EURO 2012

[Bingo]

Its surprising how many players playing that aren't regulars with their clubs - for example, Sweden had a right back playing who can hardly get a game at Celtic. So at least Whelan starts regular for Stoke and looking at Greece and the Czechs yesterday, I'd be disappointed if Ireland couldn't beat either of them and Whelan could get a game with either.


I doubt that either of them are playing for their ball retention abilities though.

On another note, Skys coverage is quite sad. Its unreal the type of coverage they give an event that they don't have the rights to. Last night they mentioned 3 news items around the tournement before they actually give the results - the arrests in Warsaw, suspected racist abuse in the Spain/Italy match and an Italian player say he hoped there was no gays in the village! They are protraying it as everything going wrong for the hosts and all the fears pre-tournement been realised. They can be really petty considering now much hype they can generate for a darts match. I suppose that is there business though.

[Declan]

comfortable on the ball

Jesus I hate that phrase. Everyone in our team is a professional and comfortable on the ball  - they can all control the ball and pass it - it's not that difficult. The difference is being able to do it at speed and under pressure which some of our lads aren't. Trap recognises this and so has set up the team to stop people playing and to take our chances from set pieces etc.

To me it comes down to the coaches philosophy on the game .Look at Swansea, Wigan etc -. Would you say that they would all get onto the Spanish/German teams - no but they are encouraged to play the game in a certain manner. Traps' outlook is different. I hate it myself but his job was to get us to the Euros. He did that so I had no real expectations from the tournament except to hope we had a chance going into the last game with a point - doesn't look like that will happen now -Still heading over though

Very enjoyable game last night and no one will tell me that we cannot try to play the game in the same manner - it's a cop out

[J OGorman]

comfortable on the ball

Jesus I hate that phrase. Everyone in our team is a professional and comfortable on the ball  - they can all control the ball and pass it - it's not that difficult. The difference is being able to do it at speed and under pressure which some of our lads aren't. Trap recognises this and so has set up the team to stop people playing and to take our chances from set pieces etc.

To me it comes down to the coaches philosophy on the game .Look at Swansea, Wigan etc -. Would you say that they would all get onto the Spanish/German teams - no but they are encouraged to play the game in a certain manner. Traps' outlook is different. I hate it myself but his job was to get us to the Euros. He did that so I had no real expectations from the tournament except to hope we had a chance going into the last game with a point - doesn't look like that will happen now -Still heading over though

Very enjoyable game last night and no one will tell me that we cannot try to play the game in the same manner - it's a cop out

so what your saying is everyone in the team IS comfortable on the ball, if say, they were playing at the Astro Pk in Tallaght for example. But, in an international tournament were the game is played at speed (as all football at a good level is), they are not? So therefore they are not overly comfortable on the ball

The first 20 mins of tomorrow nights match is gonna be mighty.

[AZOffaly]

comfortable on the ball

Jesus I hate that phrase. Everyone in our team is a professional and comfortable on the ball  - they can all control the ball and pass it - it's not that difficult. The difference is being able to do it at speed and under pressure which some of our lads aren't. Trap recognises this and so has set up the team to stop people playing and to take our chances from set pieces etc.

To me it comes down to the coaches philosophy on the game .Look at Swansea, Wigan etc -. Would you say that they would all get onto the Spanish/German teams - no but they are encouraged to play the game in a certain manner. Traps' outlook is different. I hate it myself but his job was to get us to the Euros. He did that so I had no real expectations from the tournament except to hope we had a chance going into the last game with a point - doesn't look like that will happen now -Still heading over though

Very enjoyable game last night and no one will tell me that we cannot try to play the game in the same manner - it's a cop out

I give you Dirk Kuyt.


I agree we could try and play that way, but it takes time to implement, and it needs a complete shift in mentality from coaches and players. Most of our lads don't play in teams like Swansea or West Brom week in week out, and so the idea of 20 or 30 passes in a move is alien to them.

Trap tries to be the most effective he can be without undergoing a seismic shift. I'd love to see it, and I don't see why we can't control the ball, pass to a green shirt and move into position to receive a pass. And Barcelona are amongst the best in the world at working hard to win it back, especially in those 6 seconds after they lose it. So 'hard work' and 'passing football' are not mutually exclusive ideas.

[Declan]

so what your saying is everyone in the team IS comfortable on the ball, if say, they were playing at the Astro Pk in Tallaght for example. But, in an international tournament were the game is played at speed (as all football at a good level is), they are not? So therefore they are not overly comfortable on the ball

Eh no - I was saying that I hate the phrase comfortable on the ball and it's thrown around to confuse. All our guys are professional footballers and therefore are as comfortable on the ball as any of their counterparts. What separates the really good class players is the ability to make decisions and execute at speed and under pressure.

I agree we could try and play that way, but it takes time to implement, and it needs a complete shift in mentality from coaches and players. Most of our lads don't play in teams like Swansea or West Brom week in week out, and so the idea of 20 or 30 passes in a move is alien to them.

Actually that's the ironic part about it it - all our underage academies are structured to coach and play in this way from U11 upwards so I smile when I see lads that have come through this system being labelled as technically inferior!

So 'hard work' and 'passing football' are not mutually exclusive ideas.

Agree 100%

[AZOffaly]

Actually that's the ironic part about it it - all our underage academies are structured to coach and play in this way from U11 upwards so I smile when I see lads that have come through this system being labelled as technically inferior!

Is that not relatively recent though? I remember when I was playing soccer, even at underage, the motto was 'get it up to the strikers and support them', and 'don't be bringing it down for the opposition'

[Bingo]

Declan, I think you away off. Massive arguments been made that the English academies and domestic soccer is miles away from the continent. It much like the faults been labelled at GAA underage structures in the recent past.

Its all about physicality and size, win at all costs at that level and as a result big phsyical players are used to dominate opposition and get results. Winning is everything. Smaller, more skillful players are left to one side at many levels. In many of these countries, they don't even play in compeitive leagues and its all about inhouse development, playing tournements and small sided games. 11-a-side at U10/U12 is laughable but its still the main way the game is played, only recently have they voted to change the game to implement more continental structures to leagues and underage team sizes in the UK. You'll see it follow over here.

Yes, a professional player will be comfortable on the ball but every player has different levels of abilities and thats the measuring stick. Its the speed of first touch that is the difference.

[Declan]

Is that not relatively recent though? I remember when I was playing soccer, even at underage, the motto was 'get it up to the strikers and support them', and 'don't be bringing it down for the opposition

Well I've been involved for the last 10 years or so at that level via acadamies and it's always been the emphasis so yes relatively recent in the overall scheme of things.

Bingo I don't disagree with you on the root causes of the situation as per your second paragraph but in Dublin we've had small sided leagues for years now up to U11/12 age groups.

I could speak for hours on it but your right in what you say about levels of ability I just hate the way the comment about being comfortable in possession etc is thrown about

[Billys Boots]

Like Declan, I've been involved in coaching and academy structures for the past several years and I'd agree with his points.

The target(s) for our more accomplished players, who want a career in the game, are obviously the English and Scottish clubs, in the main.  Those clubs tend to pick the players that best suit the game they play, i.e. big, physically strong players, and that is their main criterion for selection of 'apprentices'.  Thus, and this has been the case for quite a while, our selection from the professional ranks is going to be limited to players of that type.  So until our players have a different career path (which is unlikely) we will be confined to playing the 'English game' (or some derivative) internationally. 

Wes Houlihan is a case in point - always a gifted footballer technically, he never had a chance of being picked as an underage player for an apprenticeship; he played for Shelbourne in the LOI for several years before moving to the lower tiers of the English Leagues (Huddersfield initially, I think).  His 'game' was never the 'English game' (and I think he'd have done better in the Dutch, Belgian or French leagues, but that's for another day), but he persevered and now plays intermittently in the Premier League with Norwich.  He's done well in the last season, but I don't forsee a queue for his signature if Norwich are relegated - similarly I don't see him making the international squad, under this manager or indeed any other. 

[Declan]

On a more positive note here's the legend Kevin Kilbane
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hLV9WyrfsbU&feature=player_embedded

[Hardy]

Irish fan violence in Poznan

[AZOffaly]

Quick, and possibly pointless question, but does anyone know why the goal line officials stand on the same side of the goals as the linesman on that side? I'll try to explain..

The linesmen are obviously on opposite sides of the pitch, and one of them patrols from halfway down to goal A for offsides, while the other lad patrols half way to goal B.

However, it seems as if the goalline officials on the endlines for goals A and B are positioned on the same side of the pitch as the linesman at that end? Why is that I wonder? You'd imagine they'd be better off on the other side of the goal, and then between all 3 officials at that end (including the ref) they'd have all angles covered?

[Denn Forever]

Its a puzzle but does it matter which side of the goal he is? 

[AZOffaly]

I think they always go on that side, certainly when I noticed it and checked afterwards. But I'd have thought they'd be better off on the other side that way the three officials in that area would have different fields of vision. G = Goalline Official, A = Linesman, R = Ref


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[Bingo]

It doesn't matter where they stand, I've never seen them make a decision. Nothing more than umpires trying to see if the ball crosses the line.