Author Topic: Joe Brolly  (Read 691052 times)

Bingo

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #840 on: January 08, 2015, 09:55:46 AM »
I think the time has come for County players to be totally withdrawn from clubs whilst they are in the first 26. This is harsh on clubs granted but it would be easier on the player and he has a choice.

This is an extremely dangerous position to go down for a number of reasons. One been that the gap between the successful sides and the cannon fodder will only grow. We already see it in some counties where the best players aren't playing intercounty because they see more benefit in playing with their club i.e. chance of success, no hammerings, half the work etc. This would only happen more.

You'd be faced with a big club and county divide. This mightn't matter in the big urban centres but at grassroot level round the country it would soon become a problem.

There has be a balance somewhere in the middle for everyone.

More and more the GAA at all levels is turning into big business and volunteers will only facilitate this for a time, generally volunteers don't do business.

bannside

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #841 on: January 08, 2015, 09:59:10 AM »
Joe is 100% here. Not too many of the GAA bigwigs will be queueing up to take him on either. It's a mess as it stands and the game is worse off for it.

The fun is fast going out of the game and so too is the enjoyment of playing or watching it.  Wouldn't fancy being a forward at all in today's game.

And for all the bluster, not one meaningful change was implemented to prevent burnout.

There is still a period in the calendar whereby a talented young player could be under pressure to train, play, or if not, "still come along anyway to show your face" with four different teams. County U 21's and seniors, as well as club and university. Crazy altogether, and in all this by far the biggest lose is the player himself who will be either burned out early, tired all the time, or simply get fed up with all the pressure.

Go on Joe. This time the vast majority of GAA followers are behind you.

magpie seanie

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #842 on: January 08, 2015, 10:07:11 AM »
I agree with Brolly here. The intercounty game is destroying the GAA and the great bastions of protecting players are to the forefront of the drive to professionalise the game. The GPA are completely unfit for their stated purpose but many of us realised that their stated purpose was only a cover. It always really been about money with them. Intercounty players might have got less gear and money pre-GPA but I guarantee they enjoyed it an awful lot more. The powers that be in Croke Park also stand indicted for allowing this to happen. They're even worse.

orangeman

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #843 on: January 08, 2015, 10:50:52 AM »
If it was always about the money before then it's now even more so about the £.

AZOffaly

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #844 on: January 08, 2015, 11:04:42 AM »
This is what I was saying on another thread. Even an amateur organisation, and maybe especially an amateur organisation the size of the GAA, requires money, and lots of it, to keep things ticking over and to provide the facilities and support to our counties, clubs and players.

For this, you need a business model, and you need businessmen to implement the business model.

Our problem, to me, seems to be that the raison d'etre for the business model in the first place is being lost, and everything is focussed on maximising and growing the revenue streams with no obvious controls in place to make sure that the money is a means to an end (i.e. to help run the GAA and to support our games) rather than the games becoming a means to growing the business, which appears to be the case at the moment.

We need to recalibrate what the GAA is all about, and cop on to ourselves. An amateur organisation needs enough money to keep it running, and to help with facilities, coaching, expenses etc. That should be a finite, identifiable monetary amount.

We seem to be just aiming to grow and grow, and continue to invest and invest in large scale projects that may not be needed at all. So we spend more and more money, we make more and more money, and then we try to figure out ways to make even more money and grow the balance sheet.

When your focus moves into that sphere, it doesn't take long for the actual games, and the people playing them, to be left behind in the consciousness.


This drive for money doesn't fully explain or address the attitude that has become prevalent in terms of living like a monk in order to be successful, but it is a contributing factor in the way the games are scheduled, and various other CCCC type decisions.

Jinxy

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #845 on: January 08, 2015, 11:08:48 AM »
Why do people think there would there be a significant loss of revenue though?
If you were any use you'd be playing.

Walter Cronc

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #846 on: January 08, 2015, 11:11:48 AM »
Why do people think there would there be a significant loss of revenue though?


I think most people feel the sponsors of the All Ireland championships will cut funding for a shortened season?

AZOffaly

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #847 on: January 08, 2015, 11:15:24 AM »
Why do people think there would there be a significant loss of revenue though?

From what Jinxy?

I'm talking about the general drive behind a lot of current policy and decisions from Croker seems to be driven largely by how it translates to to the revenue streams. I mentioned a few on the other thread.

If you're asking why Brolly's suggestion wouldn't be accepted, I'm not sure that it wouldn't, but some of the revenue considerations would be....

Direct competition with Premiership Soccer and Rugby, which both finish up at the end of May. This competition may impact attendences and will certainly impact on media coverage. Less media coverage = less money.
Shorter championships with less games would mean less gate receipts, and less revenue from TV. (I'm not sure if Brolly is proposing that, but I am :) )
Club only in the height of summer = a huge gap in the TV schedule which was perfect for the GAA. I think the GAA want to increase their profile, not decrease it.



muppet

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #848 on: January 08, 2015, 03:32:14 PM »
This is what I was saying on another thread. Even an amateur organisation, and maybe especially an amateur organisation the size of the GAA, requires money, and lots of it, to keep things ticking over and to provide the facilities and support to our counties, clubs and players.

For this, you need a business model, and you need businessmen to implement the business model.

Our problem, to me, seems to be that the raison d'etre for the business model in the first place is being lost, and everything is focussed on maximising and growing the revenue streams with no obvious controls in place to make sure that the money is a means to an end (i.e. to help run the GAA and to support our games) rather than the games becoming a means to growing the business, which appears to be the case at the moment.

We need to recalibrate what the GAA is all about, and cop on to ourselves. An amateur organisation needs enough money to keep it running, and to help with facilities, coaching, expenses etc. That should be a finite, identifiable monetary amount.

We seem to be just aiming to grow and grow, and continue to invest and invest in large scale projects that may not be needed at all. So we spend more and more money, we make more and more money, and then we try to figure out ways to make even more money and grow the balance sheet.

When your focus moves into that sphere, it doesn't take long for the actual games, and the people playing them, to be left behind in the consciousness.


This drive for money doesn't fully explain or address the attitude that has become prevalent in terms of living like a monk in order to be successful, but it is a contributing factor in the way the games are scheduled, and various other CCCC type decisions.

This sounds a bit like the FF/PD/Green coalition strategy for the property market. That ended well.
MWWSI 2017

rosnarun

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #849 on: January 08, 2015, 04:48:28 PM »
people forget thats it almost an anomaly that the GAA exist in anything like its present form. The great Green  eyed god og soccer with its insaitable desire for cash has to keep growing and growing and take out as many other sports as possible . if it is to keep fundings its players Messi supposed to be offered 500K Sterling a week would keep most counties solvent for the year.
to comete with that The GAA need more meaningful games in better facilities ,
is it possible?  does it mean fewer teams ala rugger with just 4 teams and neverending hype, or do we go the way of basketball here getting smaller and smaller each year.
I think if your not growing your dying
If you make yourself understood, you're always speaking well. Moliere

Bazil Douglas

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #850 on: January 08, 2015, 11:00:32 PM »
I think the time has come for County players to be totally withdrawn from clubs whilst they are in the first 26. This is harsh on clubs granted but it would be easier on the player and he has a choice.
[/quote

You got to remember the GAA is were it  is  because of its voluntary ethos (bar a minority of mercenaries) remove the county player from the parochial  club set up and it wont belong before you dont have the IC player set up.

yellowcard

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #851 on: January 11, 2015, 03:55:51 PM »
Brolly on RTE radio talking about fixtures, overtraining and player welfare. The ball has started rolling on this.

Eamonnca1

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #852 on: January 11, 2015, 08:08:55 PM »
There's no need to choose between player welfare and more revenue. If you abolish the national leagues and play the provincial championships in a round robin format there's a ton of advantages.

  • The integrity, traditions, and local rivalries of the provincial championships are retained.
  • If you shut the back door and go to a straight knockout with no All-Ireland quarter finals, the prestige of the provincial championships is restored beyond question.
  • Abolition of the league means that the championship season (which is the real money generator) is extended but the overall inter-county season is shortened and creates more room in the calendar for the clubs.
  • A round robin provincial championship means that teams get a lot more then two guaranteed games, making them a better deal for sponsors.
  • You have more control over who plays in the first game, so you can open the competition with a bang by bringing two big hitters together.
  • It's a simpler and more understandable format than the current convoluted modified knockout competition that's almost impossible to diagram.

I'd kick New York and London out of the All-Ireland championship. GAA units outside of Ireland should be concentrating on organising competitions in their own respective countries and playing games that they have a chance of actually winning. It's time New York and London had more locally-born players in their ranks and stopped viewing this as entertainment for emigrants, but that's another story.

I'd also abolish those pre-season inter-county competitions. There's no need for them. Ditto for the lower-tier inter-county hurling competitions (Christy Ring, Nickey Rackard etc. cups). If you want to improve the standard in developing counties then do it at club level; that's what the club competitions are for. The standard of the county team will rise with it.

There's not enough joined-up thinking in the GAA.  Not enough "big picture" vision. Too much compartmentalized looking at each competition in isolation and trying to promote each one as an end in itself. Time to look at all the competitions together and assess what their roles are. The inter-county championship is a spectator event that brings in big money and inspires the next generation of players. The club competitions are for representing small communities and honing the skills of the players. The national leagues? WTF is the point of them? What's the point of the O'Byrne Cup and Waterford Crystal Cup and all these other obscure matches for?

It might sound like a slash and burn with a lot of competitions being dropped, but with the unsustainable workload on players and the sinister actions of the GPA looming over everything, something has to give.

LCohen

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #853 on: January 11, 2015, 08:22:04 PM »
There's no need to choose between player welfare and more revenue. If you abolish the national leagues and play the provincial championships in a round robin format there's a ton of advantages.

  • The integrity, traditions, and local rivalries of the provincial championships are retained.
  • If you shut the back door and go to a straight knockout with no All-Ireland quarter finals, the prestige of the provincial championships is restored beyond question.
  • Abolition of the league means that the championship season (which is the real money generator) is extended but the overall inter-county season is shortened and creates more room in the calendar for the clubs.
  • A round robin provincial championship means that teams get a lot more then two guaranteed games, making them a better deal for sponsors.
  • You have more control over who plays in the first game, so you can open the competition with a bang by bringing two big hitters together.
  • It's a simpler and more understandable format than the current convoluted modified knockout competition that's almost impossible to diagram.

I'd kick New York and London out of the All-Ireland championship. GAA units outside of Ireland should be concentrating on organising competitions in their own respective countries and playing games that they have a chance of actually winning. It's time New York and London had more locally-born players in their ranks and stopped viewing this as entertainment for emigrants, but that's another story.

I'd also abolish those pre-season inter-county competitions. There's no need for them. Ditto for the lower-tier inter-county hurling competitions (Christy Ring, Nickey Rackard etc. cups). If you want to improve the standard in developing counties then do it at club level; that's what the club competitions are for. The standard of the county team will rise with it.

There's not enough joined-up thinking in the GAA.  Not enough "big picture" vision. Too much compartmentalized looking at each competition in isolation and trying to promote each one as an end in itself. Time to look at all the competitions together and assess what their roles are. The inter-county championship is a spectator event that brings in big money and inspires the next generation of players. The club competitions are for representing small communities and honing the skills of the players. The national leagues? WTF is the point of them? What's the point of the O'Byrne Cup and Waterford Crystal Cup and all these other obscure matches for?

It might sound like a slash and burn with a lot of competitions being dropped, but with the unsustainable workload on players and the sinister actions of the GPA looming over everything, something has to give.
misses on huge point. For the most part players don't play too much (actually they should play more). They need to train less.

Throw ball

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Re: Joe Brolly
« Reply #854 on: January 11, 2015, 08:51:59 PM »
Agree with your last point LCohen. How many players when they have no Gaelic to play take to soccer or rugby or the like.