suicide rate in the first place. "ah sure there is nothing we could have done anyway".

I unfortunately have known several people who took their own lives, none of them were being treated for depression, none of them had any outward signs anything was wrong, so in these cases unfortunately nothing could have been done, they are totally unexplained as no one was aware to intervene, being depressed and seeking help is different from going about your daily life and then ending it in the blink of an eye.  People who seek help or need help should receive all the help that there is but for you to disrespect people who have committed sucide and their families by suggesting through your amazing world view that drink is a contributing factor is a disgrace and you should be ashmed of yourself for spouting such crap.  This is a highly emotional thread and I in no way wish to get into any rows and disrespect the seriousness of this topic and the memory or Jim's friend, I was highlighting my own experience and sharing years of reasearch that my friends mum had carried out and not making a rash opinion.

[nrico2006]

I remember in Strabane 7 or 8 years ago two brothers in their 30's hung themselves in the same spot in their attic within a month of each other, while I read in a Sunday paper a few months back about Philip Magee who was on X-Factor one year and how 2 of his brothers committed suicide.  There seems to be a few cases of this in Belfast where parents have had 2 or 3 children committing suicide, I know the McComb family have been hit hard by it.

[seafoid]

I remember in Strabane 7 or 8 years ago two brothers in their 30's hung themselves in the same spot in their attic within a month of each other, while I read in a Sunday paper a few months back about Philip Magee who was on X-Factor one year and how 2 of his brothers committed suicide.  There seems to be a few cases of this in Belfast where parents have had 2 or 3 children committing suicide, I know the McComb family have been hit hard by it.

Northern Ireland has a very high suicide rate compared to the South or the European average.
260 reported in 2009 (there were probably more) for a population of 1.6 million which is 16 or so per 100k versus around 12 for the South .
http://www.nisra.gov.uk/archive/demography/publications/births_deaths/deaths_2009.pdf
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_suicide_rate

[The Iceman]

There are some very interesting statistics in the book freakenomics or the tipping point -I can't remember which one. It basically said that suicide was one of those things that are subconsciously triggered by the suicides of others. From what I remember it gave the analogy of a red light at a pedestrian crossing. Most people will stand and wait for the wee green man, but if one person steps out so many more cross with them. They say this same mentality (on a larger scale and obviously in a much more scientific manner than I am presenting here) can explain why siblings and friends often commit suicide. Why suicide rates peak when celebrities and public figures commit suicide. I think they showed that when Marilyn Monroe committed suicide there was an extraordinary peak in road traffic accidents, attempted suicides and suicides.....

[haveaharp]

Thats hard to get the head around. Not dismissing the theory at all, one thing i've noticed within one circle of friends of mine, is that it almost seems a fashion to be on medication and claim depression. A matriarch figure within the family telling them not to go to docs have some of my happy tabs. And they take it in like its a family history thing. I know one guy that has threatened suicide at least 20 times, and oddly enough never manages it, yet ive known people with no sign and killed themselves with no warning. There is no legislating for it.

[sammymaguire]

Social / human acceptance can be very dangerous in how Iceman describes

[Hardy]

There's a lot of research-based evidence for "imitative suicide", as it's called. One of the most striking examples is the Vienna Subway study. The media have a big role to play.

[ONeill]

Suicide rates soar after peace deal


Suicide rates in Northern Ireland have doubled since the signing of the Good Friday peace agreement in 1998, new research has revealed.
Queen's University in Belfast found suicide levels have soared since the end of the Troubles, though the deaths are occurring among those who grew up during the worst years of violence.

Social upheaval was said to have caused "mass medication" through anti-depressants, alcohol and illegal drug use, while aggression that was once widespread in the divided society has become more internalised.

The overall rate of suicide in Northern Ireland doubled in the decade following the Good Friday agreement, rising from 8.6 per 100,000 of the population in 1998 to 16 per 100,000 by 2010. Researchers also found that levels of self-harm in Londonderry far exceeded the rates detected in other major cities in Britain and the Irish Republic.

Professor Mike Tomlinson said suicide prevention strategies in Northern Ireland are failing to combat the rise, and said they could be targeting the wrong age groups.

"The rise in suicide rates in the decade from 1998 to 2008 coincide with the move from conflict to peace in Northern Ireland," he said. "The increase in suicide rates can be attributed to a complex range of social and psychological factors. These include the growth in social isolation, poor mental health arising from the experience of conflict, and the greater political stability of the past decade."

He added: "The transition to peace means that cultures of externalised aggression are no longer socially approved or politically acceptable. Violence and aggression have become more internalised instead.

"We seem to have adjusted to peace by means of mass medication with anti-depressants, alcohol and non-prescription drugs, the consumption of which has risen dramatically in the period of peace."

His research, which examined death registration data over the last 40 years, found that the highest suicide rate is for men aged 35-44 (41 per 100,000 by 2010), followed closely by the 25-34 and 45-54 age groups.

The findings showed that children who grew up in the worst years of violence between 1969 and 1977-78 are the group which now has the highest suicide rates and the most rapidly increasing rates of all age groups.



http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/suicide-rates-soar-after-peace-deal-16189296.html#ixzz21aO9zK4k

[Eamonnca1]

There are some very interesting statistics in the book freakenomics or the tipping point -I can't remember which one. It basically said that suicide was one of those things that are subconsciously triggered by the suicides of others. From what I remember it gave the analogy of a red light at a pedestrian crossing. Most people will stand and wait for the wee green man, but if one person steps out so many more cross with them. They say this same mentality (on a larger scale and obviously in a much more scientific manner than I am presenting here) can explain why siblings and friends often commit suicide. Why suicide rates peak when celebrities and public figures commit suicide. I think they showed that when Marilyn Monroe committed suicide there was an extraordinary peak in road traffic accidents, attempted suicides and suicides.....

Sounds about right. I've heard about suicide "clusters" before.  The power of suggestion can be considerable.  When people are at the bottom it probably doesn't take much to push them over the edge.

[bcarrier]

There are some very interesting statistics in the book freakenomics or the tipping point -I can't remember which one. It basically said that suicide was one of those things that are subconsciously triggered by the suicides of others. From what I remember it gave the analogy of a red light at a pedestrian crossing. Most people will stand and wait for the wee green man, but if one person steps out so many more cross with them. They say this same mentality (on a larger scale and obviously in a much more scientific manner than I am presenting here) can explain why siblings and friends often commit suicide. Why suicide rates peak when celebrities and public figures commit suicide. I think they showed that when Marilyn Monroe committed suicide there was an extraordinary peak in road traffic accidents, attempted suicides and suicides.....

Sounds about right. I've heard about suicide "clusters" before.  The power of suggestion can be considerable.  When people are at the bottom it probably doesn't take much to push them over the edge.

It is discussed in Tipping Point.

[Sandino]

I'm not aware of the statistics and I don't have proof to back this up but I consider the misuse of alcohol, especially among young men to be a strong contributing factor to the suicide rate. You can talk about getting people to "talk about things" and "recognizing signs" but if we really want to tackle suicide at its roots then our attitude to drink has to change. Attitudes that include the idea that people being wasted is funny especially if it's someone you know and that alcohol is almost a mandatory part of any celebration.

If you have no proof maybe you should stop spouting crap.

Cold Tea, do not shot the messenger. The link between alcohol misuse and suicide is well researched and well proven.  In fact, in Ireland the reality is that we need to tackle our alcohol misuse problem. It is impacting on us across all areas of society, suicide being just one area where its impact is clear, most people live in self denial.
One theory is that because of the young age at which Irish people start to misuse alcohol it may hotwire the brain causing problems in later life. The brain is not being allowed to develop in a normal manner. Recent research by Zest in Derry suggests that the impact of alcohol misuse on suicide and self harm may be even higher that the current statistics suggest.

https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:0kqDU7gB2TsJ:www.rcpsych.ac.uk/pdf/Alcohol%2520%26%2520Mental%2520Health%2520Fact%2520Sheet.pdf+link+between+alcohol+and+suicide+in+northern+ireland&hl=en&gl=uk&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESjlqsd6zw_YGCYbLySkVC4Fu5pXg4pgYkq-g3aXbcMYK8_GH8VkElIW0uf5uyPv-hcZwHnYWUwFVrcdv0CEI2hpYDS3GTx7iAFrDZKX0puI6o6cPQAuWMs-zX3xK1uAUGikDtMR&sig=AHIEtbTgsuYE01HyYzvkeG6ZXjg3KJ612g
It is telling that the Suicide Prevention and Alcohol misuse strategies are now being linked at regional level, at least in the north.
Given the links between alcohol misuse and suicide the GAA's ASAP programme would be an excellent means to tackle the issue of suicide within clubs. Cold Tea and others do all make valid points but this is one very confusing, painful and challenging subject.