Author Topic: Antrim Football Thread  (Read 2323698 times)

Hejustkeepsdroppingballs

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Re: Antrim Football Thread
« Reply #16500 on: October 11, 2018, 09:40:24 AM »
themac_23 quote:

'Should be aligned with the leagues, the thing being even this year, the best div 2 teams didnít actually play IFC they played SFC in st Bridgetís and Aldergrove. Makes a bit of a mockery that youíve 2 div 2 teams playing senior yet a mid table div 1 playing intermediate, not all the clubs fault the county should set it out at the start of the year'



St Brigids didn't play intermediate as they won it last year and had to go up even though they asked to be kept in intermediate but rightly so they were told no

Aldergorve did play in it but were beat comfortably in the premlim stage by Gort Na Mona

St Endas worthy favourites but Gort Na Mona will give it a good rattle and might surprise a few.
« Last Edit: October 11, 2018, 09:42:11 AM by Hejustkeepsdroppingballs »

outinfront

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Re: Antrim Football Thread
« Reply #16501 on: October 11, 2018, 10:08:05 AM »
Totally agree that Championship should be aligned with league positions across all counties (and promotion up the grade if you win one the previous year eg JFC to IFC). 

It would do away with any of the arguing about "they shouldn't be in this grade".  If your league position dictates that you are senior, even if its a tough ask, then so be it.

There may be arguments against this, thoughts?

On a side note, St Endas have made brilliant progress.  Played them a few years ago in preseason and have had the benefits of some of the young lads playing on our school teams.  Good luck to them in the final and it would be good to see them play at senior for the foreseeable.

Peileadoir

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Re: Antrim Football Thread
« Reply #16502 on: October 11, 2018, 10:16:29 AM »
St . Enda's  knew that some people would find it strange that they entered the IFC but most people probably dont know that they have never won any adult county football championship at either Junior, Intermediate or Senior grade in their history. They played senior for most of the 90's and noughties before dropping down to intermediate so seem to have set their sights on winning their first title before they consider themselves a proper senior club. If more established clubs like Rossa and the Johnnies can enter and win intermediate grade championships why cant they aspire to that too.
Big favourites for the final but write off Gorts at their peril. In Sean McKenna they have a very astute coach who will have them set up really well.

themac_23

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Re: Antrim Football Thread
« Reply #16503 on: October 11, 2018, 10:36:46 AM »
themac_23 quote:

'Should be aligned with the leagues, the thing being even this year, the best div 2 teams didnít actually play IFC they played SFC in st Bridgetís and Aldergrove. Makes a bit of a mockery that youíve 2 div 2 teams playing senior yet a mid table div 1 playing intermediate, not all the clubs fault the county should set it out at the start of the year'



St Brigids didn't play intermediate as they won it last year and had to go up even though they asked to be kept in intermediate but rightly so they were told no

Aldergorve did play in it but were beat comfortably in the premlim stage by Gort Na Mona

St Endas worthy favourites but Gort Na Mona will give it a good rattle and might surprise a few.

Apologies, youíre correct aldergrove did play IFC. My point is that it shouldnít be down to clubs to chose what level they play at, I donít blame the clubs I blame lack of clarity from the county.

Hectic

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Re: Antrim Football Thread
« Reply #16504 on: October 11, 2018, 10:44:03 AM »
to be fair i was wondering that about Glenravel this year. they won the junior in 2016 and went up for one year and then straight back down again and win it again. whats the point in that? All they did was prove that they are still a strong junior team. Cant see any merit in how that will ever improve a team.

My bro in law lives up there and from what he's told me, they had 5 retirements at the start of the year and 2 in the states. 4 came back to play through the year.

Still a Div 3 team and may be again next year with them, Antrim, Ardoyne and Lisburn all pushing for 2 promotion places. Endas had a very solid season in Div 1 thanks to developing over the years in the SW  ::)

The Gs Man

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Re: Antrim Football Thread
« Reply #16505 on: October 11, 2018, 10:49:33 AM »
He will say St. Endaís arenít a Belfast team....

And you are correct! They could be SW or NA.. donít forget SA couldnít cater for their teams a few years back so they came to the dark side  ;)

Next thing you'll be telling us is Aghagallon are an Armagh team!   ;)
Keep 'er lit

Hectic

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Re: Antrim Football Thread
« Reply #16506 on: October 11, 2018, 10:59:35 AM »
St . Enda's  knew that some people would find it strange that they entered the IFC but most people probably dont know that they have never won any adult county football championship at either Junior, Intermediate or Senior grade in their history. They played senior for most of the 90's and noughties before dropping down to intermediate so seem to have set their sights on winning their first title before they consider themselves a proper senior club. If more established clubs like Rossa and the Johnnies can enter and win intermediate grade championships why cant they aspire to that too.
Big favourites for the final but write off Gorts at their peril. In Sean McKenna they have a very astute coach who will have them set up really well.

Yeah look no doubt different clubs will have differing reasons for the choices they make. As an earlier poster has said it is not the clubs fault but rather the county for presenting such options.

Hectic

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Re: Antrim Football Thread
« Reply #16507 on: October 11, 2018, 11:01:26 AM »
He will say St. Endaís arenít a Belfast team....

And you are correct! They could be SW or NA.. donít forget SA couldnít cater for their teams a few years back so they came to the dark side  ;)

Next thing you'll be telling us is Aghagallon are an Armagh team!   ;)

Armagh schooling prob a good help. As is Derry schooling for Creggan.

Dunloy realist

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Re: Antrim Football Thread
« Reply #16508 on: October 11, 2018, 11:51:19 AM »
to be fair i was wondering that about Glenravel this year. they won the junior in 2016 and went up for one year and then straight back down again and win it again. whats the point in that? All they did was prove that they are still a strong junior team. Cant see any merit in how that will ever improve a team.

My bro in law lives up there and from what he's told me, they had 5 retirements at the start of the year and 2 in the states. 4 came back to play through the year.

to be fair that can impact into a senior team but thats a problem for the internal structures within a club that the minors arent progressing into the adult set up.
hurl like f**k boi!

Belfast GAA man

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Re: Antrim Football Thread
« Reply #16509 on: October 11, 2018, 12:35:38 PM »
I see that the Derry SFC final is scheduled for the same day - that could affect attendance.

You think the Cargin ones will go to the Derry final instead?  ;)

Both Cargin and Creggan (and both Managers) have the strong backbone of Derry education.  You would probably be surprised at the amount of people disgruntled with the two finals being on the same day
don't be worrying about the managers turning up as they are paid mercenaries - sad to see these big clubs with big memberships and tradition going down the mercenary road

Spike

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Re: Antrim Football Thread
« Reply #16510 on: October 11, 2018, 12:48:48 PM »
I see that the Derry SFC final is scheduled for the same day - that could affect attendance.

You think the Cargin ones will go to the Derry final instead?  ;)

Both Cargin and Creggan (and both Managers) have the strong backbone of Derry education.  You would probably be surprised at the amount of people disgruntled with the two finals being on the same day
don't be worrying about the managers turning up as they are paid mercenaries - sad to see these big clubs with big memberships and tradition going down the mercenary road

Not too many of the 'Big Clubs' in Antrim that have not used mercenaries in the past few years.  Certainly not an ideal situation but its probably a typical situation in most big clubs around Ireland. The odd 'club member' manager scattered around is a relative scarcity.

The big managerial merrygoround will continue onwards. Neither Cargin's nor Creggan's managers will be sitting with their feet up next year regardless of whether Cargin or Creggan release them from service at the end of the season.

The bigger question is how to stop it as it is fairly endemic now

Hectic

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Re: Antrim Football Thread
« Reply #16511 on: October 11, 2018, 01:26:30 PM »
Does it need to be stopped? Unfortunately sometimes an outsider is the best way to go. Avoid preconceived ideas about players or indeed from players. Can cut the other way of course where an outsider does not get the same respect but I think this is up to any individual club as to how they wish to play it.

Hectic

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Re: Antrim Football Thread
« Reply #16512 on: October 11, 2018, 01:32:32 PM »
to be fair i was wondering that about Glenravel this year. they won the junior in 2016 and went up for one year and then straight back down again and win it again. whats the point in that? All they did was prove that they are still a strong junior team. Cant see any merit in how that will ever improve a team.

My bro in law lives up there and from what he's told me, they had 5 retirements at the start of the year and 2 in the states. 4 came back to play through the year.

to be fair that can impact into a senior team but thats a problem for the internal structures within a club that the minors arent progressing into the adult set up.

Looking at the Saffron Gael photos from Sunday the majority of that Glenravel squad looks really fresh faced. DR is correct that it is vital to assimilate youth into senior ranks but I suppose it depends how many you are needing to step up. I always think that if you can get 4 ex minors blooded into senior football any given year you should be in a good place. Very rare though that you would get more than one or two max becoming a mainstay of a team within a year.

farset

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Re: Antrim Football Thread
« Reply #16513 on: October 11, 2018, 01:45:13 PM »
St . Enda's  knew that some people would find it strange that they entered the IFC but most people probably dont know that they have never won any adult county football championship at either Junior, Intermediate or Senior grade in their history. They played senior for most of the 90's and noughties before dropping down to intermediate so seem to have set their sights on winning their first title before they consider themselves a proper senior club. If more established clubs like Rossa and the Johnnies can enter and win intermediate grade championships why cant they aspire to that too.
Big favourites for the final but write off Gorts at their peril. In Sean McKenna they have a very astute coach who will have them set up really well.

Because as Hardstation already pointed out, both clubs were playing Division 2 hurling when they entered Intermediate.

Look they are a mid-table Division 1 team with a great future ahead of them and lots of good juvenile teams coming through but let's call it what it is.

I know Sean well enough. He'll have the Gorts set up well and disciplined plus they have some really good players at their disposal. I'll be supporting the underdog in that match.

Kickham csc

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Re: Antrim Football Thread
« Reply #16514 on: October 11, 2018, 02:41:18 PM »
I see that the Derry SFC final is scheduled for the same day - that could affect attendance.

You think the Cargin ones will go to the Derry final instead?  ;)

Both Cargin and Creggan (and both Managers) have the strong backbone of Derry education.  You would probably be surprised at the amount of people disgruntled with the two finals being on the same day
don't be worrying about the managers turning up as they are paid mercenaries - sad to see these big clubs with big memberships and tradition going down the mercenary road

Not too many of the 'Big Clubs' in Antrim that have not used mercenaries in the past few years.  Certainly not an ideal situation but its probably a typical situation in most big clubs around Ireland. The odd 'club member' manager scattered around is a relative scarcity.

The big managerial merrygoround will continue onwards. Neither Cargin's nor Creggan's managers will be sitting with their feet up next year regardless of whether Cargin or Creggan release them from service at the end of the season.

The bigger question is how to stop it as it is fairly endemic now
From a Creggan point of view
1) We are a small club, a club with membership with massive commitment, but a small club none the less.
2) Managers, the club spent the majority of the 70's, 80, 90's in the lower leagues, and the majority of the playing personnel all had that playing experience. The last three internal managers Creggan had, Sean Maguire (intercounty experience), Peadar Totten (intercounty experience), Gerard Dougan (Div 1 and 2 experience). Outside of these guys, the players with intercounty experience either wanted to focus on underage, or had emigrated to foreign lands.
In the late 90's early 00's the club realized we had really good young potential, but didn't have managers with the experience to take us to the next level at senior level
3) The club focused on ensuring we had really good underage coaching structure (3 per team), and looked external for senior management
4) Players who brought the club up into Div 1 and stayed there, and who rep the county at underage senior, are now coaching underage teams within the club. The natural progression will be these lads coaching the senior team in the next 10+ years

Each club has to make decisions on what is best approach for their club to make sure their potential is maximized. Creggan took an approach that was intended to break a cycle of Div 2 status, and propel the club into senior status. On this point alone, the strategy has worked